SMTP error 452

[#1]

I'm just monitoring this, and getting details as required. 

[#2]

452 error sending from freeonline account exactly as described by previous posters, has been going on and off since September. Ping relay.free-online.net returns:

PING mail.freeonline.enmail.co (91.204.208.193) 56(84) bytes of data.

and times out.

[#3]

Those servers do not respond to pings by design; therefore ping as a diagnostic tool has no value.  If the servers were dead you’d not get a 452 error.

[#4]

I have just looked at the results of my testing yesterday (sending from a Force9 address to another of my f9 mailboxes every 5 minutes from 9:51 to 21:17). Apart from only 1 hour when all worked from 10am-11am, all others matched previous patterns by failing 452 at varying times from 31 minutes past hour but working again from 1 minute past.  No further tests are planned, until news that it has been fixed.

Though it is getting bloody annoying - just had another real email fail!

[#5]

Both my mother and I are on Plusnet (different ISP accounts). I've never experienced the problem myself, but my mother gets it now and again.

How many emails is "too many"? My mother says she's only sent three emails today and yet she's getting the error both on emails to my PN address and to my Gmail address, sending just to the one recipient in each case. I don't she'd know how to send to a large dlist or to more than one indiviually named recipient.

She's sending from a .force9.co.uk From address, using SMTP server relay.force9.net port 25, (with authentication for SMTP using the same credentials as for POP) while connected to PN internet. That's sending from Outlook (Office Pro) 2024. I'm not sure what happens if she sends from the Samsung email client on her Android phone.- ie is the problem device-specific.

[#6]

No the problem is a volume amalgamation issue, compounded by the amount of spam currently being generated.

@plusnettony 

[#7]

I was one who reported major problems with Force9 mail sending in September, when if I tried to send an email after 30 minutes past in any hour it was almost certain the send would fail with a 452 error.

Recently I have had few problems, but then I have not sent many emails!

To check this, for the last week or so I have been running a routine which sends one email in the last 5 minutes of every hour between 9am and 10pm. Most days there have been no failures, but nearly 50% of days have one or two hours which fail.

It seems that the problem has vastly reduced, but can still occasionally happen. This suggests that although the aggregation must be still wrong, whatever provoked it in September has gone away ... for the moment.

@plusnettony It would be interesting to know from PN if the cause was ever identified, and if any fixes were applied?

[#8]

I believe work has been done to improve the situation. The lack of contacts I'm getting and from what I've read on the forums, it certainly seems to have worked. 

[#9]

Was the September occurrence related to Force9?

The massive manifestation of this issue was with the plus.com cohort.

As advised previously the issue is amalgamation of the total volume of emails being sent: the abatement of spam volumes and the migration of Force9 users does a lot to mitigate the total volume passing through the Plusnet services … all from the same IP address.

[#10]

Yes - I have been with Force9 since dial-up days! (See previous posts)

The error to me means it is objecting to the number of emails I have sent - i have never seen any clear statement of if or how sends are 'accumulated'

Due to be Greenbyd early next month.

[#11]

---

@mavison wrote:

... it is objecting to the number of emails I have sent

That is where the misunderstanding starts!  How is "I" defined in this context?

• Email address
• Mailbox
• Mail account
• Connected device
• Connected network...

Volume limiting is done at various levels; in times past we have seen thresholds breached with overseas users and those using some VPN proxy gateways.  The detailed mechanisms (like many security measures), are never fully disclosed.

[#12]

My assumption was that "I" was the total from my PN account, including all devices, addresses, and from any IP address. But it seems to include other sources totally outside my control.

[#13]

Fingers crossed, but I haven't seen it since the Greenby Migration!

[#14]

Ironically, after my post yesterday, I had 452 errors at 20:57 and 22:57 yesterday evening! 

It will be interesting to see in 3 weeks if my migration makes any difference.

[#15]

So is it related to the number of emails that a given user Y (with addresses X@Y.force9.co.uk) sends, or is it the number of emails that all users (all the Ys) send through relay.force9.net?

I have seen it happen where no emails have been sent from user Y for ages, and then the sending of the first email causes the problem. Is it significant that it tends to happen when sending from an X@Y.force9.co.uk address (my mother's) to an A@B.plus.com address (my own)?

As an aside, what is the prgramme for migrating to Greenby? Should all users have had the initial "it will be happening - watch the this space" email, if not also the "this is your 60-day warning of when it will happen"? My mother has had neither, and we have only had the "watch this space" notification.