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Needing help with IMAP folders

MKSlinky
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Needing help with IMAP folders

Hi all, 

Recently I made the switch from Windows Live Mail to the new Mail app in Windows 10.

My first discovery was that IMAP didn't appear to be working as I had expected and messages weren't being synced across devices. Moving forward, after many weeks of tinkering with Mail and changing settings and creating additional folders on the webmail server I've gotten myself into a right old pickle!

Can someone please show me a screenshot of exactly what folders I should have and in particular how the 'Special Folders' should look like in webmail? I've posted a screenshot of mine below.

As yet I haven't found a single useful piece of info on these forums to guide users with IMAP and not even the help files help.

It seems one of the main issues I have now is that I have a Deleted Items folder in Windows Mail and also a Trash Folder. The Trash folder seems to be collecting mail from my laptop while the Deleted Items folder is collecting mail from my desktop computer, shouldn't they all be going into one folder?

What's really frustrating is the Trash folder refuses to stay empty once I've emptied it and the messages keep coming back. I have now even unsubscribed from both those folders but it makes no difference.

I thought I had cracked this a couple of weeks ago and so proud of my achievements I even wrote my own help files to share with the community, fat lot of good they'd do anybody, I'm still struggling. Undecided

This is my current setup - some folders have been custom made and do seem to sync okay, I think it's really just these Special Folders which is causing concern.

Thanks in advance Thumbs Up

 

 

Screenshot (94).png

 

Screenshot (93).png

12 REPLIES
Superuser
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

In webmail the default folders should be shown with greyed out checkboxes, all ticked as subscribed. Any folders with normal density checkboxes are extra ones added by the user.

My folders are listed in a different order - the standard ones are as follows

WmlDefFdrs.png

The Special Folders settings should be

WmlSpecFdrs.png

I have the Windows 10 App set up (with IMAP). However I don't use it routinely, I prefer Thunderbird. I recall it saving Sent and Deleted messages in odd folders (different from the intended ones). However I'd need to go back to this to separate reality and faulty memory.

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

@spraxyt

Thank you for your input, I gave you a thumbs up for your bravery Thumbs Up

I have spent nearly all day experimenting with the various folders and did eventually end up with how yours looks, except in Windows 10 Mail the TRASH folder isn't used.  Instead Mail has it's own DELETED ITEMS folder which it does use. Bizarrely however the TRASH folder is collecting deleted messages from my Windows 7 laptop, weird or what?!!

The only folder I cannot get to sync with the server is DRAFTS, despite being assigned under the special folders.

I have stumbled upon one strange phenomenon however, emptying the Deleted Items folder or the Trash folder works but then the messages immediately refill both boxes. Same thing happens on the server. 

If I try to delete the Trash folder I get a server error. I have now reported this to our Community Gaffer who is investigating as he was able to reproduce the same problem.

Looks like I'll have to wait for the time being and see what transpires, I think it's more a fault of webmail.

Thanks Wink

Superuser
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

Hi @MKSlinky. I reviewed where I'd got to previously looking into the W10 built-in Mail app. I think some of the confusing behaviour results from the App folders working at top level whereas on the Plusnet server only Inbox is at that level. The server imposes that behaviour. This can be seen with Webmail where an attempt to create a new folder at top level (shown as '---' in the parent box) results it it being created as an Inbox subfolder, and displayed as such.

I created a new folder in W10 mail, and as expected had to subscribe to it to see it in Webmail and Thunderbird. I copied something into it using Thuderbird and Webmail showed the content. Initially W10 Mail reckoned the folder was still empty, but after closing the app down for over an hour then starting it again the content showed.

To make W10 Mail work properly with the Plusnet IMAP environment I think it might need the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified) and possibly special folder associations similar to Webmail.

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders


spraxyt wrote:

Hi @MKSlinky.

....This can be seen with Webmail where an attempt to create a new folder at top level (shown as '---' in the parent box) results it it being created as an Inbox subfolder, and displayed as such.

Hi thanks for your valuable advice. Yes I noticed this myself yesterday, all folders created in Webmail are children of the Inbox . Whereas creating folders inside W10's Mail those folders can be either created as children (sub-folders) or as separate non dependant folders. Special folders (children) syncing fails. I find the non dependant folders work fine.

 

To make W10 Mail work properly with the Plusnet IMAP environment I think it might need the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified) and possibly special folder associations similar to Webmail.


 

Not sure I'm grasping you on this one. How would one change the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified)?The Mail app has very limited settings in the options screen and certainly doesn't give an option to play around with special folders. This can only be achieved on the Webmail server.

Currently my situation is still much the same as yesterday i.e.....

  • I have a DELETED ITEMS folder in Mail which is non dependant of the INBOX - This works correctly and syncing in both directions.

 

  • I have a TRASH folder in Mail which is a child of INBOX - This folder does not receive deleted items from Mail. This folder still refuses to be deleted and cannot be emptied permanently either by emptying or purging on either Mail or the server. (This is still under investigation by PN who have implemented a possible fix which didn't work) 

 

  • DRAFTS folder in Mail works but doesn't sync with the server.
Superuser
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Registered: ‎06-04-2007

Re: Needing help with IMAP folders


MKSlinky wrote:

spraxyt wrote:

To make W10 Mail work properly with the Plusnet IMAP environment I think it might need the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified) and possibly special folder associations similar to Webmail.


 Not sure I'm grasping you on this one. How would one change the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified)?The Mail app has very limited settings in the options screen and certainly doesn't give an option to play around with special folders. This can only be achieved on the Webmail server.


Yes,, the point is that W10 Mail does not provide an option to define either of these attribute sets.; That's what I meant by my comment. However it might ask the server for the prefix.

One problem with all applications seems to be that whilst INBOX is recognised by all of them for what its name suggests, this isn't the case for other special folders, Drafts, Sent, Deleted, Archived and (possibly) Spam. The server might also use different names.

As an example, for Deleted I think the server name for this folder is 'Trash'.
Webmail calls it Deleted Items with the link to the real one defined in Special Folders. There is another (regular) Deleted Items folder - which is the one created by W10 Mail.
Thunderbird (on W10 and I think it's the same on Ubuntu/Linux) calls it Deleted.
The Gmail app on Android calls it Bin.
The iOS Mail app on my iPad lets me choose between Trash local to the iPad and any folder on the server (I chose Trash).
But W10 Mail created its own Deleted Items and unlike the others ignores Trash.

With the exception of W10 Mail, these programs mentioned above work with trash as expected.

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

@spraxyt

Hi ya,

Now I get you! Given the length of time I've been playing with this over the last month and since installing Mail I've come to that realisation myself pretty much. So in essence your comment below was more for informational purposes rather than an instruction.

spraxyt wrote:

To make W10 Mail work properly with the Plusnet IMAP environment I think it might need the folder prefix setting (so INBOX can be specified) and possibly special folder associations similar to Webmail.

 

I can live with it for now, everything is working okay albeit I do still have two obsolete TRASH folders but I'll ignore them until PN can fix the ACL 'e' attribute which for some reason has changed recently preventing a user from deleting the TRASH folders. PN did rename one of my to TRASH OLD in the hope I could then delete it but that didn't work.

I've sent you a PM 

Cheers. Thumbs Up

Superuser
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

@MKSlinky

Yes my comment was musing rather than anything you could do. Sorry I didn't make that clear initially.

On a Linux system one shouldn't be able to have more than one folder with a given path and name. However apart from a different case letter (which is significant) I've been caught out when one of the names had an "invisible" space on the end. (More musing on my part.)

Thanks for the PM. I'll reply to that shortly.

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders


spraxyt wrote:

@MKSlinky

Yes my comment was musing rather than anything you could do. Sorry I didn't make that clear initially.

No worries, at least you did offer to help! Thumbs Up

On a Linux system one shouldn't be able to have more than one folder with a given path and name. However apart from a different case letter (which is significant) I've been caught out when one of the names had an "invisible" space on the end. (More musing on my part.)

Isn't that the same for Windows based systems also? I don't recall ever being allowed to have duplicate folder/file names residing in the same path on my PC. (Amusing on my part) Tongue


 

Superuser
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

Yes, Windows too doesn't support duplicate file names in a particular folder. However it gets round this by adding (1), (2), etc ... to the name.

I mentioned Linux since that is likely to be the Operating System of the mail server. Tongue

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

Yes I did know that but never thought to mention it, doa'h!

There's some clever things you can do with Windows folders, not sure if it applies to Linux though, for example you can have nameless folders too. Truthfully speaking you're only allowed one nameless folder inside any given folder

Here's one I just created:

Screenshot (102).png

To do the above try this...,

Hold the > ALT key while typing the numbers > 0160 using the number pad then Hit > Enter and the folder name should be gone.

Also some media streamers such as Western Digital will ignore folders with a full stop at the front of the folder name rendering them hidden on your screen.

I found another useful tip the other day for opening the 'Applications' folder on Windows 10, very useful for creating links to apps on your desktop or launcher bar. Type the following in the address bar in Explorer then Hit > Enter:

shell:::{4234d49b-0245-4df3-b780-3893943456e1}

 

Didn't know that about the server being Linux based though, how bizarre! 

 

Superuser
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders


MKSlinky wrote:

Didn't know that about the server being Linux based though, how bizarre!


Some of us might take the view that it would be bizarre if it wasn't. Funny

But we digress ...

David
MKSlinky
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Re: Needing help with IMAP folders

Well what do I know, I always thought Linux was the name of an 80's female vocalist. Undecided I think she sang in the Eurithmics? Hated them in all honesty, she had a weird look in one eye! Come to think of it I think her and David Bowie shared the same problem, maybe they were sharing the same womb?