Full fibre installation by Openreach

[#1]

I have agreed a transition from FTTC broadband to FTTP with Plusnet. My existing cable enters through the ground front porch and emerges by an unknown route beneath floorboards to my home office at the back of the house on the first floor. This is where the Openreach master socket is located and which is where the Plusnet Hub 2 router is connected. I am sure that there is no way the optical cabling can follow the same route, so it would make sense for the new cable to enter directly into the office via the external wall, with the ONT box located near a conveniently sited double socket.There doesn't seem to be any way to contact Openreach to discuss this proposal prior to their engineer's visit. Is there any way in which Plusnet can arrange a pre-installation survey? I wish to avert a last minute problem with Openreach. Any help/guidance would be much appreciated.

[#2]

Moderator's note:
Thread moved from Broadband to My Order

[#3]

@jonroe 

what does the BT wholesale checker https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL/AddressHome say for your address ? 

what is in the 'Install process' alongside the WBC FTTP availability ?

and what does the narrative below the availability matrix say ?

[#4]

This is what the Broadband Availability Checker says:

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:-Single Dwelling Unit Residential UG partial Direct In Ground.

FTTP is available and a new ONT may be ordered.

As a fibre priority exchange, FTTP has priority over other products if available at the address

As a WLR withdrawal exchange, product restrictions apply

SOADSL is not restricted at the exchange

For all ADSL and WBC Fibre to the Cabinet (VDSL or G.fast) services, the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage.

For all SOADSL services,the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage.

This site is in an FTTP priority area where FTTP is available but exceptionally SOGEA will also show as available to order but only at Non-Standard Premises (NSP) such as Hot site, Uninhabitable and Temporary locations. Migrations of WLR Solus (voice-only lines) is also allowed but only for SOGEA 0.5Mbps bandwidths. SOGEA 40/10 bandwidths order is also allowed.

Actual speeds experienced by end users and quoted by CPs will be lower due to a number of factors within and external to BT's network, Communication Providers' networks and within customer premises.

My question however is not about availability of service, it's the ability of Openreach to accommodate getting the ONT into a bespoke location which requires use of ladders etc.

In order to be eligible for handback, downstream speed should be less than Downstream Handback Threshold values.

If you decide to place an order for a WBC fibre product, an appointment may be required for an engineer to visit the end user's premises to supply the service

ADSL, ADSL2+ and SOADSL availability: If shown at FTTP or SOGEA premises,ADSL, ADSL2+ and SOADSL are not available to order due to WLR Withdrawal stop sell rules. CPs should order FTTP or SOGEA. Copper products are only available by exception.

[#5]

@jonroe 

My question however is not about availability of service, it's the ability of Openreach to accommodate getting the ONT into a bespoke location which requires use of ladders etc.

I appreciate that but that's why I asked about the Install process. Its shown in the FTTP Install process column.

It will either say '1 Stage' , '2 Stage' or 'KCI2 assure'

That, together with the narrative 

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:-Single Dwelling Unit Residential UG partial Direct In Ground.

indicates whether Openreach will do a survey first or not.

The 'partial direct in ground' indicates they will need to dig and that (usually) means a survey first. 

If Openreach dont believe a survey is necessary then there's no way to request one.

[#6]

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@jonroe wrote:

Is there any way in which Plusnet can arrange a pre-installation survey? 

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Yes (sort of). When you get the text message from Openreach confirming they have received an order for your premises, there is a reply option (can't remember the choice now) which prompts a visit for a site survey ahead of installation.

I did this - because of various bees in my bonnet about how it would be installed - but the primary installation guys got there first and bunged the little grey box on an outside wall (with my agreement) without any problems. Then, without any notice or an appointment, somebody else turned up out of the blue at a later date and installed the ONT. Again, with my agreement. But, it didn't work for ages because it couldn't be commissioned, until the appointment for the 'installation'!

I think the second man must have been for a site survey (because of my text) without appointment. But when he saw the existing situation he could see no issue with just installing the ONT on the spot - so he did.

[#7]

@pvmb 

Yes (sort of). When you get the text message from Openreach confirming they have received an order for your premises, there is a reply option (can't remember the choice now) which prompts a visit for a site survey ahead of installation.

Was your 'Install process'  1-Stage, 2-Stage or KCI2 assure? 

[#8]

"Was your 'Install process' 1-Stage, 2-Stage or KCI2 assure?"

Good question. Presumably YES KC12 (from my text?), I heard it mentioned on a phone call. But in effect not really.

From the BT Broadband availability report? - "Single Dwelling Unit Residential UG Pre built to curtilage Hard."

In physical reality? Simple.

Apparently no existing duct for landline cable but simple installation of fibre underground from the very nearby BT ground duct to the CSP on wall (no more than a few feet). Easy, and not long, installation of the fibre from the CSP around a couple of wall bends to the internal ONT. Possibly longer than from the BT duct to the CSP.

[#9]

Good question. Presumably YES KC12 (from my text?), I heard it mentioned on a phone call. But in effect not really.

'KCI2 Assure' means that Openreach aren't quite sure on the extent of work necessary, and therefore will do a survey to assess before scheduling the work and committing to an install date. During the survey discussions can take place about cable routing and CSP/ONT placement

'1 Stage' means OR dont anticpate any problems, will provide a committed date and expect an engineer to complete the install in one visit. Any discussions about CSP/ONT location must be with the engineer on the day and if they arent acceptable (to either engineer or customer) then the only option is to cancel the install.

'2 Stage' installs were one vistir to do external work and then a 2nd visit to install ONT and activate. I'm not sure if there are any '2 Stage' installs now as they've probably been replaced with 'KCI2 Assure'

[#10]

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@jonroe wrote:

My existing cable enters through the ground front porch and emerges by an unknown route beneath floorboards to my home office at the back of the house on the first floor. 

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This is possible too big an ask. My advice is to have another option up your sleeve. You can have up to 199m of CAT5e or better Ethernet cable between the Openreach ONT and your router. Consequently, you could, for example, have the ONT installed in a convenient for Openreach downstairs room and install your own exterior grade Ethernet cable externally around to your home office. This just needs a few DIY tools/skills and a long masonry drill, or help from a local handyman.

[#11]

There appears to be a typo

You can have up to 199m of CAT5e or better Ethernet cable between the Openreach ONT and your router. 

You can have up to 100m of CAT5e or better Ethernet cable between the Openreach ONT and your router.

Edit: I would suggest using cat6 cable as this would be better suited for speeds above 1Gb (2.5Gb which would be required for 1.6Gb Full Fibre or faster when it becomes available).

[#12]

@Dan_the_Van 

Thanks Dan, it's a typo!

The choice between Cat 5e and Cat 6  and above is a personal thing. I prefer Cat 5e as it's a slightly thinner and more flexible due to the lack of the central separator in the faster cables.

[#13]

Many thanks for your advice and wise counsel on this. I will try to identify some alternative locations for the ONT that might be easier for Openreach to implement. As I live in a large old house with internal brick walls, I use a TP-link Deco mesh system to get broadband access in all rooms. Running Cat 5e cable from the ONT to the router positioned in a central location sounds like a good idea.