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Retaining Phone Number

Superuser
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

@MisterW wrote:

This means that the exchange is not coming under the address or postcode where we are trying to provide the number, and the e-mail I've sent to the relevant team should fix that

Now that makes a bit more sense. I can see how maybe BTw/OR's database doesn't contain the address if it's an LLU line.

Telephone network routing is a complicated (and from the outside, a convoluted) process.  So whilst the numbering scheme looks the same (for most locations) the geographical location of the LLU exchange and the equivalent BT exchange may well be many miles apart.  So the overlap of postcodes served by the LLU exchange may well be different from those served by the BT exchange.   My guess is that this is where the 'address' problem lies. 

Anyway, if BTw/OR are saying that they will take up to 60 days to amend the database then surely they are not complying with GC18 porting obligations.

This is true!

RealAleMadrid
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

I don't think there is any such thing as an LLU exchange that you mention, the phone line from a house goes to the BT exchange which may or may not have LLU equipment in it. It is here that the LLU broadband and phone circuits are split from the BT equipment, I'm pretty sure that a phone line that uses an LLU supplier doesn't go to a different exchange but I may be wrong.Huh

Plusnet Help Team
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

However it seems from the above answer that it is really the address rather than the number that isn't in the database.

Apologies that I didn't explain it very well initially.

 

I'm pretty sure that a phone line that uses an LLU supplier doesn't go to a different exchange but I may be wrong.

Yeah I think you're right. LLU providers would just have a presence in the exchange, i.e. their own equip in there.

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 Anoush Mortazavi
 Plusnet Help Team
Superuser
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

@Abz85,

As I read it, GC18 is very clear - the owning (donor) provider MUST make every effort to facilitate the port of a subscriber's EXISTING number to the new provider WITHIN ONE BUSINESS DAY.  Therefore that must imply that BTOR SHOULD have a proficient means to import LLU numbers without the apparent fuss and delays being reported here.

If this number port does not happen quickly, you might care to report the difficulty to Ofcom, stating that somewhere between the LLU provider and BTOR, there seems to be obstacles, not compliant with GC18, which are / have inhibited the port of your existing phone number from the losing supplier to the gaining supplier.

198kHz
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Re: Retaining Phone Number


@RealAleMadrid wrote:

I don't think there is any such thing as an LLU exchange that you mention, the phone line from a house goes to the BT exchange which may or may not have LLU equipment in it. It is here that the LLU broadband and phone circuits are split from the BT equipment, I'm pretty sure that a phone line that uses an LLU supplier doesn't go to a different exchange but I may be wrong.Huh


You're spot on.

It may be 19 years since I left BT employment, but if any new bricks & mortar comms premises had sprung up I'm sure I would have heard about it.

@Gandalf wrote:

...the exchange is not coming under the address or postcode where we are trying to provide the number...

It's therefore purely a paper exercise to correct the records.

Edit: Just to clarify - LLU means Local Loop Unbundling. The local loop still terminates in the same exchange! There is no physical external change.

 

To err is human, but to really foul things up requires a computer.
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Perhaps there has been a typo with the phone number - certainly something is not right when the OP says this was originally provided by BT. Not on here as its a public forum, but could @Abz85 confirm the number to @Gandalf by PM.

 Also perhaps share all but the last three digits on here so that it can been looked up on the various exchange checker?

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Plusnet Staff
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

I already know the number, well not off by heart but I can find it via their account.
When I’m back in the office next week I’ll do a bit more digging for answers.
From when I joined the Plusnet Help Team in May 2017 my main Community account is @Gandalf.
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 Anoush Mortazavi
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Abz85
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Iv contacted ofcom regarding it. They weren’t exactly that helpful either. In not so many words they basically said “maybe you could just look for another service provider who is also using a LLU” errrrm how exactly am i meant to know that? That was exactly my point to them. Should telephone providers be more open about how the process works, use laymen terms so consumers are aware beforhand that it may be more difficult to retain certain numbers? Overall ofcom just said the gaining provider must make all necessary steps to retain the number, there are set guidelines and processes in place that should allow them to do that. However there is no 100% garuantee it would work. However they did mention if i was told it was possible at the time of order and my number was loss i could take up a complaint with the odbusman who would look into the matter. Iv decided to cancel my order anyway. I just couldnt risk loosing my number nore could i wait 60+ days just to find out if it was possible. Its all good and well ofcom saying “numbers have to be released and cant be held by anyone provider” but in reality the system of LLU’s is making it harder to retain. Its not 100% certain a number can be retained. Its upto the gaining provider to do so. Just feels like consumers are left at limbo as there is no tranparency as to whos actually responsible?
Superuser
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

I fear that the Ofcom person you spoke with was somewhat misinformed.  The present owning provider has to release the number to facilitate porting.  In this case, the gaining provider can only do what BTOR facilitate.

Essentially there are two LLU providers - Talk Talk and Sky.  If the present owner has shown issues with releasing the number there is some possibility that switching to the other LLU provider (who use their own SEPERATE) equipment might not result in any different outcome.

The requirements of CG18 are very clear and Ofcom SHOULD be enforcing THEIR rules here.  You might wish to call back another day and see if you get a more helpful response.  Remember that Ofcom will have a call centre and like any call centre some agents are better than others!

Abz85
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Number was released. The issue is the fact my number is on an LLU equipment owned by TT not on BT openreach. I asked the ofcom agent, from my understanding, LLU’s were in place to allow more providers to offer services and make the telecoms market more competitive, in doing so the telecons companies have put consumers at a disadvantage when it comes to switching, because they cant give a 100% assurance about number retention? How was that fair? Consumers dont have any idea about whos equipment is supplying what, far as we know all telephone line exchanges are owned by BT? She then just goes thats correct, however there are set process in place and guildlinrs in place for companies to follow when switches are made. They can only look into complaints after something has gone wrong. Errrm whats the point then if the most important part of a switch over for most customers is retaining their number. Each provider keeps passing the buck.
Abz85
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Soo i cancelled my order with plusnet, as they were unable to retain my number or go live on orginal go live date. They sent me email saying my old service wpuld resume with talk talk. However now iv been disconnected by talk talk oy line and they are saying my number is now lost? If i resign up with plusnet can you try renumber services on my old number as my orginal number has now been sent back to BT wearhouse. Member of you team said it should still be active to my property for upto 3months? This is just soo annoying. Talk talk saying cancellation from plusnet came to late.
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

I’m really sorry to hear this. TalkTalk should have a means of importing a ceased number from another rangeholder. In similar instances, we’d send an e-mail to the number porting team within Openreach to raise what’s called a “Ceased In Error” request though I’m unsure of TalkTalk’s processes. Might be worth calling them to ask.
Leave this with me also to look into further when I’m in the office tomorrow.
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 Anoush Mortazavi
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Abz85
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Im goin to place another order with plusnet tommrow. Going to speak to your provisioning team as the sales advisor said the number still belongs to my property, hopfefully plusnet should be able to retain it. Talk just point blank keep sayin number has gone back to bt wearhousing they cant retain number as my line has been disconnected because plusnet cancelled order after the go live date.
Abz85
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

Iv just placed a new order online with plusnet. Would it be possible for you to check with provisioning team to try and renumber my new order onto my old number as im currently with out a active phone line. That number should still be connected to my property if im nkt mistaken? Would really appreciate if you could please try get my new order re-numbered onto my old number. Gandalf is meant tobe a wizard aint he, do some of your magic please. Iv spoken to talk talk about what you said about “cease by error” these idiots have no idea what they are talking about keep giving me random excuses etc.
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: Retaining Phone Number

I'm afraid that this is likely even beyond my control or influence.

I've tried contacting the number porting team but unfortunately they don't work bank holidays.

I'm sending an e-mail over to them now to get my query in the queue for action, and I'll contact them tomorrow also.

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 Anoush Mortazavi
 Plusnet Help Team