PlusNet Slower than TalkTalk for me :(

[#1]

OK, you do seem to be thinking constructively which will help. There are a lot of options.
I was just adding this to a previous post:

Quote from: DDNewCust

In the mean time I would like a retune the line / profile reset after all this change and hopefully good work, what do I need to do to get that to happen?

DLM does that automatically if you really have made a significant improvement, but it will take time.
A full reset won't happen unless there's a really good reason, e.g. BT find a rectify and significant fault. Might just happen if you fit a faceplate and convince PN staff that your own wiring was the problem and is no longer an issue, so definitely not yet.
I don't like the look of that plug-in extension lead, especially if it's for the router; over the years I've learned to avoid them like the plague!
The wiring colours for a start suggest it's pretty old and probably not to the right standard.

[#2]

Quote from: DDNewCust

Or just get a new one.

Remember, temporarily you can just plug a filter in there and buy a long (makes sure it's twisted-pair) RJ11 cable to run upstairs to the router.
Though if you're going shopping a filtered faceplate, length of CW1308, some cable clips and suitable socket (RJ11 one?) would be my top priority.  
Maybe an LJ4 socket like this if you use a wired phone near the router: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Telephone-Broadband-Double-Extension-Socket-with-ADSL-Filter-LJ4-/22148847...

[#3]

I really don't know why you are suggesting that expensive socket from eBay HP, is really is totally unnecessary, unless Dave especially wants to dispense with the Rat's tail filter at the socket where his modem/router is. I expect they are decent units if they are made by Pressac, but the claim that they are the same units fitted by BT no longer hold water, BT have not fitted sockets like that in years. I've already made reference to the Mk3 SSFP (Service Specific Filtered Plate) nicknamed the vDSLplate this is far better than any common or garden "filtered plate".
Anyway having been away for 24hrs, I catch up on this lot and post back.

[#4]

And a Happy New Year to everyone who has contributed to this thread.  
But, please try to keep up AO and reread the posts when you're sober.  
That's a "suggestion" (NOTE "maybe") for the bedroom, not the master socket. Nice and tidy if you like that sort of thing and the "product blurb" is NOT written by me!  

Quote from: HPsauce

Maybe an LJ4 socket like this if you use a wired phone near the router

Master will obviously (as I stated   ) have the Mk3 SSFP and run an unfiltered CW1308 cable to the router location.

Quote from: HPsauce

filtered faceplate, length of CW1308

Welcome to 2015. 

[#5]

A Happy New Year to one and all, a little tired perhaps but perfectly sober thanks HP that's the problem when one has to drive!

Quote from: HPsauce

...filtered faceplate, length of CW1308....

Ah, didn't see you mention the Mk3 SSFP
Hi Dave, you were included in the happy new year, but I'll say it again.
Can I start with a note of caution

Quote from: DDNewCust

Well I have been working on this all day and the line has understandably been up and down all day as I disconnected things.

I didn't mention this before because

Quote from: DDNewCust

I did a PPP disconnect wait 1 minute, power down and 20 minute off wait before re-powering.

If you leave the modem/router connected whilst investigating/altering wiring, plugging filters in and out etc., you run the risk of a drop in connection if for no other reason than possibly having created a spike on the line. Always best to drop the PPP session, wait a minute and power off for the duration.
Another note of caution, if you don't have an IDC tool then don't push wires into IDC terminals using other tools right in the jaws of the terminal as this may open the jaws and result in a poor connection. Push the wire down outside of but on both sides of the jaws.
I would leave any further disconnects today (if you did any yesterday) to those that are absolutely essential.
Ok, a couple of comments and some questions.
First, from what I can see in the 2nd photo (IMAG1836-1) on reply #42, the incoming wiring to the NTE5A is CW1308 and what's at the bottom of the picture, presumably the wiring going off to the extensions also appears to be CW1308.
Dave can you confirm that all the wiring to the fixed extensions is CW1308? - it will usually have 2 or 3 pairs (the exact number of pairs is irrelevant, there can be more) the clue is in the colours - Blue+white trace, White+blue trace - 1st pair; Orange+white trace, White+orange trace - 2nd pair; Green+white trace, White+green trace - 3rd pair; etc.
The first of my immediate concerns - that already queried by HP - this "extension" lead for the modem/router  IMAG1834-1 in reply #42. Is this normally used when the modem/router is in it's usual location? How long is it? How far is the modem/router from the fixed socket in Bedroom 4?
Do you have the original short RJ11-RJ11modem/router lead? Can you explain in detail exactly how things are connected in Bedroom 4?
If all the fixed wiring is CW1308, we may be able to move forward quite quickly.
My 2nd concern is one previously mentioned by jelv.  All the wiring to extension sockets should be connected to the removable faceplate of the NTE5A.
There are two aspects to this concern. You may already know the answer to one from your previous efforts.
When the faceplate is removed form the NTE5A, all the extension sockets should be dead. If you are not certain, at some convenient point, use the Disconnect method for the modem/router and power it off. Then remove the face plate, and check all sockets with a phone to confirm they are dead.
The 2nd aspect, not of immediate concern if all sockets are dead, the incoming cable to the NTE5A is CW1308 - there must therefore be another connection box somewhere between the incoming u/g cable and this CW1308. At some point, it would be a good idea to locate it and check it.
Just left now to comment on the checks made from the Test socket. No different from what I would have expected - I refer to my remarks about banded connections in reply #34. As far as the Bits/Tone is concerned, I would expect to sometimes see minor differences in bit loading with each sync, especially when time of day is taken into account. The Dec.30th was well after sunset. But in any case we can only see the loading upto tone 255 on those graphs. There will be changes on the tones above 255 as well. On the Graph in RS, you'll find radio buttons at the bottom right, select the 0-512 button.  When convenient, it could be useful to see the full Bits/Tone at this stage from your usual location.
As previously commented, if all wiring is CW1308 it is unlikely to be picking up any interference of any significance.  If there were any SHINE that might be picked up, it would indicate that it's source needs to be dealt with.

[#6]

Quote from: Anotherone

If all the fixed wiring is CW1308, we may be able to move forward quite quickly.

My reading of the information supplied is that the router socket is supplied by that plug-in lead.
All other sockets appear (needs confirming, no photo as yet) to be wired to the removable lower faceplate in the normal way and are probably CW1308.
(The photo of the back of the master socket BACKPLATE does appear to show only a dropwire type connection and separate extension wiring is visible in the background in at least one picture, so it's probably OK)
If that's the case then installing a v3 SSFP will indeed be very easy, assuming that's what Dave wants to do:
Basically just slip it in and then wire a CW1308 cable pair to the unfiltered terminals for the router location and screw back together.
The bell wire and non-standard sockets have presumably all been dealt with so errors should already have dropped significantly.
The plug-in extension "may" have suitable cable, in which case it "could" be extracted from the plug/adapter unit and wired directly to the SSFP, once a definite twisted pair is identified.
Edit: Just to add that, in my opinion, installing a v3 SSFP as soon as possible would be a good move as it gives the basis of a clean and tidy installation that can then be further improved (if necessary) very simply.

[#7]

The wiring to the back of the NTE5A terminals is not drop-wire (the colours are wrong), it's conventional CW1308.

Quote from: DDNewCust

....... 3) Bedroom 4 (old ish wiring modem days) - Router - Filter at phone same location as non filtered router. 4) Kitchen (extension 3 years ago) - Filter at master socket

As per my previous post, full clarification of Bedroom 4 wiring and whether it's a fixed hard wired socket, if it's that lead, the colours going into the cable look correct for conventional twisted pair and the cable appeared to be of round cross-section.
Clarification of the Kitchen arrangement would be good, I'm getting the impression it's a conventional phone extension plugged into a filter that is plugged into the master socket, in which case there is no issue with that.

[#8]

Quote from: Anotherone

The wiring to the back of the NTE5A terminals is not drop-wire (the colours are wrong), it's conventional CW1308.

So it is! You're presumably concerned that it goes to a junction box somewhere with further extension wiring there.

[#9]

And the possible quality of the connection - but if all internal sockets are dead it's only of secondary concern - just like to know what's there before passing any final judgement.

[#10]

OK I am back in the room and a Happy New year guys. I hope yours has been better than mine so far.
I have got "Man Flu" my wife's diagnosis, didn't even manage to see in the new year I was in bed.
I have not been playing the broadband game for a few days and just letting the router do it's thing.
So sorry for not replying or may be not fully clued up on your messages.
I will respond to some of questions asked probably tomorrow or may be later, so not all will be covered below, as I need to go outside, where there must be a box and I am not up to it. We think there is a silver keyed box on the side of the house (outside) that cable TV came in, we didn't use that when we moved in 21 years ago. The phone line may come in there, I will open it and see.  From memory a pair of pilers did the job (21 years ago). Will try to take pictures as you guys seem to see a lot in them, that is not obvious to me.
I made a big mistake the other day not disconnecting correctly -  PPP down and wait - then power off. Thanks for the reminder AO. I will try to do that correctly next time.
I have a  MK3 vDSL plate on the way, probably a week away. I know it makes sense.
All phones disconnected when tested, there are no connections before that picture of the back of the Master Socket, none that I am aware of anyway.
I am fairly certain but need to check that all cables are round and twisted bar one extension. The one extension not twisted (I think) is the kitchen. I will need to open up the sockets and I don't want to do that at the moment as the router has been on and not retuned for over a day. I did a off and on of PPP, over a day ago, to get a better ping rate for the gamer in the house otherwise it would be >50hrs.
This is how the extensions are wired to the master socket, editing data in bold from an earlier post and includes work done a few days ago.
All filters are now of the rat tail type shown in the PlusNet picture link by AO's post.
1) Living room  - wired to master socket - Filter at phone end. resistor and bell wire removed
2) Bedroom 1  - wired to master socket - Filter at phone end. bell wire removed
3) Bedroom 4 - Router - plugs directly into the master the one in the photo - this line is 10 meters long from the master socket to the extension socket - Filter at phone same location as non filtered router - the filter to router cable is flat and may be original. I am looking to replace this with the PlusNet router cable at some stage which is round. TBD
4) Kitchen (extension 3 years ago)  - Filter at master socket - which plugs into the Bedroom 4 extension at the master - bell and other wire removed kitchen end
I think the removal of the resistor and may be (not conviced here) the rat tail filters have helped. Also binning the LED Lamp drive (over a week ago now) which knocked out the PlusNet line when turned on, was the big one.
I am not going to do a any more wiring changes till MK3 arrives, the line has been stable and mostly 16db to 18db DL SNRM. I noted that most of the drops in this Bits graph relate to local MW radio stations and were there when I plugged the router directly into the master socket. so not in my house wiring for that test.
I would like to retune and see how it looks now, so that when the MK3 comes along I will see the difference.  Hopefully Chris can get that done for me.
Dave

[#11]

Hope you're feeling better soon.
As your sync speed is staying the same, remember that a larger noise margin is a good sign, it means the interference has reduced.
The objective then is to get the "target" noise margin reduced from whatever it is at present so that future syncs will be stable but faster.
Not much point in thinking about that (other than letting DLM do its thing, slowly) until your faceplate is installed and other issues attended to.

[#12]

Hope you feel a lot better soon. I wouldn't worry about the external box for now. The fact that the incoming cable to the master is CW1308 and all sockets in the house are dead when the faceplate is removed, means there shouldn't be any other wiring to consider, and you've resolved the bell-wire issue.
Bit Loading - Apart from the 6 tones on ADSL2+ that will have no bit loading and one tone that only has a 2 bit loading which often seems to move to a different tone each resync, a significant number of all but the shorter lines will get some UK MW/AM radio pickup. One of the TalkSport transmitters is quite common, you may have Absolute Radio on 1197kHz and there's often quite a few tones affected after dark when SNRM will vary and a lot of bit swapping will occur as a consequence.
To use the Mk3 SSFP (vDSL plate) you really need to wire bedroom 4 with CW1308 and a standard secondary socket, because the phone socket on the NTE5A becomes filtered (fine for the Kitchen extension so no filter needed for that) but consequently not functional for ADSL so your current plug-in extension won't be usable as is. It's probably not worth crimping on a RJ11 plug instead (for the top socket) and flexible cable will not give a clean reliable connection on the two ADSL IDC terminals on the plate. Using CW1308 will give you a cheaper and more reliable connection (from the source I suggested - if you buy from elsewhere, make sure they are reputable and watch out for P&P costs which can bump up the price). You'll need to get a secondary socket (and 25mm surface box) from somewhere or that Pressac built-in filter dual socket that HP suggested if you want to dispense with the rat's tail filter.
If everything is currently looking nice and stable, and having resolved the primary bell wire and interference issue, you could have the banding removed (SNR Reset) but you wouldn't be able to raise a fault or have another reset for the duration of the 10 day training period if you are happy for that to go ahead.

[#13]

Quote from: Anotherone

It's probably not worth crimping on a RJ11 plug instead (for the top socket) and flexible cable will not give a clean reliable connection on the two ADSL IDC terminals on the plate.

A technique I have used (temporarily) to get stranded flexible wires into IDC slots is to "tin" the ends with a small amount of solder for a few mm. It usually works.  
Or you can just cut the end off a spare RJ11 cable join (solder ideally) the wires and tape up; again not elegant but it does for a while.  

[#14]

I had thought of that, but sshhh. That is of course a good trick for those who are expert with a soldering iron (such as Dave) but not recommended for amateurs, and some flexible cable wires will not tin nicely because of their construction.

[#15]

Quote from: Anotherone

a good trick for those who are expert with a soldering iron (such as Dave)

He seems happy to wield that weapon; that's why I suggested it.