Please raise ORDI request to fix telephone number / address mismatch

[#1]

Since being with Plusnet for the last few years, I've had a couple of issues involving Openreach fixing problems with phone line connectivity.  At some point I think there has been a failure to update the Openreach database which associates telephone numbers with physical property addressing correctly and now there is a mismatch which is stopping me from being able to obtain services with other providers. 

When I attempt to get a quote with another service provider I receive errors to the effect of "The landline telephone number you have provided doesn't match the address.".  I've double checked the details I entered and the error is the same when attempting to get quotes from other providers.

Can a member of staff please look into this and raise an ORDI request to have the mismatch fixed?

My Plusnet account is munkfish2020, I can verify / provide my details / line number / address as required via PM / wizard (if you still do that!)... although the telephone number and address listed on my Plusnet account page are correct / as they should be.

Many thanks for your time.

[#2]

Hi there,

From what I can see the address on your account matches Openreach's database so there's no mismatch.

What service are you trying to order from another provider? You're in what's known as a WLR Stop Sell / fibre priority exchange area, so unless you renew with us on the same package, you can only order Full Fibre (Fibre To The Premises).

[#3]

Thanks for the response.

I wasn't aware of "WLR Stop Sell" until you mentioned it and it explains why I can't switch to a similar service right now.  Our local exchange is indeed part of the third tranche of stop/sell which started on 25/01/22 earlier this year.

I was attempting to move to a similar broadband and phone contract on another provider - 38Mbps Fibre + line rental.  When I entered my postcode and phone number on the Shell broadband checker it resulted in the error:

The landline telephone number you have provided doesn't match the address.

When I searched for more information on why this might be the case (our landline/address has been the same for over 40 years!), the number one result / most obvious reason was that there was an issue with the Openreach database, hence my rather presumptuous request (you can't blame me though, the error message is pretty blatant!).

I'm a bit annoyed we weren't given any advance notice about this.  Our contract ends in a few days and I was hoping to move elsewhere to get a better deal.

Initial reading about it also fills me with dread and it sounds like we're being forced onto FTTP.  In itself I'm all for moving to FTTP, but I fear it will involve higher prices.  We were only just about managing to pay for the move from ADSL to VDSL and the extra cost involved in that, but now moving to FTTP would mean more cost which just isn't justified (we barely need 38Mbps let alone 1Gbps).

Not to mention the hassle with engineer visits (we have no power near our existing BT master socket so a new box will need to be installed around the back of the house which is a long way to route a cable), possibly having to ditch our landline number (we've had it for over 40 years as I said above although I need to read more yet, I think we can keep the number but at a cost), having to move to VOIP (mum can barely use the existing DECT phones let alone the mind blowing(!) move to VOIP), and so on.

Anyway, lot to take in at the moment and a lot of reading to do.  Thanks for the response.  I may have more questions when I've read up on it all.

[#4]

No worries, I totally get what you've said and sorry for the trouble. If there's anything I can do to support, let me know.

Upgrading to FTTP however doesn't mean you'll have to pay for 1Gbps as you can stay on the same speed you are now for less money a month than you've been paying, although I appreciate you'll lose your landline number, if you stay. 

To keep your number, we can sign you up to BT's FTTP and Digital Voice service. Using a VoIP phone shouldn't be anymore difficult than a DECT phone as the handset should be the same and just plug into the router. Although I don't have too much experience with this, so maybe someone more knowledgeable from the Community can help you here.

There's also the option to speak to us to renew at a cheaper deal on your current package. I'll be happy to ask one of my colleagues to call you back to see what we can do for you as we do have a lot of competitive deals. Drop me a PM with your phone number and a rough timeframe when you'd be available, if you'd like me to arrange a call. 

[#5]

@munkfish is your exchange actually a 'stop sell' or just a 'fibre priority' exchange ? Maybe you could post the result from the BT availability checker https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL ( redact any personal info such as phone/address ).

If it's just a Fibre priority then you SHOULD be able to move ISP's provided you already have an FTTC product and are moving to a 40/10 FTTC product. That's not to say that the ISP systems are able to handle this situation!

but now moving to FTTP would mean more cost which just isn't justified (we barely need 38Mbps let alone 1Gbps).

It need not be more cost, FTTP packages are available at lower speeds e.g 40/10 similar to existing FTTC.

I think we can keep the number but at a cost), 

There isn't any way, without a break in service, currently to keep a number when moving to FTTP on PlusNet

having to move to VOIP (mum can barely use the existing DECT phones let alone the mind blowing(!) move to VOIP), 

As @Gandalf says, from a user point of view there need not be any difference in use of the phone

[#6]

As far as I can see the area's both a stop sell and fibre priority exchange. Here's the full availability checker result:

Interestingly it does say that it may be possible to place an order for VDSL 40/10. 

[#7]

---

@Gandalf wrote:

There's also the option to speak to us to renew at a cheaper deal on your current package. I'll be happy to ask one of my colleagues to call you back to see what we can do for you as we do have a lot of competitive deals. Drop me a PM with your phone number and a rough timeframe when you'd be available, if you'd like me to arrange a call. 

---

Thanks a lot, will have a think and contact you if needed.

[#8]

@Gandalf thanks for that.

From what I can see , the exchange doesnt have the WLR withdrawal flag set , just the Fibre priority.

Therefore according to this https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/the-all-ip-programme/stopsell-updates

Summary of FTTP Priority Exchange stop sell rules:

• Stop sell applies at a premises level only where that premises has access to an available GEA-FTTP product
• Where a premises has access GEA-FTTP new supply order restrictions will apply. There will be limited CP1 to CP transfers, migrations and WLTO allowed if FTTC or SOGEA exist, and the ordered product has a speed profile of FTTC/ SOGEA 40 /10
• Once a premises has been enabled for GEA-FTTP post stop sell being implemented, order restrictions will apply immediately for any new requests received 
• If a premises does not have GEA-FTTP available, SOGfast, SOGEA, GEA-FTTC, SOTAP, (where no fibre available), MPF and WLR (until September 2023) will be available

My reading of that is if FTTC/WLR is already active then a migration to a 40/10/WLR (only) product is allowed. I'd bet that not many ISP's systems will allow it though. Probably too complicated to implement the rules in their automated systems, they see FTTP Priority and reject any FTTC order (badly by the look of @munkfish 's initial post )

There's also the option to speak to us to renew at a cheaper deal on your current package.

@munkfish TBH that's probably the simplest and least risk approach...

[#9]

---

@MisterW wrote:

@munkfish is your exchange actually a 'stop sell' or just a 'fibre priority' exchange ? Maybe you could post the result from the BT availability checker https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL ( redact any personal info such as phone/address ).

If it's just a Fibre priority then you SHOULD be able to move ISP's provided you already have an FTTC product and are moving to a 40/10 FTTC product. That's not to say that the ISP systems are able to handle this situation!

---

Thanks for the reply.

I was trying to figure out how to do quoting on this forum, I'm sure it used to be a lot easier and then I look at your post and I guess it's not just me, I see you just italicize stuff for inline quotes.   Thought it was just me not working it out... wasn't in the mood for going into HTML mode.

Anyway to the point... thanks Gandalf for posting exchange info and analysis, not much to add really, it's both fibre priority and stop/sell so no option to move to another provider on the same FTTC/VDSL package.

[#10]

---

@MisterW wrote:

@Gandalf thanks for that.

From what I can see , the exchange doesnt have the WLR withdrawal flag set , just the Fibre priority.

Therefore according to this https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/the-all-ip-programme/stopsell-updates

Summary of FTTP Priority Exchange stop sell rules:

• Stop sell applies at a premises level only where that premises has access to an available GEA-FTTP product
• Where a premises has access GEA-FTTP new supply order restrictions will apply. There will be limited CP1 to CP transfers, migrations and WLTO allowed if FTTC or SOGEA exist, and the ordered product has a speed profile of FTTC/ SOGEA 40 /10
• Once a premises has been enabled for GEA-FTTP post stop sell being implemented, order restrictions will apply immediately for any new requests received 
• If a premises does not have GEA-FTTP available, SOGfast, SOGEA, GEA-FTTC, SOTAP, (where no fibre available), MPF and WLR (until September 2023) will be available

My reading of that is if FTTC/WLR is already active then a migration to a 40/10/WLR (only) product is allowed. I'd bet that not many ISP's systems will allow it though. Probably too complicated to implement the rules in their automated systems, they see FTTP Priority and reject any FTTC order (badly by the look of @munkfish 's initial post )

I missed what @Gandalf said at the end of a post above about it being interesting that they say VDSL may still be available... from a very brief foray into trying to move provider though I think there must be some kind of flag somewhere that's blocking a move to another FTTC/VDSL service.

When I tried to get a quote from a 'cheaper' place like Shell for a similar VDSL package, I got the error message 'phone line and address don't match'.  When I went on Vodafone's site they basically just croaked and said 'we can't provide broadband to your address' (which is odd because they allegedly DO offer FTTP services).  So there's something stopping a migration to a similar vdsl package for our address/exchange.

However if I go to a more expensive provider that definitely does provide FTTP (I tried Zen and IDnet), both of them will ONLY offer FTTP servies - no mention at all about VDSL.  Again suggesting there is definitely something afoot to steer us towards FTTP / that there is a stop sell on VDSL.

There's also the option to speak to us to renew at a cheaper deal on your current package.

@munkfish TBH that's probably the simplest and least risk approach...

---

This is looking like the easiest option at the moment yes!

[#11]

I was trying to figure out how to do quoting on this forum, I'm sure it used to be a lot easier and then I look at your post and I guess it's not just me,

@munkfish its not just you. You're right it used to be a lot easier , then the forum moved to Lithium!

So there's something stopping a migration to a similar vdsl package for our address/exchange.

My guess is that most (if not all) ISP's systems can't cope with the complicated Openreach rules for allowing FTTC in the FTTP priority case. It's probably not cost effective to design the systems to handle this situation assuming that there is a small number of people who would wish to stay on a 40/10 FTTC product, so they just ignore it and reject any FTTC transfer.

[#12]

Yes you're probably right.  There's not much incentive for ISPs to do it either (allow VDSL migrations); if an exchange is FTTP priority, clearly the exchange is gearing up towards moving to FTTP and in general the direction of travel is towards phasing out PSTN anyway (not that long away either at the end of 2025 for a nationwide stop sell, seems far too close!).  Probably not that economically viable to continue to try and grab VDSL customers any more in that case.

I'm surprised there hasn't been more about it on the news and in the media.  No doubt the next couple of years will see that change as more and more people are booted off their old packages and left scratching their head as to what's happened and what's next.  Cue outrage at being forced onto fibre!

For me initially the biggest issue I had (and I'm sure others will also have) was the idea that I was being forced onto a more expensive option with speeds I just don't want or need.  More speed is always nice but I don't really need that much, 38Mbps is more than enough at the moment for occasional UHD viewing and downloading large Xbox games.  But as mentioned above there are cheaper options on FTTP... I think I just always thought of FTTP as ultra high speed only which apparently isn't the case.

One question I do have is how long do we have if we do decide to stay on our current VDSL package at Plusnet?    The stop sell started in Jan 2022 for our exchange and I think I read somewhere it ends after a year, so at that point does it mean the PSTN provision will be removed?  Jan 2023?  Not that far off, can't be right can it?  Is an issue if we decide to stick with current VDSL package and have, say, a 1 year contract.  What happens after 6 months in Feb 2023 when/if the PSTN provision is removed, do we lose our VDSL connection?

[#13]

@munkfish 

Your VDSL product should continue as long as you want it. However, what PlusNet will do with your phone line is unknown. It is the PSTN that's being withdrawn (your phone service) not the copper line from your cabinet to your house which is used for VDSL.

In general FTTP is far more stable than VDSL.

Brian

[#14]

@munkfish 

There is confusion between PSTN moving over to VoIP and the introduction of fibre. They are not connected. VoIP is alive and well and has been working on cabled telephone services for years. If the PSTN is switched off in your area then landline phones will simply need an ATA adaptor to work over the current internet connection, be it copper or fibre based. The copper based FTTC connection comes to your home from the FTTC street cabinet, not the telephone exchange where the PSTN equipment lives.

If there was a decision to remove all the copper and replace it with fibre then apart from the hassle the only effect should be a more reliable, potentially much faster connection, of which, depending on your needs and budget, you may or may not want to take advantage.

The current fly in the ointment is that Plusnet do not currently offer a VoIP service on their Fibre connections, but we are talking of the future and no doubt a solution will be announced in due course.

[#15 · Accepted solution]

Just to update / 'close' this thread - I've opted to stay with Plusnet for the time being on the same 38Mbps + line rental package.  Thanks to everyone who contributed.