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Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi PlusNet Care team
Got a bit of a mystery here. Just as I was going to bed last night, the broadband went down for some substantial period at 1am (which I later found out was maintenance in the Bristol area) however, when it came back on, and I ran a speedtest at various websites, I seem to have lost some speed from 73 down to 70.
Now I know its not much, and i'm not being fussy, its just the principle of it, because before maintenance everything was fine, but I feel like a fault has developed or theres an issue with sync, because all through today, the speedtests wont budge over 70.
Either I've somehow lost that speed, or the maintenance has done something to the line profile.
I rang last night and spoke to a rep in the call centre, but got fobbed off that it was a fluctuation and that he got fluctuations in speed, which to be honest is bull, because the lines been a stable 73 meg since we joined plusnet. So forgive me, but your rep I spoke to last night was not in the least bit helpful.
Can a care team member look into this and raise a fault please ? your rep last night said that line training had not kicked in, but I don't believe him because last time I saw this exact same behaviour with speed, it was because of line training which, after 3 days, resolved itself and the speed went backup to 73.
The other reason I say im not being fussy is because, im fortunate where I live, your lucky if theres like 10 people at most on FTTC (mostly elderly folk) so crosstalk at the cabinet cant be the problem ? everything was fine up until maintenance las night. It may even be the profile needs resetting or adjusting. The line profile is 78 meg, and as I say 73 has been the actual speed since day 1.
If a rep can get back id appreciate it.
Thanks
26 REPLIES
Acassim
Grafter
Posts: 1,075
Thanks: 1
Registered: 11-06-2007

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi Ericgripp,
Sorry to hear you've seen a drop in speed.
I've taken a look into this for you and run a couple of intrusive test on your line and I can't see where you're being restricted as everything seems consistently higher than the 70mbps throughput you're seeing. I have a feeling that the agent you spoke with will have run through the same testing that I just have and there really is nothing to indicate any profile issues.
Looking at the profile on our side, you're currently set at 78mbps and as you can see on the  first scrennshot below, you're not banded in any way which can be seen on the '0.12M-80M Downstream, Interleaving Off' status. In addition to this I thought it could be a problem with the BRAS and DSLAM profile where we have seen a mismatch however this is consistent as you can seen in the second screenshot.
Would you be able to run a BT speed test and then run the 'Further Diagnostics' via a wired connection and post us a scrennshot of the results please?
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi Adam
Thanks for taking the time to follow up. Admittedly i'm a bit tired right now because the internet went down just as I was going to bed and as a result lost an hours sleep on this checking/testing various computers in the house to see if it was a machine issue or a plusnet problem.
The reason I was adamant it could be line training, is we have an occasional problem where our mains power trip box will occasionally go off (sorted now) but last time it happened, the router was on/off/on/off/on/off which forced line management into play. When this happened I saw the same problem where the speed would drop by about 3 to 5 meg. However after a few days it resolved itself and speeds were back to normal.
I appreciate your rep last night did the same tests, but I was tired, took his word for it and went to bed, but when I say fobbed off, I meant that I have never had a reason to call support (only when our mains power has gone off) and the connection has been rock solid for which I cant fault you for its been excellent. So for him to say it was a fluctuation in speed I thought was wrong. Ive never seen fluctuations because again where I am, its all old retired people, so crosstalk at the cabinet I can see being an issue for a long time.
When I get home from work I will follow up and post back the current stats/tests. It was either down to last nights maintenance, and I may very well find when I get home, its resolved itself. Or the issue is still present and I will need to follow up with you guys via phone.
Again thanks for the response.
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi Adam
Just got home and line is still showing degradation, please see attached screenshots below.
I did try disconnecting the modem in the web gui, powered it off, then powered off the BT FTTC Modem. Waited a few minutes then powered the BT FTTC modem on then powered the plusnet modem back on and its not made a difference. Whatever was done last night has upset the connection  Undecided currently on the phone to see if I can get a reset on the profile.

ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi Adam
Just spoken to a helpful rep (not sure if I'm allowed to mention names so wont for now) but even though the line isn't in retraining mode, I still have to wait 72 hours for the speed to resume to where it was. So now my understanding is even if your line is in re-training (due to a power cut knocking the modem on/off), or even if you turn the modem off (which I usually do via disconnect by logging into the web panel panel gui then switch off at the back) then no matter what you have to wait 72 hours for usual service. Note I only ever turn off the modem in extreme circumstances as im aware it has to be left on.
The thing that's new to me is the fact we have to wait 72 hours now no matter what, maybe this could be made clearer in future ? also why was I not told this last night that even though my line isn't retraining, I would still need to wait 72 hours for it to resolve. This would have eased my mind but also avoided me having to chase yourself and the reps on the phone.
I always leave my modem on, and as I said to the rep a relative of mine who has sky fibre can turn the modem off then back on without losing any speed at all. So it seems plusnet systems are more sensitive than competitors products.
Long story short I've agreed to wait 72 hours (unfortunately I tried powering off then back on the plusnet and bt modems so I've reset the timers) and in 72 hours from now if the speeds still have not resumed I will ask for an SNR reset.
As I said to the rep, I am cross that this has resulted from overnight maintenance ! why should customers lose speed and have to wait 3 days for service to resume because of it ? the way the maintenance has been done is very bad. Ive been with plusnet over a year now and never had speed loss because of maintenance, only as I said previously, down to when we have lost mains power in the house.
So yeah lets see what 72 hours brings.
Acassim
Grafter
Posts: 1,075
Thanks: 1
Registered: 11-06-2007

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi again Ericgripp,
Glad to hear that you've been in touch and sorry to hear that this still hasn't resolved itself. As mentioned before, would it be possible for you to provide us with the BT speed test at the link I provided in the initial reply? Speedtest.net is a handy service but we do sometimes glean more in-depth information from the BT speed tester which could be valuable in this instance for diagnosing the drop.
With regards to maintenance, this can be a tough one to really do much about as this is all handled by BT with it being their exchange and equipment, it's just unfortunate that in some circumstances, people may see a drop in speed.
Ideally this should return to it's previous speed however it could be a tough one to push further with regards to a fault given that anything working within the estimated speed ranges would be rejected by our supplier. As mentioned by the agent you spoke with last night, I think time will tell on this one when you take into account that no profile or banding is holding the line speed back. 72 hours isn't really a hard and fast rule but if we're going to see some change then it ought to be within that kind of time frame.
gofaster
Rising Star
Posts: 365
Thanks: 12
Registered: 01-08-2007

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Quote from: Adam
would it be possible for you to provide us with the BT speed test at the link I provided in the initial reply?

Did you not notice the BT speed test results that eric posted as test2?
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Hi Adam
As go faster mentions, the BT test is second picture attached. I appreciate what you mention, but maintenance shouldn't cause a loss in sync. I've never had the need to phone or raise a fault before as the connection is rock solid so I know what the limits are of the line in terms of speed, i'm not expecting 80 megs on the doorstep,  id just like an explanation as to why I have lost sync (which I do find disappointing that the PlusNet modem doesn't give a down/up sync speed figure, then I could be more precise in my figures with you, I just know that after the maintenance the sync speed dropped, the line isn't in training, so what's gone wrong to cause a loss of sync speed ? )
As I mentioned to your agents, my friend on a competitors product doesn't suffer loss in speed for 72 hours. I know the line itself is not that long and the distance from the fibre termination in the cabinet to the house is within stones throw. So im surprised I only see 73 meg and not 76 (which I believe is FTTC limit) but i've been happy with 73 meg for over a year now.
To lose further sync after maintenance i'm struggling to understand, there's been no physical change to the path the cable takes to the cabinet, nothings changed internally, theres no way it could be cross talk at the cabinet because where I live is mostly elderly people, so the take up in FFTC from our cabinet would be low, so I ask again how do you lose sync speed ? either BT did something in the maintenance, or there is a fault on the line.
If after the 72 hours its still stuck, I will give you guys a call to get the SNR reset. I doubt I will leave plusnet over a loss of 3 megs, but if it gets worse then yes I would reconsider my options. People reading this may think that's extreme to say that, but in the past I waited over 3 months to get BT to pull their finger out and sort a fault, I rely on the connection as I do have to work from home, so I cant be waiting extended periods of time to return a line to working condition, ie how it has worked since we joined you over a year ago.
Anyway lets wait and see what happens.
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,824
Thanks: 1
Registered: 27-10-2012

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

It's unlikely to be maintenance as you should remain synced with the cabinet - unless something was done specifically on the cabinet.
There are a small number of errors on your line from what Adam C posted. Although it doesn't look like you've crossed the threshold for DLM to intervene.
There's not such thing as a Snr reset for FTTC - basically the target is 6 and the line will adapt automatically to meet that target. DLM can only be reset by an Openreach engineer.
Were the speed tests you did in the evening? Can you try one in the daytime?
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

Well im now more confused than ever
So there is a fault with the line ? so whats with the 72 hours nonsense ?  Sad even though the speedtest was done during an evening, I don't see speed fluctuations so a test done during the day or at night will show the same thing, at least it always has done so in the past.
Edit, my son sent me this about 5 minutes ago, i'm just getting him to run the BT further diagnostics test
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,824
Thanks: 1
Registered: 27-10-2012

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

There's a difference between errors and a fault though. There can be a small number of errors on a line for a variety of reasons, but this should not affect anything. When there are a large number of errors during a 24 hour period, DLM intervenes to adjust the line to correct these errors.
If your line is still syncing at 80/20Mb, then there should have been no DLM intervention.
Sometimes in the evening, particularly during busy periods, there can be a bit of a fluctuation in your speeds. I can run a speed test every hour of the day and get a slight difference during certain periods. Here's my speed results for the last week to show this:
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

I appreciate what your saying Andy but ive never noticed or seen fluctuation no matter how hard I try. After I got connected and let the line settle, I ran nothing but speedtests and could not even get the speed to fluctuate, and it still didn't up until a week ago. I don't suffer and never have suffered with speed fluctuations on an evening.
I'm sorry but focusing on speed fluctuation is wrong here, I appreciate your help but lets not deflect from the issue here. As you can see from my post above, speeds are still stuck at 70, and im sure they will still be 70 when I get home. As for work to the cabinet im not sure, but I've certainly not authorised any work to be done on the line.
And im concerned you say there's no such thing as an SNR reset when PlusNet team on the phone have told me they can do this ?
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,824
Thanks: 1
Registered: 27-10-2012

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

If your line is still syncing at 80/20 without interleaving, then nothing should have changed.
Resetting the DLM for FTTC (which Plusnet themselves cannot to) won't achieve anything for you because you will already synced at the fastest possible rate. Openreach will only reset the DLM if there is a fault on your line, which there does not appear to be.
What was the BT Wholesale maintenance for your area?
Edit: You could also try disconnecting/reconnecting from your router admin page to end up on a different Plusnet gateway. Sometimes that might make a small difference also.
ericgripp
Grafter
Posts: 182
Registered: 26-04-2013

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

H Andy
Agreed, I don't know if PlusNet get the 80/20 from the exchange or the cabinet where the fibre node terminates, but from their end it is looking to have synched a max rate.
However from the property end, the speed has dropped, but I cant tell what the exact sync figure is because plusnets modem does not show this unlike other modems out there, so I can tell you if from the property the sync speed has dropped, but the throughput ie the measure of how fast a speedtest is HAS dropped.
Re maintenance - see 18th August (when this started)
Posted on: Monday 11 August 2014, 13:41
When's this work happening?
Early hours most days this week.
What does it affect?
Broadband connectivity.
How long will it take?
Up to six hours each time.
What does the work involve?
We've received notifications from our suppliers about maintenance work that is scheduled to take place in the following areas this week. This work typically takes place between Midnight and 6am.
12th August
Birmingham, Havant, Sheffield, Preston, Milton Keynes, Manchester, Ipswich, Hemel Hempstead and Exeter.
13th August,
South Elmsall, Plymouth, Glasgow, Ipswich, Crawley, Manchester, Oldham and Nottingham
14th August
Preston, Manchester, Bury, Southend, Oxford, Pontefract, Plymouth, Shrewsbury, Salisbury, Swansea, Yeovil, Nottingham, Weymouth and Guildford.
15th August
Liverpool, Manchester, Glasgow, Bristol and Cardiff.
18th August
London Stepney Green, Reading, Birmingham, Bristol and Reading.
Although these are the areas we have been notified of, due to the nature of the broadband network these outages may affect customers nationwide. There are also a number of smaller exchange works most nights of the week that may cause smaller outages at individual exchanges.
Am I likely to notice the work?
Yes, there's a chance that you may be disconnected from the internet for a period of time during the maintenance window.
Is there anything else I need to know?
Any customers having problems connecting once the maintenance is complete are advised to log into their router interface and click connect.
Kind Regards,
Chris Purvey
Customer Relations
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,824
Thanks: 1
Registered: 27-10-2012

Re: Speed issue since last nights maintenance - possible Fibre fault ?

The 80/20 is your sync speed with the cabinet.
This is the PEW for that day:
Quote
BT is implementing a one-touch project to upgrade MSE, MSC, IEA, EES and EEA devices at ( London Stepney, Birmingham West Bromwich, Chipping Sodbury, Filton, Milnsbridge, Hamilton Avon, Reading, Bristol Cabot, Bradwell Abey, Tunbridge Wells, Muswell Hill, Clacton On Sea). This involves a software upgrade and some hardware changes on the device in a single night under (Program 45 - 7750 Software Upgrade).

This maintenance work will have had nothing to do with your connection to the cabinet, it's further up the network.
I would suggest disconnecting/reconnecting to see if you get better speeds. There are many routes/end points your connection can take to get to Plusnet's data centres in London and there will be small differences sometimes in performance.