How to raise a support ticket with Plusnet

[#1]

---

@pureedfruit wrote:.

What's PN's excuse for deteriorating CS ?

My personal theory is that the customer base has grown faster than was anticipated and support staff numbers are having to be increased in proportion.

---

[#2]

Hi @pureedfruit

I'm sorry to hear you feel we're cutting back on CS in order to instead put that cost in to expanding the network. I can assure you this is not the case and we are in fact still hiring more staff, as per the careers page Strat has linked to in his latest post.

In regards to deteriorating CS, I'm not sure this is the case to be honest. While you may see an increase of customers complaining here, and it may very well be correct that there is a higher number of people complaining about various things, this doesn't necessarily translate in to a higher percentage of our customer base complaining given how much our customer base has grown over the past 5 years and as Strat has stated, there will be many customers that are extremely happy with the service or even have a better experience than they expected. But those people don't tend to run to various social media platforms/forums/review sites to make that known, someone is much more likely to complain following a bad experience than a good experience, understandably.

Reducing the ticket system a fair few years ago was not a move to reduce ways in which someone can complain (The complaint channel is still very much there and detailed on our complaints code of practice on how to raise a complaint ticket via the help assistant/ticket system)

I believe the ticket system was reduced as many people expected this to be more of an instant response support channel, which the added channel (Around the same time the ticket system was reduced) of a live chat system would be more suited to.

Is there something service specific that you're unhappy with that we may be able to help you with? While I won't be able to bring back the ticket system that was reduced a few years back, we're more than happy to help with the queries you would have previously asked via the ticket system.

[#3]

Harry

I didn't say or suggest that "feel we're cutting back on CS in order to instead put that cost in to expanding the network" merely commented that was what had happened at VM.

Re " there will be many customers that are extremely happy with the service or even have a better experience than they expected", and so there should be. That was the promise - "we'll do you proud".But "many" is not enough, it should be all.

You wish to argue, as does Strat, that the increase in complaints is due to an increase in customers, that it may be an increase in absolute terms, but not in percentage terms. Frankly that would carry a lot more conviction if PN published statistics to support that claim. I suspect that the very reason it does not is that it would all to easily become a stick to beat PN with.

However you look at it, it is difficult to avoid the conclusion that PN is not on top of the problem. Strat points to the fact that PN is now recruiting more CS staff to cope with the extra customers, thus evidencing my point. It follows like night follows day, that if you do promotions to recruit more customers that you will rapidly need extra CS staff. They should have been recruited in parallel. It is unfair both on customers, and on existing CS, staff not to do that.

[#4]

---

@pureedfruit wrote:

Re " there will be many customers that are extremely happy with the service or even have a better experience than they expected", and so there should be. That was the promise - "we'll do you proud".But "many" is not enough, it should be all.

Whilst absolutely nobody is suggesting that we're there yet, service levels are improving. I'd love us to be in a position where all of our customers where happy and I'll entertain any reasonable idea to help us get there, but as far as I know there isn't a large business in the world where every single customer of theirs is happy.  People become unhappy for all sorts of reason, often out of our control. 

We often get complaints about the speed of peoples broadband for example, and unless there is a fault on the line we're powerless to fix it.

The speed you can achieve is not limited as per our Unlimited Broadband adverts but it is subject to the laws of physics and as such the speed is determined by factors such as (and this list isn't exhaustive) 

• Length of line
• Distance to the exchange
• Quality of the line
• Quality of the customers internal wiring
• Access technology availble in your area.

These are all things that because of how the UK broadband market works, we have no control over, and yet customers are (often rightly) disappointed about.

You wish to argue, as does Strat, that the increase in complaints is due to an increase in customers, that it may be an increase in absolute terms, but not in percentage terms.

Frankly that would carry a lot more conviction if PN published statistics to support that claim. I suspect that the very reason it does not is that it would all to easily become a stick to beat PN with.

Lucky those numbers are available here, we were joint second worst for complaints as a percentage of customers. Thats really not a good place to be. 

Our most common complaint cause is wait times, as such that's where we're focusing our resources. You may have seen the job vacancies posted on our careers page but in case you didn't we're looking to significantly increase our support staff. 

As we point out here our average wait time across all departments was 343 seconds, almost 6 minutes. That's not good enough,the last quarter we got it down to 317 seconds, a little over 5 minutes. It's still not good enough but it is coming down and we expect it to be a slow journey as we take on, and train new staff. Even when they're trained and on the phones it will take a while for them to be as efficient as our more tenured staff. 

One months data could be a fluke or statistical anomaly so lets look at the last year.

• July-Sept 2017 703 seconds
• Oct-Dec 2017 608 seconds
•  Jan-Mar 2018 343 seconds
• Apr-Jun 2019 317 seconds

However you look at it, it is difficult to avoid the conclusion that PN is not on top of the problem. Strat points to the fact that PN is now recruiting more CS staff to cope with the extra customers, thus evidencing my point. It follows like night follows day, that if you do promotions to recruit more customers that you will rapidly need extra CS staff. They should have been recruited in parallel. It is unfair both on customers, and on existing CS, staff not to do that.

You'll find absolutely no argument from me there, whilst we have been recruiting constantly we've obviously incorrectly foretasted demand. 

We do though have a very difficult balancing act when it comes to staff numbers. Frankly we're a value provider, that doesn't mean we're the cheapest but it does mean that we have to offer competitive pricing whilst maintaining quality service, we've taken the decision to answer 100% of our calls in the UK and that's obviously a little pricier than some of the options our competitors have chosen but the feedback we do keep getting is that whilst there are not enough of them, the service they provide is the best in the industry and we're very proud of them.  

If we recruit too many staff prices will obviously have to rise to pay for them and so we need enough staff but not too many, we obviously got that wrong.

---

[#5]

Jono H

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.

The OFGEM statistics you link to are very interesting. I think most of the time PN do better than joint second, by beating BT most of the time. However that leads on to a very interesting question, namely that "Given that everyone in that comparison, apart from Virgin Media (VM), is running on the same broadband network created and managed by BT, how come there is such a wide disparity in the complaints per 1000 customers ? Specifically why is Sky so good and BT so bad (4x as many complaints as Sky) ? It simply does not make sense. I begin to wonder whether Sky has found some clever way of massaging the figures.

Another interesting question is how did EE get from second to bottom (34/1000) in Q 1 2016 to second from top (12/1000) by Q4 2017. And if EE can do it, why can't PN ? And last but not least, where are the figures for 2018 ?

I also looked at the recruitment ads that you and Strat have pointed me to. The thing that struck me most is that a "Customer Solutions Adviser" , presumably the people we are talking about, can earn up to 14% on top of their basic salary from OTE. So what targets would they be? My guess is dealing with more customers than average i.e. dealing with them more quickly, thus leading credence to my belief that PN CS staff seem to be more concerned to "get you off their back" rather than sending the customer away happy.

I take your points about all the things that can theoretically reduce ones broadband speed which are outside PNs control. like

• Length of line
• Distance to the exchange
• Quality of the line
• Quality of the customers internal wiring
• Access technology available in your area

BUT they don't change between when PN/BT make their initial test of the line and as a result state a minimum guaranteed speed. Strat suggests that the only guarantee that is being made is of the speed delivered into the modem, not the speed out of the User side. Apart from being totally disingenuous on PNs part to state that without any caveat at the time of offering the guarantee, I frankly do not believe that your modem then looses between 7 & 13% of that speed. Certainly if I unplug the link in to by Devolo network, which I prefer to using Wi-Fi, it makes no difference.

Anyway good luck with your recruitment and improving PN CS service level. I for my part shall continue to try hard not to make use of PN CS just as long as my broadband continues to function at its present level, albeit somewhat less than that "guaranteed" 

[#6]

---

@HarryB wrote:

I believe the ticket system was reduced as many people expected this to be more of an instant response support channel...

No, no, no.

The whole point about raising tickets was that it was ideal for non urgent queries without waiting on the phone or queuing for Chat.  

[#7]

Hi @pureedfruit 

Thanks for the reply, I can sit and talk about ways to make things better all day  

---

@pureedfruit wrote:

The OFGEM statistics you link to are very interesting. I think most of the time PN do better than joint second, by beating BT most of the time.

It's Ofcom but it's an easy mistake to make We do really well in a lot of categories, and each quarter internally we digest and discuss them at all levels of the business and see what action needs to be taken to address the failings.

However that leads on to a very interesting question, namely that "Given that everyone in that comparison, apart from Virgin Media (VM), is running on the same broadband network created and managed by BT, how come there is such a wide disparity in the complaints per 1000 customers ? Specifically why is Sky so good and BT so bad (4x as many complaints as Sky) ? It simply does not make sense. 

Complaints can also be about internal procedures, for example one of our biggest complaints is wait times, the state of the network does little to impact that. 

Another interesting question is how did EE get from second to bottom (34/1000) in Q 1 2016 to second from top (12/1000) by Q4 2017. And if EE can do it, why can't PN ? And last but not least, where are the figures for 2018 ?

That fascinates me too, I had the pleasure of spending some time with them whilst those changes were being introduced. They did a fantastic job. I'm hoping our reforms have similar success.

I also looked at the recruitment ads that you and Strat have pointed me to. The thing that struck me most is that a "Customer Solutions Adviser" , presumably the people we are talking about, can earn up to 14% on top of their basic salary from OTE. So what targets would they be? My guess is dealing with more customers than average i.e. dealing with them more quickly, thus leading credence to my belief that PN CS staff seem to be more concerned to "get you off their back" rather than sending the customer away happy.

Nope, our advisers earn their bonuses through regular attendance and their quarterly performance review score, that scores made up of how the employee lives our values and the service we provide. Our in call metrics are things like repeat calls, we'd rather the agent spent 2 hours with you today than you needing to call back in (it's not always avoidable though) and we seldom have targets that include the number of customers spoken to in a day as we've found that they don't lead to a good customer, or staff experience as the people we're aiming to employ want to fix your issues first time.

BUT they don't change between when PN/BT make their initial test of the line and as a result state a minimum guaranteed speed

The speed test can't test the quality of the internal wiring in your home, and if there is no line it has to use other lines around it as a base line. this isn't always super accurate unfortunately. 

 Strat suggests that the only guarantee that is being made is of the speed delivered into the modem,

He's right, we really can't guarantee what speed you get over Wi-Fi 3 rooms away from your router for example and you wouldn't believe how often the problems due to internal wiring issues, something that's the customers responsibility. We're responsible for the speed to the test socket in the premises and no further. 

Anyway good luck with your recruitment and improving PN CS service level. I for my part shall continue to try hard not to make use of PN CS just as long as my broadband continues to function at its present level, albeit somewhat less than that "guaranteed" 

If you're getting below the guaranteed line speed I'd be happy to help take a look, sometimes though as much as I hate to say it we're not able to achieve that speed and cancellation is the only way to resolve  

---

[#8 · Accepted solution]

JonoH

Thank you for your kind offer but I do not think that achieving the "Guaranteed" 64Mbps will make a radical difference to my broadband experience compared to the 54-58 Mbps that I am actually getting. I have tried disconnecting my Devolo network and juggling the W-Fi settings in the modem as suggested by your colleague which has had no significant effect, so I will take a rain check on your offer.

What I would like to see is less disingenuity.

So instead of "We estimate your broadband speed should be between 71Mbps and 80Mbps and your minimum guaranteed access line speed is 64.199Mbps" how about ""We estimate your broadband speed as delivered to your modems should be between 71Mbps and 80Mbps. What comes out the User side could be significantly less  due to circumstances outside our control, so suggest you expect up to 10% less i.e 64-72 Mbps on a wired connection. If you are connecting via Wi-Fi, particularly if you are some distance away, it may be considerably less."

[#9]

Thanks to anyone who understood this post in the context that it was originally intended - to highlight the fact that PN trade on the strength of their customer services, but that sometimes the provisions of customer services are woefully inadequate. I know that for the majority of customers, for the majority of issues, what is in place is fine, but I've had PN internet for over 8 months now and getting anywhere with the problems has been a huge uphill struggle. 

I still daren't connect a phone to the socket, given that this seems to cause problems. The speed of the line has never approached the "minimum guaranteed" speed. I literally spent days and days trying to get this looked at, and sadly, I just had to give up and accept that I'm never going to get the internet service I'm paying for, or the customer service that was advertised.

Unfortunately, I've just had to accept that this is the case. And as per my original post, I was lied to - I was explicitly told an engineer had been scheduled, but it later transpired that only a request for an engineer had been submitted. As timings of visits are quite critical for most people who can't take time off work to wait around on multiple days, this was really distressing.

[#10]

Hi @angryrichard 

Without reopening too many previous discussions we have had - I would just like to say that the the speed issue which you are still expressing dissatisfaction over is (most likely) the same issue which we initially attempted to book and engineer to rectify for you. In the multiple messages which have been shared between our staff members and yourself, you have, on more than one occasion, refused to provide us with a time which would be acceptable to arrange this to be implemented. 

     >  I was explicitly told an engineer had been scheduled, but it later transpired that only a request for an engineer had been submitted. 

I am not able to find any such working on any of the tickets which have been placed on your account. 

We have made you aware that an engineer visit needs to be completed and asked you to provide a time slot for this. Whilst I understand that this may often be difficult due to the timeframes which our supplier provides for these visits, and the nature of most peoples working week - I'm afraid that if we are asked to gather this information from you by our supplier, we are unable to book any form of engineer visit until we can relay these details back to them.

Having looked through the previous tickets on your account I can see that at least one of these was closed by yourself via your Member Centre, whilst at least one other was auto-closed due to inactivity. This only happens when we have not had a reply from you on the specific ticket thread for 14 days. If a ticket closes, it no longer populates in our ticket system and therefore will not be able to be worked by agents scheduled to this workflow.

Having checked your speeds today, it is clear to see that you are still falling short of your Minimum Guaranteed Access Line Speed, and our tests are still not showing any obvious reason as to why this is happening. Therefore I am afraid, to investigate this further, we would still require an engineer to be booked. 

It does not necessarily need to be yourself who is present at the property to allow the engineer access, anybody over the age of 18 will suffice for this. 

Should you wish us to progress with this issue please do let us know. 

Kind Regards 

[#11]

Hi.

The original multiple issues for which this topic was originally created were not to do with the speed.

As previously stated in those tickets, I will have to book an engineer if there's ever a suitable opportunity. Unfortunately, if it were as simple as having anyone over the age of 18 available, this could have been sorted a long time ago.

Sadly, due to PN's policy of not activating services until an engineer marks the installation as complete, the installing engineer was unable to verify the performance, and there has not been a suitable opportunity to get this fixed since. 

However, it was extremely obvious at the time of installation there was a problem. Plugging in a phone caused problems from the moment of installation.

I'm not here to retread old ground, and I've expressed in those tickets that should the opportunity ever arise to get an engineer back to finally fix this, I'll deal with it at that point. 

I am very grateful for you reviewing the old tickets, which was more than I could have expected. I'm not going to reopen any until such a time as is suitable. It does seem that PN was going through a particularly dark time with regard to customer support when I joined, and I am happy to see that service seems to some extent to have improved in the interim since I allowed those tickets to lapse.

[#12]

“Sadly, due to PN's policy of not activating services until an engineer marks the installation as complete, the installing engineer was unable to verify the performance,

At that fundamental level the BTOR engineer does not need Plusnet to activate the ACCOUNT to verify the performance of the line. Line synch tests - with and without the phone - can be performed without establishing PPP sessions which is what account activation facilitates.

BT Wholesale speed tests can be run using the BTw speed test PPP credentials.

If it’s the case that connecting a phone impacts the broadband performance then there’s something fundamental ling before your connection touches any bit of Plusnet space.

[#13]

---

@JonoH wrote:

Lucky those numbers are available here, we were joint second worst for complaints as a percentage of customers. Thats really not a good place to be. 

Our most common complaint cause is wait times, as such that's where we're focusing our resources. You may have seen the job vacancies posted on our careers page but in case you didn't we're looking to significantly increase our support staff. 

As we point out here our average wait time across all departments was 343 seconds, almost 6 minutes. That's not good enough,the last quarter we got it down to 317 seconds, a little over 5 minutes. It's still not good enough but it is coming down and we expect it to be a slow journey as we take on, and train new staff. Even when they're trained and on the phones it will take a while for them to be as efficient as our more tenured staff. 

...

---

Wait times today (it's a Friday afternoon) 20 min on the phones, webchat unavailable.

How's that improvement programme going?

[#14]

Today's wait time is over 30 minutes, I was dropped from the queue once, chat service unavailable.  

The agent I eventually spoke with was unable to action my request (not to have my full name shown to anyone who does an IP address search!), and asked me to raise a ticket. 

I couldn't find a way to do that on the site, and he couldn't tell me how to do so, he said because he doesn't have access to the system.   

He told me to reply to any plusnet message, asking the recipient to redirect my email. 

I did, and got a auto-response a few minutes later, telling me the Plusnet 'prefers' me to raise a ticket.

I went back to the site and looked at the forums and there doesn't seem to be any way to do  it, which is really disappointing.

I've some experience of 30 minute plus queues and similar problems to AngryRichard going back to 2012, and I no longer believe the reasons given (unusual traffic, training programmes for staff, changes in staff etc) can be true, or that the people stating them believe them. If they were, then there has been time enough to address them - this is fairly obviously a strategic management choice about service rationing.

Thinking about it, for £40 a month for broadband and phone I can probably get better service elsewhere, and reading Richard's initial message and sadly familiar responses from Plusnet personnel, I think that may be my project for this afternoon.

[#15]

Superuser escalation

This topic has been escalated by one of the Superusers; please allow time for Plusnet to respond before commenting further.

Escalation does not imply progressing this matter will be given priority, nor that a different outcome will result.

Reason for escalation:  Review response