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IPv6 - what's the problem?

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robinm
Hooked
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Registered: ‎23-03-2015

IPv6 - what's the problem?

Hello.

I have spent a little time recently researching IPv6, as I have an Apple router and related kit that supports it. I have successfully set up a tunnel, as I see that, from these boards and other sites, Plusnet doesn't seem at all interested in supporting it. Given the fact that both Plusnet's parent and competitors are rolling IPv6 out at a rate of knots (for instance see here), what is the problem? Is it that, for example, because BT is now the owner of the business, it sees Plusnet as a loss leader?

I do know, that although the service I've had for the last 18 months or so has been largely stable and problem-free, I will seriously have to consider taking my business elsewhere. That is, of course, unless Plusnet's parent is prepared to invest in upgrading infrastructure. For a start, how about allowing DNS AAAA lookups? Providing IPV6 capable routers as standard? IPv6 isn't just for end users who are prepared to put in the effort. Some of those folk are Plusnet customers and some, like me, will consider walking away as IPV6-only sites become the norm. What about those who will lose out because they just can't get to parts of the web?

Come on, it's time this issue was shifted up to top priority.

Regards

Robin.

10 REPLIES
bsmith1
Hooked
Posts: 9
Registered: ‎30-03-2013

Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

I agree, the pilot was running months ago but Plusnet was been totally silent.

 

Its a poor show. 

Baldrick1
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

You have to accept that Plusnet is BT’s budget ISP. Any service enhancements that costs money will be low priority  until there is a strong business case before implementation. Currently few budget subscribers know what IPv6 is, let alone consider moving on so to be able to use it.

Moderator
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

Moderator's note by Dick (Strat): Topic moved to IPv6 Trial board.

Customer and Forum Moderator. Windows 10 Firefox 63.0.3 (64-bit)

karjala
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Registered: ‎04-03-2014

Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

Yes, it’s a poor show indeed!

 

summers
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

If I had to hazard a guess its because Plus Net has no reason to move to IPv6.

 

Probably they still have IPv4 address available, so they aren't forced to use IPv6 due to lack of addresses.

 

Probably not 100% of there hardware will automatically work on IPv6.

 

Its not obviously important amongst  most of there customers, who just want and network connection, and don't care of the details.

 

If I had to hazard a guess, BT will at some stage switch to IPv6, and as both plusnet and BT have common ownership, plusnet then notices a cost saving can be made by them switching to IPv6 as well.

bmc
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Registered: ‎28-02-2017

Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?


@summers wrote:

If I had to hazard a guess its because Plus Net has no reason to move to IPv6.

 


 

Agreed. It would cost money which PlusNet currently has no need to spend.

 

I would suspect that as equipment is replaced as part of normal operations the replacements will have IPV6 capabilities. When the time comes a significant part of their network will be ready with a smaller spend to replace the part that isn't.

 

The savings from not diving in will more than offset the loss of those customers who need to move to get IPV6.

 

There's a little mentioned fact that as more companies and ISP's adopt IPV6 their IPV4 addresses become available for use thereby abating the urgency to move due to lack od IPV4 addresses.

 

Brian

MJN
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?


@bmc wrote:

 

There's a little mentioned fact that as more companies and ISP's adopt IPV6 their IPV4 addresses become available for use thereby abating the urgency to move due to lack od IPV4 addresses.

 

The reason it is not often mentioned is likely because it isn't true. ;-) 

When an ISP adopts IPv6 its dependency on IPv4 tends not to reduce as their customer base still needs access to the IPv4 Internet. Carrier grade NAT is expensive and only really makes business sense for mobile providers whose networks already tend to operate like that. 

SimonHobson
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Registered: ‎30-07-2007

Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?


@summers wrote:

Probably they still have IPv4 address available, so they aren't forced to use IPv6 due to lack of addresses.

CGNAT - no ISP is forced to go IPv6, and even if they do, then for the foreseeable future their customers still need IPv4 connectivity. CGNAT allows then to give customers an RFC1918 address (of which there are 4 million in the 10.0.0.0/8 block) and NAT multiple customers behind a small number of IPs.

If I had to hazard a guess, BT will at some stage switch to IPv6, and as both plusnet and BT have common ownership, plusnet then notices a cost saving can be made by them switching to IPv6 as well.

That ship went past years ago - BT Retail has had IPv6 by default for several years, as have Sky, and ... Clearly a lot of ISPs have added IPv6 given that stats from the likes of Google show that just over 20% of their access is now over IPv6 globally, and for the UK it's almost 22%. I doubt that any of those ISPs have been "forced" to add native IPv6 - but they have done, presumably because they've looked ahead and realised that they will need to sooner or later so they might as well be part of the solution rather than part of the problem.

https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html


@bmc wrote:

I would suspect that as equipment is replaced as part of normal operations the replacements will have IPV6 capabilities. When the time comes a significant part of their network will be ready with a smaller spend to replace the part that isn't.

On that basis, their network should be pretty well all IPv6 ready by now - how many years is it since they ran the first IPv6 trial ? However I've read comments that their standard customer router doesn't do IPv6 properly - but given that it's more or less the same router and BT Retail provide with a different badge on, it's hard to see what the problem could be.

There's a little mentioned fact that as more companies and ISP's adopt IPV6 their IPV4 addresses become available for use thereby abating the urgency to move due to lack od IPV4 addresses.

Not really. I doubt that many are handing back their IPv4 allocations just yet. Perhaps a few, but that will be just a drop in the ocean - not enough for others to sit back and say "plenty to go around now".

As you say, there's almost certainly an element of manglement having sat down, done the sums, and decided that they'll lose less because of disgruntled customers than it'll cost them to do IPv6 properly Roll eyes

EDIT: It's just a pity that their manglement won't just come out and say what their plans are. All we get are people (apologies for anyone a bit higher up posting here) down in the ranks telling us that "something will be happening" - presumably because that's what the official line is internally.

summers
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?

@SimonHobson I don't think my plusnet account has *ever* been on a 10.0.0.0/8 address. I'm currently on an 81.174.128.0/18 address. I know that plusnet did trials in CGNAT but I havn't seen any sign that it has been rolled out. Does anyone know any different?

On the plusnet hardware, @bobpullen said in the post pinned at the top of this topic, that the BNG routers hadn't yet been configured to do IPv6, and that the BNG routers were the main plusnet ones. Now this was in 2016, but I've heard nothing new since then.

SimonHobson
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Re: IPv6 - what's the problem?


@summers wrote:

@SimonHobson I don't think my plusnet account has *ever* been on a 10.0.0.0/8 address. I'm currently on an 81.174.128.0/18 address. I know that plusnet did trials in CGNAT but I havn't seen any sign that it has been rolled out. Does anyone know any different?

 I didn't say Plusnet were using CGNAT (yet), but some will be out of necessity. It's notable that on mobile connections you generally only get an RFC1918 address.

On the plusnet hardware, @bobpullen said in the post pinned at the top of this topic, that the BNG routers hadn't yet been configured to do IPv6, and that the BNG routers were the main plusnet ones. Now this was in 2016, but I've heard nothing new since then.


 Exactly - statement two years ago and nothing since Roll eyes

I've moved, got married, gained a grand-daughter (now nearly 2), and moved again since Plusnet ran their IPv6 trials.That rather puts things into perspective !