cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Raised this ticket, Saturday I think it was. 30772887. Problem is a loss of service despite all the greens showing on the router, happens at any-time of day, any day of the week. Not heard anything back from +net. So, starting to get fed up.
37 REPLIES
Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Update.
Managed to speak to CS. Went through the whole nauseating process of have 'you checked so and so. ' Yes I have.' So why nothing followed up from the original ticket? Tonight the CS guy tells me that I am agreeing to underwrite the cost of the engineer if a fault is found with my equipment. I have some devastating news. No I wont. There wont be any equipment for the engineer to inspect, should he need to call. Just the faceplate and the line leading all the way back to plusnet via my exchange.
I said it before. Time to traffic shape the direct debit.
Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 13,330
Thanks: 1,115
Fixes: 90
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Sorry to hear you're having problems Sad
Quote from: Oleo
Raised this ticket, Saturday I think it was. 30772887

That ticket is in your ownership. which is why it hasn't been followed up on. Your actual fault is being chronicled in ticket 30772780 and is awaiting the attention of the Faults Team. They will need to raise it to BT Wholesale to see what they have to say.
Quote
Tonight the CS guy tells me that I am agreeing to underwrite the cost of the engineer if a fault is found with my equipment. I have some devastating news. No I wont. There wont be any equipment for the engineer to inspect, should he need to call.

If there's no chance the problem could be your side of the master socket (including any internal wiring/extensions you may have) then there's no risk of you getting charged. If Wholesale ask us to book an engineer appointment though then we're not going to do this without your acceptance of the potential for charges if the problem is due to something at your side.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Quote
If Wholesale ask us to book an engineer appointment though then we're not going to do this without your acceptance of the potential for charges if the problem is due to something at your side.

Bob. Absolutely not. I had an engineer a couple of years ago. He confessed to not knowing how BB worked, found no fault. I migrated out and back in. Migration was delayed due to exchange fault. ISP insisted that I still paid for the engineer. It was not until proceedings were issued against me and someone with some common sense looked at the issue and dropped the case against me. I'm not going through that again. I would rather not have broadband. There is no way for me to challenge a wrong decision by BTW without going to court. So not doing it.
Just tried to use the dial up. Refused on username/password. The lady I spoke to tried to say that was a problem with my BT line. How could it. We were speaking over the same line I use for dial up. The line works. It was another logging on problem. The lady then said I had entered the password incorrectly. I have used the same password. It worked before, now it doesn't.
BB seems to be working again, for how long I dont know.
I'm having a bad night, so I'll leave it with you, before I break the keyboard.
Cheers
tihson
Grafter
Posts: 28
Registered: 01-11-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

oleo just incase , when plusnet staff talked me through setting up my temporrary. dial up, the operator (i was typing in as she gave me details)  gave me the wrong details to put in as the username , She gave me the broadband details (NOT DIAL UP)
And as far as call outs with engineers, i cancelled with my account with Virgin (cable) after 6 weeks , and physically handed him the router, and set top box, after he came out with such a load of carp, i was having exactly the problem you are describing, with virgin and he blamed it all on my virtually brand new laptop.
And i was going to be charged
By the way same laptop i am still using two years on
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,101
Thanks: 443
Fixes: 21
Registered: 31-08-2007

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Oleo, I suspect you don't realise who's responsible for what, so here's an explanation.
You get your Broadband service over a pair of telephone wires. You pay Line Rental for those wires and a telephone service to a provider who has the main responsibility, to the customer - End User (EU), for this. The Broadband supplier (ISP) only has the responsibility of providing an acceptable (within the definitions) service over those wires. If the wires go faulty, this often appears as a problem on the telephone service.
To quote a PN customer who said to another PN customer "if your phone line is [Censored], then your broadband will be [Censored]".
These days you are provided with a line to the telephone exchange which terminates on your property in Network Termination Equipment (NTE) which is normally a Master LineBox. Beyond that anything connected, extension wiring/sockets/phone/modems etc is your responsibility, it's called "Self Install". This is why YOU are required to carry out a number of tests and checks to ensure it is not your own equipment or installation causing the problems or face a charge of £144+VAT from BT which is passed to your provider and then you (read page 5 of the Phone book as far as basic service is concerned).
The definitions of acceptable broadband service are so wide that it can be sometimes very difficult and very frustrating to pin down intermittent and obscure faults and get things fixed. These definitions are not PN's, they are industry wide and regulated by OFCOM, it doesn't matter whether you get your services from BT Retail, PN, or any other ISP or Communications provider (CP) they are all regulated by the same rules. And don't forget, whoever your CP's are, it's the same wires and usually the same equipment (unless you're LLU) at the exchange.
BT Wholesale market services to a number of ISP's and CP's and equipment and lines are maintained by BT OpenReach. BT Retail, BTw & BT OR are all subsiduary companies of BT Group and as it happens PN are owned by BT Retail, however BTw and Openreach are forced by the regulations (and the regulator OFCOM) to treat every ISP & CP equally, so it doesn't matter who you buy your services from the same rules apply.
The real problem with intermittent faults is catching them happening with enough evidence and reporting them whilst they are happening. It is usually much easier to get this sort of problem fixed as a POTS (plain old telephone service) fault. I'm afraid you will probably just have to sit it out until it shows up again.
If you think a phone line fault is present whilst you are at the test socket you need to confirm you can hear crackling or other intermittent noise on your phone, if you do, plug a corded phone direct into the test socket and confirm it is still present. If so, I believe you implied your phone service was with BT, phone 151 and go directly to speak to an adviser, do so whilst the noise is still present, and try and do so quickly before you receive an incoming call because ringing on the line can often clean a bad connection. Do not use any automated tests and do not mention the broadband this is a phone fault you are reporting, otherwise you'll get given the run around. Make sure the adviser can hear the noise, get them to confirm it and log it and log it as intermittent with the request that they ensure Openreach are made aware it's intermittent.
One final tip: When you need to swap things around for testing, powerdown your modem/router and wait several minutes before unplugging anything that disconnects it from the line eg. it's cable, the filter, master faceplate etc. Don't do this more than 5 times in an hour, and then leave it alone for the rest of the day. This is to help prevent the exchange DLM from thinking you have a worse intermittent line problem.
Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Anotherone
Thanks, fully aware of how and who delivers the service.
Quote
The real problem with intermittent faults is catching them happening with enough evidence and reporting them whilst they are happening. It is usually much easier to get this sort of problem fixed as a POTS (plain old telephone service) fault. I'm afraid you will probably just have to sit it out until it shows up again.

That is exactly the problem, today the service is fine. So what happens if an engineer calls and puts a 'no fault' on his paperwork? I have no contract with BTW or OpenReach, Plusnet do however. So how do I challenge sub standard performance from those two agencies? Plusnet would have to do that, and what if they dont? It's off to court again? The fault occurs for sometimes up-to a few hours, then clears, how do you get an engineer to carry out work in that time-scale?
I'm also getting information that other BB connections in my area also have the same difficulties as I am. Given that fact and this Exchange fault again, no I'm not underwriting anything.]
tihson
Quote
oleo just incase , when plusnet staff talked me through setting up my temporrary. dial up, the operator (i was typing in as she gave me details)  gave me the wrong details to put in as the username , She gave me the broadband details (NOT DIAL UP)
I had been using dial up quite successfully, and then at around the same time as Bob Pullen posted above, service was lost. No accusations Bob, it just puts a time stamp on the sequence of events.
Bob Pullen
Quote
That ticket is in your ownership. which is why it hasn't been followed up on. Your actual fault is being chronicled in ticket 30772780 and is awaiting the attention of the Faults Team. They will need to raise it to BT Wholesale to see what they have to say.

Did any of this affect the emergency dial up service, which I lost around the time you made your post?
Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 13,330
Thanks: 1,115
Fixes: 90
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Quote from: Oleo
Bob Pullen
Quote
That ticket is in your ownership. which is why it hasn't been followed up on. Your actual fault is being chronicled in ticket 30772780 and is awaiting the attention of the Faults Team. They will need to raise it to BT Wholesale to see what they have to say.

Did any of this affect the emergency dial up service, which I lost around the time you made your post?

Not that I can see. Your RADIUS logs contain the following failed connection attempts:
Event Time	Message	IP Assigned	Service	Calling From	Session Started	Session Ended	Session Duration
21:41 18/Nov/2009 password incorrect N/A 8089933270 1593****** N/A N/A N/A
21:25 18/Nov/2009 password incorrect N/A 8089933270 1593****** N/A N/A N/A
21:24 18/Nov/2009 password incorrect N/A 8089933270 1593****** N/A N/A N/A
21:24 18/Nov/2009 password incorrect N/A 8089933270 1593****** N/A N/A N/A

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

Community Veteran
Posts: 19,101
Thanks: 443
Fixes: 21
Registered: 31-08-2007

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Hi Oleo,
I hope you realise that I'm just trying to be helpful, I wanted to be absolutely certain that you understood what you had to do and the best approach in particular circumstances.
Quote
That is exactly the problem, today the service is fine. So what happens if an engineer calls and puts a 'no fault' on his paperwork? I have no contract with BTW or OpenReach, Plusnet do however. So how do I challenge sub standard performance from those two agencies? Plusnet would have to do that, and what if they dont? It's off to court again? The fault occurs for sometimes up-to a few hours, then clears, how do you get an engineer to carry out work in that time-scale?
Off to court? No that's not how it works -it might with a bum ISP, not here anyway.
Providing you have done what you should have - tested at the test socket with an alternative good modem/router and alternative filter and used a corded phone (so that you know a cordless - should be turned off completely - is not causing interference) then there should be no problem.
As you are clearly worried because of your previous experience (I can't blame you) my advise would be to make sure you have documented both on the Ticket and here what you have done, the latter will enable all of us to try and provide further suggestions, if this drags on which it could as it's intermittent.
I'd suggest that you state which modem/router, filter & phone you used at time xyz and perhaps how long it was on, and put the Line stats on the ticket/posts, what time you swapped to the alternatives and how long they were on, again with Line stats, & of course at what time you spotted drops. Also clearly state it's intermittent, may be ok for hrs/days - whatever. PN can see drops from their logs which will tally. Providing you do all that I'm sure Bob Pullen will come here and re-assure you.
With regards to that "exchange fault" to which you refer, that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with your line problem. That's the "other side of the DSLAM"  and could have been the other end of the link from the exchange, rather than the exchange - in any event it's been fixed - click on the line of each for a more detailed report.
With regard to your dialup connection dropping - think about it - you have an intermittent line fault - that's why it dropped. Don't I know about such things having suffered like that in the past - it's a real bastard - as much as it tries one's patience, you just have to grit your teeth and try and catch the line being noisy - as I've said sometimes it's easier to get such faults fixed as a POTS fault.
If you have even the slightest worry that one of your bits may be causing the problem, leave the kit that is good connected (at the test socket) to see what happens. Good luck!
Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Anotherone
Thanks. Yup I do realise you are trying to help, and I do appreciate that. But, I have been bitten twice before by tardy ISPs, so I hope folk can understand that I'm not up for another session, so to speak. When the fault re-appears, if it does, I will try to post whatever I can. But I do feel like I am doing the job of an engineer, the number of times I have checked routers, filters, buggered around with test sockets, when all the time the ISP is rolling over laughing because they don't have the capacity or the have a major network issue. I'm not saying this is the case now with plusnet, but you must get my drift by now. Once bitten and all that.
The bit about the dial up. The voice side of the line is working fine, the conversion with the lady in CS, well it was like something out of Monty Python.
I'm hoping that I can get access via some other means before my exchange gets downgraded to ADSL2+ I'm led to believe that my speeds will get slower when that comes in.
tobykim
Grafter
Posts: 105
Registered: 25-02-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

Oleo, what make of router are you using, if it'sanything other than a Netgear it most probably isn't the same problem I had, all the lights were green for me on Netgear but no connection, swapped it and all ok, just clutching at straws and thought I'd mention it
Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

tobykim, it's a Linksys wag 54GS
tobykim
Grafter
Posts: 105
Registered: 25-02-2009

Re: Starting to get fed up. 30772887

I don't know if it's that then, I know I was getting a similar problem with a Netgear DG834v4, all my lights would be lit but no connection, I got the speedtouch from PN and the problem didn't happen, I've also been using a 2wire with SBC firmware and that was ok as well, you've most probably tried a different router anyway but just thought I'd mention it
Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
Posts: 10,540
Registered: 18-07-2007

Re:Starting to get fed up. 30772887

hi Oleo,
I can see you've raised us a fault. I'll get the line tested and the ticket moved on for you. Have you been able to test another router, or should I send you one out? If you test that in the test socket and the fault is still happening, you've proved the line is at fault and you categorically won't be charged the £144 + vat.
Oleo
Grafter
Posts: 58
Registered: 22-01-2009

Re:Starting to get fed up. 30772887

orbrey, thanks. I have tried a neighbours DLink router. I have also spoken to a few folk around and about (all different ISPs) and they are all up in arms as well. So could it be engineering work in the local area? Is there any chance of speaking to BTW/OpenReach under the radar, so to speak, to see if they have any 'unofficial comment'?
Yes, I would like to take up your offer. At least I would be using a proven router and that should remove any ambiguity. How long can we leave the test running, it can take days for the fault to reappear.
Thanks
dick:quote