FTTP > Hub Two > DNS - Internet ‘does’ every night

[#1]

Morning all,

My set up is: FTTP > Hub Two > MESH.

Hub Two has WiFi disabled.

DNS is set to AdGuard Public DNS

Mesh reboots itself each night at 4am.

For the second morning in a row, we’ve awoken to no Internet.

Yesterday, I just needed to set DNS back to ‘automatic’ on the Hub 2 and then back to ‘manual’ for it to work again.

This morning I would do the same except my PC has decided to die and I have no devices with an Ethernet cable.

Has anyone got any ideas as to why the DNS being changed would mean that the internet dies each night/morning?

I assume DNS is the issue because that is the solution - but I could be wrong?

Any ideas?

[#2]

Moderator's note:
Full quote of preceding post removed as per Forum rules.

Just to add: I've had to reset the Hub Two in order for WiFi to turn back on to allow me to log into the admin area via WiFi, and I've been able to set the DNs abck to "Auto" and then back to "Manual" (with AdGuard DNS) again. And the internet is now back on.

I'm going to presume that ither the issue is when the MESH reboots itself overnight, this somehow kills off the internet via DNS. This doesn't seem plausiable because it's just MESH; it's just a set of ACcess Points and where the 'internet' goes after the HUb Two shouldn't affect the Hub two at all - surely?

[#3]

@mattsando 

Which Mesh system are you using (Make and Model)?

Does the mesh have a built in router? If yes then you can dispense with the Hub two and connect it (the mesh router) WAN port directly to the FTTP ONT.

You would configure the WAN port of the mesh router to use PPPoE and uses the broadband username youraccountname@plusdsl.net with the password being the one used for the members centre.

BTW, From Forum rules

• You should not quote a full post unless; (i)It’s not the post immediately prior to your reply or (ii)Your post is the first on a new page

[#4]

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@Dan_the_Van wrote:

@mattsando 

Which Mesh system are you using (Make and Model)?

Does the mesh have a built in router? If yes then you can dispense with the Hub two and connect it (the mesh router) WAN port directly to the FTTP ONT.

You would configure the WAN port of the mesh router to use PPPoE and uses the broadband username youraccountname@plusdsl.net with the password being the one used for the members centre.

Hi @Dan_the_Van - thanks for replying

It's a Tenda Nova MW5.

I did used to use the Mesh main node as the router (when I was using ADSL/FTTC) but I was never quite happy doing that because it is App-only. There is no web-interface/GUI. If there were ever any issues then I couldn't stick an ethernet cable in and navigate to an IP to access it - like you can with a 'normal' router. However, the Mesh ahs been faultless. I've never had a single issue with it.

Secondly, I use the ethernet ports on the Hub Two for my TV, and media PC

Thirdly, I didn't know that the FTTP ONT (the "inside" box - am I right?) was a modem - is it a modem? Do FTTP have a modem?

I think that I will have to do that if this issue keeps happening every day. I can't be bothered switching DNS to Auto and then back to Manual every morning when the kids wake me up to complain!

What I've done, for now, is disable the overnight "maintenance" setting on the Mesh - it will no longer reboot each morning at 0400. I'll see if that solves it.

It's very odd if that fixes it though if it indeed does.

I'm also thinking that overnight could be the DHCP renewals? I don't know what time exactly the internet connections dies though, and I don't fancy sitting up all night refreshing a page of the internet to find out! 

Could the DHCP renewals take place at the same time as the Mesh reboots - 0400? There's then some sort of issue because the clients are all renewing but suddenly, because the Mesh turns off, they lose their connections?

[#5]

The key bit of info that would help here is knowing how you have the mesh kit configured (and the model number etc. as @Dan_the_Van has requested).

The custom DNS setting on the Hub Two assigns the DNS server addresses as part of the DHCP lease. The hub issuing IPs/DNS to your devices should have no bearing on whether or not the mesh kit is being rebooted. There are a couple of scenarios that I could see causing problems though: -

1. The mesh kit is acting as a router, rather than a plain access point, and it has it's own DHCP server which you have not disabled. When it reboots, it's disconnecting all of your wireless devices and then when it comes back up, the devices are getting an IP allocation from the mesh kit instead of the Plusnet hub. This allocation likely has the wrong gateway address etc. so Internet routing is broken. You can probably work out if this is happening by running 'ipconfig /all' from a Windows command line from an affected devices when the problem is present. Look for the gateway, IP and DNS server addresses assigned to your wireless adapter.

2. The mesh kit is connected to the Plusnet hub via its WAN port, rather than a LAN port. It is configured to obtain a dynamic IP from the Hub Two. Something about the Hub Two also issuing a public DNS server address as part of this process is confusing/misconfiguring the mesh unit. There might be a different method of configuring the mesh kit to minimise the potential for something like this to happen.

Could be something else happening of course, but those are two thoughts that immediately spring to mind.

[#6]

Moderator's note:
Full quote of preceding post removed as per Forum rules.

Thanks @bobpullen for replying!

It is a Tenda Nova MW5

The DHCP on the Mesh is definitely disabled from the config screens (whether it is doing it in the background I dunno! I've been in IT long enough to know that what you see isn't always what you get). I have the Mesh in "Bridge" mode which essentially disables all configuration except setting the SSID and PW.

My set-up is this:

FTTP > ONT > Hub Two's WAN port

Hub Two WiFi is disabled (re-enabled today because my Media PC's RAM has died so I'm waiting for a new stick and I don't have any other ethernet-port'd devices to connect to the router!)

Hub Two has 4 ethernet ports:

WAN, 1, 2, 3

WAN is occupied by the ONT eth

1 goes to the Mesh main node

2 goes to the TV

3 goes to the media PC

Mesh main node has 2 ethernet ports.

1 is from the Hub Two

2 goes to a switch in the network cupboard

That Switch then goes off across the house to games consoles and TVs, etc...

1) The reason that I don't think that can be the issue is because all the wired devices also lose connection - whether they are before/after Mesh > Switch:

• The TV and Media PC are connected directly to Hub Two and lost connection.
• My work PC, all TVs and games consoles are connected by cable to the switch (so after the Hub Two > Mesh) and they lost connection. All the other TVs and consoles can not connect to the internet when it goes down.

2) I am going to connect the Mesh directly to the ONT tonight after work and see if the internet goes down. I'd rather not put everything on the Mesh because, as I mentioned, there's no web-GUI - it's all app so if the app won't connect to the Mesh I can't configure it. I will keep the Hub two handy just in case. However... In the 5 years I've had the Mesh, it hasn't let me down once. It's been remarkably reliable.

[#7]

@mattsando 

Are you saying the devices connected directly to the Hub also suffer the issue?

A view of the Hub two event log might shine a light on what's happening. The event log on the Hub two location

>Home >Advanced settings >Technical log >Event log - select export . This exports a CSV file to the download folder. It can be attached using the paper clip below the reply window.

** Maybe leave the Hub two wireless enabled for now as a Hub reset clears the event log **

The ONT can be seen as a Fibre modem, if the Tenda mesh has a PPPoE setting for a VLAN that can be set to disabled.

[#8]

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@Dan_the_Van wrote:

@mattsando 

Are you saying the devices connected directly to the Hub also suffer the issue?

A view of the Hub two event log might shine a light on what's happening. The event log on the Hub two location

>Home >Advanced settings >Technical log >Event log - select export . This exports a CSV file to the download folder. It can be attached using the paper clip below the reply window.

** Maybe leave the Hub two wireless enabled for now as a Hub reset clears the event log **

Yes, devices connected directly to the Hub also suffer the issue:

"

The reason that I don't think that can be the issue is because all the wired devices also lose connection - whether they are before/after Mesh > Switch:

The TV and Media PC are connected directly to Hub Two and lost connection.
My work PC, all TVs and games consoles are connected by cable to the switch (so after the Hub Two > Mesh) and they lost connection. All the other TVs and consoles can not connect to the internet when it goes down.

"

Event Log... D'oh!  I had to factory reset the router this morning so that the WiFi would be re-enabled. This was because my Media PC's RAM died yesterday and I have noth else with an ethernet port that could log into the router (since sorted - I can use my Work PC - I thought that the Work PC would not connect to the Hub Two via web-GUI but it actually will)

Time and date Message
06:36:50, 13 Jun.
Reset button pressed - full factory reset

However, if it happens again tonight/tomorrow moring, I can get the Event Log and have a look.

[#9]

@mattsando 

How are you setting up the IP Addresses on your network, is everything including the mesh units all using DHCP server on the Hub two or some manually using network properties?

EDIT: I would expect the DHCP server to recognise an IP Address is already used

Are you using the default 192.168.1.0/24 range or something else?

[#10]

Moderator's note:
Full quote of preceding post removed as per Forum rules.

Yes, all IPs and DHCP is managed by the Hub Two. There is nothing set manually

Yes, I'm using the default range. The only thing I have changed in the Hub Two settings is: DNS server to Manual and set them to Adguard DNS Public IPs and I have chnaged the SSID and SSID's pw.

For now, I have set my Mesh to be the router via PPPOE because I can't wire directly into the Hub Two until I get a new stick of RAM.

But I will look at re-visiting this issue when I get that installed into my Media PC (which lives next to the Hub Two - so it's handy for the web-GUI)

[#11]

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@Dan_the_Van wrote:

@mattsando 

How are you setting up the IP Addresses on your network, is everything including the mesh units all using DHCP server on the Hub two or some manually using network properties?

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FYI, I also had turned off WiFi (but turned it back on in order to access the Hub Two and turn DNS to "Automatic" and then back to "Manual"

[#12]

Even with the wired device observation, I think there's still merit in seeing how the device network adapters are configured when in the error state: -

You can probably work out if this is happening by running 'ipconfig /all' from a Windows command line from an affected devices when the problem is present.

Also: -

I have the Mesh in "Bridge" mode...

Not sure if this is information you can depend on but there's a very questionable account here of what those Tenda devices do with IP assignments when they're in bridge mode and lose contact with the external DHCP server 🤔

[#13]

@bobpullen 

Interesting link about the Tenda mesh DHCP, TP-Link have a setting for Automatic DHCP which does much the same, I turned that feature off as it caused complications with IP Addressing during network failures!

@mattsando 

I may be misunderstanding what you are saying, but provided all devices are on the same network range it should not be necessary to turn the Hub WiFi ON or connect a PC directly connected to the Hub, any device should be able to browse to http://192.168.1.254 

There does not need to be an active internet connection

[#14]

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@Dan_the_Van wrote:

@mattsando 

I may be misunderstanding what you are saying, but provided all devices are on the same network range it should not be necessary to turn the Hub WiFi ON or connect a PC directly connected to the Hub, any device should be able to browse to http://192.168.1.254 

There does not need to be an active internet connection

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It's just the additonal layer of complexitiy that was caused by my PC dying on the same day as my internet connection dying. My work laptop is the only other device in the house with an ethernet port, and that works in such a way that it wouldn't connect to a local IP - but I got a colleague with admin to enable it for me.

[#15]

I'm at a loss.

I've been with PN for years and years with FTTC and recently switched to FTTP and had nothing but issues.

PN support haven't helped.

I have, this afternoon:

• returned the Hub Two to factory settings.
  • I have changed the SSID (changed to xyz2) and PW.
  • I have disabled 5ghz
  • I've done this so that I can connect to the Router by WiFi to check if the issue is the Mesh or the general incoming internet
• I have a Tenda Nova Mesh system, with an SSID of xyz
  • Mesh is now set to Bridge Mode
• I have a TVs, PCs, laptops, consoles, etc. all connected with wired internet where possible
  • Wired devices are as affected as wireless ones

But the internet is very up and down. It started around 1600 and is ongoing. It can be up for 1 minute and down for 6 - it's just awful. Asd they say: the only thing worse than no iinternet, is a little internet.

When I can connect, I get my 150 meg, but it then goes down for 5 minutes before coming back up.

I've checked the Zen status page for 01246 and there'snothing for today: https://status.zen.co.uk/broadband/

Attached an event log.

Any ideas?

Any help appreciated.

Ta!