Speed drop - broadband unusable

[#1]

Chris
I have just taken a look at the ping graph, igone this mornings happy bundle of red, this was due to the line being disconnected whilst the engineer was trying to track the fault, its this afternoons debacle which I am finding confussing, as the line was given the okay by the engineer.
Now got Router Stats running, does anyone know how to export the data out before I shut the machine down.

[#2]

Peter,
It the SNRM graphs we need to see - look here for my recommended settings http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,128606.msg1122269.html#msg1122269 - must write these up some time!
Kevin

[#3]

Townman
Sorry for the later reply, I think the line has settled down at a reasonable speed. It seemed to be trying to run @ 2.5Mb/s Friday afternoon when the disconnects happened. I have been updating my Steam games for the last two days and touch wood  :-X, it seems to have smoothed out @ 2.2Mb/s ish.
BTW, after Fridays afternoons drops, I have left the old DG834 plugged in as it seemed to recover any drops easier than the new N300.
Chris, sorry for jumping the gun Friday afternoon but I was concerned that the repair had already failed, should have known that the line would need to reset it's self. 
Peter

[#4]

Hi guys - bit of a necro post here, without broadband again. Have not reported it via the faults page as it is quite clearly a line fault, so much noise on the line and it is difficult to hear the other person.
We have got BT Openreach out on monday morning (13th October), hopefully this time they are better at finding the fault. Has only occured after the recent rain, although the speed had dropped to 1.5Mbs after the last issue.
What would be involed is switching to FFTC as there isa cabinet around 500mm from my house and the Engineer reckons we could get upto 38Mbs. One problem is that the mastersocket is some 4metres away from the nearest power lead and I would like to have only one modem / router, not the two (bt modem and plusnet router), was thinking of a BT homehub 5 / Draytech Vigor 2760n or Thomson TG589vn v3.
We already have and extension wire that runs around behind the wallpaper or would I need to invest in some CAT5 with RJ45 ends.
PS. using a BT wifi hotspot to use the internet and its faster than my normal connection.

[#5]

Hi Peter,
Good (in some ways) that the fault is clearly back again - it gives a better chance of the issue being located.  Wet weather / joint issues can be very hard to locate.
I would not advocate switching to fibre whilst you have known ADSL issues - best to get them cleared up first.
So your router is not in the master socket.  What is the wiring between the master socket and the extension - colours and connected pin info would be useful.
Generally speaking normal extensions are not suitable for FTTC installations.  A DATA extension option (up to 30m) is available and should be requested at the time of ordering.  If you do decide to upgrade, contact the cancellations / retentions / customer options team and see what deal you can hook.  Should be better than upgrading via the user portal.
Kevin

[#6]

Kevin
Thanks for the reply. I was going to hold off on the upgrade to FFTC until the line issue has been resolved. The last Engineer that came out said that the fibre line is to the cabinet and then switches to the old copper line and makes tracing the fault shorter.
The router has never been plugged into the mastersocket except for fault finding when the prevois problem arose. When we phoned BT to report a fault we used an old style phone (non digital) in the mastersocket with the router unplugged and he reported a fault on the line.
The interal wiring was installed around 15 years ago by a friendly BT Engineer and was  the connection was checked at the last visit (all for the cost of an extra cup of coffee and chocolate biscuits).
I though the internal wiring would not be sufficient for fibre, was trying not to have a wire trailings around door frames and skirting boards.
Regards
Peter

[#7]

Peter,
I'll ask the question differently.
Is the wire twisted pairs - colour/white+colour-trace ?
Are just pins 2&5 connected (not pin 3 bell)
If it is twisted pairs it might be possible to use that wiring to move the master socket to the other location and "back-wire" an extension socket to the current master socket.  This is not ideal as it moves the net work termination point but it might avoid a wiring hash-up.
Wiring 15 years ago could have been to one of the older standards (solid colour untwisted wires) and would not be at all suitable for carrying VDSL.
If you again get a friendly BTOR engineer rather than a particular sub-contractor you should be able to discuss the options over tea and biscuits.

[#8]

Kevin
Sorry for the slow reply, was waiting for the Engineers visit. Today he changed over two connections (500metres away from house) in the cabinet and pronouced that the line was okay and there was no noise, but he was also going to check the closest BT pit at the bottom of the road (50m) and would call us to let us know. Well after 2 hours of waiting I decided to go for a walk in the rain found that the cover had not been lifted, (blocked lifting points the give away) and no sign of said Engineer.
Tried the line and the crackling was still there. Tried to connect the internet and still no connection. Phone BT again to report a fault and was told that the line was clear and to leave 24hrs.
Just to elminate the internal wiring again I have tried a longer lead from the mastersocket, 3 microfilters and 2 routers.
Did a quiet line test (17070 option 2) and yep it still crackling, but when the router tried to connect there is a wooshing sound on the line which goes of when the router stops trying to connect.
Has anyone got any ideas other that ripping the whole lot out and going back to dark ages (sorry just how I feel right now), just paid £25 to get BT hotspot access for 5 days, at this rate fibre connection is out of the question completely.
Peter
As for using the internal wiring the Engineer said it was not suitable for fibre connection.

[#9]

Peter,
Having separate suppliers for voice / broadband is always going to be challenging.  You'll just have to keep hammering on the door of your phone provider or move your phone to PlusNET and put the whole problem into their hands.
Kevin

[#10]

Kevin
I was thinknig of moving over to plusnet for fibre and phone, surely BT still have to come out for any line problems. I will give the line another day, and do more testing my end and if it is still no good the of to the faults page we go - BT seem only to happy to fob people off 
Peter

[#11]

Peter,
That's just the point. BTOR does not do joined up fault management, they simply do that asked by the supplier (unless they deem there is not benefit).  If a phone provider (CP) realises you are reporting a copper fault because of broadband, they will try to get you to go to your ISP.  An ISP who is not also your CP cannot raise a pure copper fault.
In situations such as yours, there is no joined up problem solving.  With one provider for phone and broadband, the one provider is responsible for managing all problems, even though it is still BTOR doing the work.  In a situation synch as this it is easier to raise a copper / ADSL issue where the boundary is not clear.
Kevin

[#12]

Kevin
Would it be worth switching over to FTTC even though there is a fault on the line, would it force BTOR to actually do a proper fault trace, especially of the FTTC was not working at install  ;). From what I have been told by two engineers the fault on the copper line would only be between the FTTC cabinet and the house not the full distance from exchange to house. Roughly how long would the switch over take as I would need to work from home that day (the joys of being a cad draughtsman).
Sorry for all the questions, I would like to get the facts before switching over, although it seems the best option available to me. May have to speak to customer services tomorrow.
Had the line working for around 10 minutes earlier, got the amazing D/L speed of 0.05Mbs.
Regards
Peter

[#13]

Peter,
I cannot speak for PlusNET.
Personally I would not switch products whilst you have a known line fault.  Any issues you have in the early days of FTTC are going to be complicated by the presence of a line fault.  BTOR fibre install does not check out / fix any line faults.
They only circumstances in which a fault would not impact FTTC is if it is on the e-side.  The majority of noise faults are found on the d-side which is still used by FTTC.
Personally I'd move the phone to PN and then consider a FTTC upgrade when the issue is fixed.
Kevin

[#14]

Kevin
Just finished two days of testing directly into the mastersocket, still no joy. I have tried, 2 routers, 4 different microfilters. Had some luck today accoring to the ping graph but only for several minutes each time, unfortunately I was not in at the time and was not able to test the speed of the line.
I think its about time to raise a fault with Plus Net again, as I am having to pay out for BT hotsopt access.
Peter

[#15]

Peter,
If the fault remains with your copper circuit, then there is nothing PlusNET can do to assist.  This issue needs addressing by your phone (CP) provider.
Kevin