Help me diagnose this problem: Router or something else?

[#1]

Sorry for the mega long post but I am hoping someone can let me know what seems to be going on here.

Here is an overview of my home network:

• PlusNet Hub 1 Software version 4.7.5.1.83.8.263
• 2x PCs (wired 100mbps Ethernet)
• 2x NAS (wired 100mbps Ethernel)
• 3x IP cameras (wired 100mpbs Ethernet)
• 3x Amazon Echos (wifi)
• 6x Kasa smart plugs (wifi)
• 1x phone (wifi)
• 1x tablet (wifi)

I have been working from home since lockdown started and my internet connection has been absolutely rock solid. However yesterday I noticed that one of my smart plugs had lost its connection to my router. This happens occasionally so, no biggie. I then had a 4 hour Zoom group chat on my main PC which went flawlessly but immediately after I tried to have a Facebook video chat and found that while I could get the Facebook page up, the video chat was non responsive. I used my phone instead and again this was fine for an hour although the person on the other end said my image was really pixelated..

When I tried to switch off my house lights (smart plugs) using my Echo I found that my bedroom Echo was also now not connected to the internet. Again - this happens quite a lot and is usually temporary.

However, in the morning I found that now none of my Echos were connected to the internet. Also my smart plugs kept losing connection and dropping into "local mode" which means that the signal goes direct form the phone app to the plug over wifi without using the internet. I could monitor the status of all six plugs on the phone app and watch them dropping in and out of local mode.

So much for wireless devices: The behaviour of both my PCs was slightly different: I could get intermittent internet. Facebook usually loaded its home page but then clicking any other content (chat, notifications, etc) results in nothing. Some pages refused to load at all (Amazon user forums was one example) and others would sometimes load and work for a few seconds, then fail to load (YouTube). Behaviour was the same on both my wired PCs and my wireless tablet.

Finally, using the internet on my phone actually locked up the browser until I turned wifi off and used 4G instead.

Looking at the router admin page all appeared normal. I could see all my attached devices and the line had not dropped.

First I did a reboot. This didn't change anything.

Next I unplugged it for a few seconds. Again, no improvement.

Next I called PlusNet and got straight though (amazing!! ) The guy checked my line and then put me on hold and after a few seconds my internet access was seemingly restored. I asked what he had done and he said he had done a "refresh" on my router and that he thought the problem stemmed from the long Zoom chat which had "overloaded" it. To be honest I took that last part with a pinch of salt but no matter as now everything seemed to be working. I was further advised to do a factory reset if the problem came back.

Sure enough everything worked for just long enough to convince us that we could end the call. I checked my Echos - still all offline. Tried rebooting them - no difference. Then the internet connectivity issues on my PC came back until after about ten minutes I was right back where I started.

Next I did a factory reset, and then restored my router settings from a backup file. This made no difference at all.

I called PlusNet back and got straight through again (!) and talked to a different guy. By now it was getting really difficult to try to explain the exact symptoms over the phone and to be honest I think I just confused the guy. He tried to run a check on my line but he could not get the test to run at his end (it wasn't flagging up errors - the test itself wasn't working). He suggested a few things which we quickly discounted and eventually raised a support ticket.

After the call ended I unplugged the router and left it unplugged for ten minutes. No difference.

Then, on a whim I did another factory reset but this time did not restore my router settings from backup before testing out the connection. Bingo! it worked! Internet was back. So then I restored by settings expecting the problem to return but eveything kept working. My Echos came back online, smart plugs, everything. Fixed!!!

...and it stayed fixed for the rest of the day. I had to go out for a few hours (essential, I assure you). When I came back everything looked normal (my house lights switched on automatically using IFTTT when my phone got in range of the router) but the next time I used my kitchen Echo it reported it had no connection. Also two of my smart plugs went into "local mode" at the same time. Both these issues resolved themselves within a couple of minutes but it seemed really odd that everything was working when I walked through the door and then just a few seconds later there was a glitch.

I should point out that throughout all of this the internal LAN comms were fine. For example, my PCs could read my NAS and my security cameras continued recording footage and sending it to my NAS vis FTP.

So....what was / is the problem?

My thoughts are its not my phone line.
It could be some kind of extreme "throttling" of my connection at the PlusNet end.But I mean really extreme. Enough to cripple most websites and make my Echos and smart plugs think I don't have internet at all.
But my best guess is that the router is on its way out. This is the only explanation which to my mind fits all the symptoms and the odd hypothesis that my long Zoom chat had somehow physically stressed the router. Sadly I do not have another one I can try.

Apologies again for the long post. I can't really do a TLDR version without missing out the symptoms and troubleshooting steps.

Any thoughts from the community?

Moderator's note by Dick (Strat): Post released from Automatic Spam Filter.

[#2]

Today's update: Internet access held up all day but I noticed a couple of small glitches were one of my Echos lost connectivity for a few seconds early this morning.

Then about 6:00pm I lost internet access on all devices again. Same symptoms as before: The line did not drop, just I could not get any internet traffic.

Rebooted router - did not fix it.

Factory reset - fixed it (for now).

I will link my open ticket to this thread and keep updating it with more details. Ticket reference is #201162095 

[#3]

Sounds like it could be a DNS problem, although why rebooting the router doesnt fix it but factory reset does is strange.

Anyway, I'm assuming all your devices are set to DHCP  and are using the default DNS  server I.e. the router , is that correct ?

If that the case then set one of the laptops to fixed DNS servers , e.g google or opendns. Then when the problem recurs, if that laptop still has internet then we know that it's a DNS problem.

What router do you have BTW ?

[#4]

Hub one @MisterW - first bullet point in list of devices

Agree it sounds like a DNS issue

[#5]

@dvorak  thanks , must go to specsavers!

Next I did a factory reset, and then restored my router settings from a backup file. This made no difference at all.

I didnt think the Hub one had a backup/restore , must be mistaken...

[#6]

Unless it was changed in a firmware update there was one:

[#7]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I do not know how to check or change the DNS settings for my Echoes or smart plugs, or even my phone (or even if it is possible to change them) but I did check my main PC and that is set to DHCP with nothing entered in the DNS dialoge box so I guess that means it is using the router as a DNS?

I have never had to tinker with this before so if I wanted to use Google's DNS would I just add dns.google.com in both the IPv4 and IPv6 DNS settings, or should I use the IP addresses 8.8.8.8 for v4 and 2001:4860:4860::8888 for v6?

[#8]

You will not be able to change the DNS for the Echo or Smart plugs, that's why I suggested the PC.

What version of Windows is the PC running ?

[#9]

My tablet is Windows 8.1 and both my wired Ethernet PCs are WIndows 7. I would run the experiment on a Windows 7 machine.

So even if this works, it is only troubleshooting I guess, as I cannot change my IOT devices.

Out of interest, if it was a DNS issue, why would it work for several hours and then suddenly fail?

[#10]

Can we all take a step back here and just look at what people, including myself, are having to go through to get a stable and satisfactory wifi facility.

I have had repeated wifi issues, but in particular with Apple products, for almost my entire Plusnet contract which comes to an end in about 4 weeks.

I have numerous speedtest screen shots of speed of 0.2mbs on an iphone 7 and a current ipad then 30 secs later it's say 30mbs and that is in the room where the router is located and please don't tell me its interference because it isn't. Period. One of this attached from about 1 hr ago.

I am reasonably tech savvy but not at the level of some of the comments and references in this thread.

As customers we shouldn't  have to try to self diagnose faults and make important amendments to the hardware settings to just get the service we are paying for. And with, in my opinion, very poor tech support answers eg buy a wifi extender, which is just a ridiculous suggestion you are left thinking why did I bother with this lot.

You don't self diagnose a problem with a car yourself the garage does that so why is this acceptable for wifi issues?

Am I frustrated with Plusnet, hell yes, is their customer service good, as it's supposed to be, hell no.

It's about time Plusnet established a customer service faculty that works for the customer and not the other way round.

The bottom line is I just want a stable reliable wifi signal.

[#11]

Appreciate your candour geoff but mine is not a wifi issue. It is an internet traffic issue which simply affects wifi devices worse than wired devices. Diverting this thread onto a discussion about wifi is going to confuse things for others who migt have some useful input.

[#12]

@Digsy  follow this guide https://support.opendns.com/hc/en-us/articles/228006987-Windows-7-Configuration to set OpenDNS on a Windows 7 PC

Out of interest, if it was a DNS issue, why would it work for several hours and then suddenly fail?

Normally the router maintains a DNS cache. By default DNS requests are sent to the router , which checks its cache and sends on the PlusNet DNS servers if not in its cache. I've seen situations where after some time , a routers stops forwarding DNS requests. However this is usually fixed with a reboot , hence my earlier apprehension.

By setting a PC with the OpenDNS servers we are elimating the router and PlsuNet DNS servers to identify if/where the problem might be.

[#13]

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@geoffb22 wrote:

You don't self diagnose a problem with a car yourself the garage does that so why is this acceptable for wifi issues?

---

And no doubt you pay for it, think that's a bad analogy.

WiFi is very easily interfered with and a bit of self diagnostic can help and might even solve things or at least prove where the issue lies.

Every customer is welcome to supply their own kit as many of us have.

Or you could always come and pay someone to do that for you.

You pay PN for the connection to your house and if you take their router some rudimentary support of that.

[#14]

I'm sorry Dvorak but I completely disagree with most of what you have said.

Can I just say that I never ever go on forums to fall out with contributors but simply to try to get help but I'm afraid your reply has done the opposite. Are you a Plusnet employee? Because your reply sounds like a company line to me.

1) Plusnet are not selling me a connection they are providing me with a service which includes a router which they "strongly advise taking " which by description provides the wifi facility. Therefore, they are responsible for the reasonable operation of the supplied equipment. The speed into the router is excellent, 60+mbs, and always has been but getting wifi  at 0.2 mbs is NOT reasonable.

2) As for buying your own equipment. An Internet Service Provider should provide equipment suitable for the service they are providing. 

3) I rang tech support one weekend about the wifi and during the call he informed that he was a student living in a 1 bed flat and it was obvious he had little or no more knowledge greater than mine. Some help he was. He was the one who suggested I get a wifi extender !!!

As an aside I have a close family member who is a senior member of the QA Department at a major UK ISP and tv streaming company. Without getting into too much detail there is an interoperability problem with Plusnet's wifi. And as for the old wifi interference reason. It's an excuse all/most isp's use when wifi is a problem. In the past I have asked tech support to explain what interferes with the wifi. Every single thing they said was NOT the reason for my issue especially when I am sat next to the router.

Finally, there is no need to respond to my reply as it is obvious we will never agree on this matter but maybe other people reading this might get a feel of how poor the equipment and tech support really is. Unless of course you are a customer who is happy to adjust settings and spend time sorting problems created by the supplier.

[#15]

Sounds to me like your router is going/gone!

In my experience, when i start having to reset/factory reset my router, it only means the router is leaving me!!

my suggestion is to get a new router or get someone to lend you one and try.

There are so many things that can go wrong in an electronic card... that means some things might still work and some others won't.

How long did you have this router for?! Lifetime can be easily less than 5 years.