PlusNet Slower than TalkTalk for me :(

[#1]

Nice one. Good to see improved SNR and bit loading on the higher tones (generally those above 255). Dave, your reasoning for the improvement was exactly my thoughts, but it could equally just be improved noise conditions around the time of sync. What will be more of a teller will be what the Bits/Tone looks like in a couple of days, and what the SNRM looks like at this sort of time on an evening. Let's hope it all holds OK.

[#2]

Indeed, the significant extension of the graph into higher tones is very noticeable. If I had to bet on it I'd say largely down to simplifying the wiring as noted above.  
A comparison with the PN router would be interesting in due course.  
Finally, going back to the "famous last words" in the first post:

Quote from: DDNewCust

All equipment being the same here.

we now know you had a very dodgy PSU. Do you think that was the major factor that "broke the camels back" triggering all this good work?  

[#3]

I have learnt a lot and spent a load of time on monitoring to try and get things better, but mostly the wiring and set-up is the same as it was, apart from that detailed below.
I do appreciate the help and support you guys have given me.
As I said before I am not seeing any better downloads from fitting the Mrk3 vDSL plate and the near 1Mbs improved sync. I suspect that there is a profile capping or something going on somewhere in DLM or PlusNet end, only time will tell on that one.. At least I have the evidence to show there was an increase.
At the bottom of this post is the list of things I have done as per an earlier post, I have added 10)
The thing that broke the camels back was swapping from TalkTalk to Plusnet, that's when my big problems started. But in the background was the LED Lamp PSU in 1) (below) was partly tolerated by TalkTalk along with other lesser effectors.  Although I had more drop-outs when the LED Lamp PSU was on with TalkTalk, it recovered much quicker back to normal speeds with a off / on of the router or on it's own. The sync speed with TalkTalk was a little lower than I have now, but downloads were comparable / slightly lower. The SNRM  with TalkTalk was 6 to 9db most of the time.
I now have 3db SNRM with PlusNet after the line reset in 7) (below) and it is more stable and I don't have drop-outs / retunes of the router (which is currently the same). This has been the case since 7) stabilised and I started 8 ) and 9) occurred.
Number 1) (found before I joined this group) and 7) are the big ones and changing habits 8 ) & 9) from my testing . I suspect others are icing on the cake / more minor things which help slightly increase the sync speed. But they are a gain which probably equates to minor increase in PlusNet speeds after 7) and probably more stability, which stops the one way downward sync trip happening.
<snip>
For those reading the forum wondering what has happened to get the better download rates and a stable line here is a summary of my actions.
1) Removed noisy LED Lamp with rubbish China PSU. REIN testing found this. This was the BIG one for me.
2) Removed another noisy PSU away from Router mains connection. Monitoring router margin found this.
3) Removed earth wires in extensions, leaving just Pin 2 and 5.
4) Removed unwanted resistor in one of the extensions.
5) Replaced all extension filters with rat tail type, not sure this was required but I had them in router boxes anyway.
6) Tidied wiring around the router keeping cables away from each other.
7) Had PlusNet Reset the SNR limits at the exchange. Another BIG one without this the DLM may never have improved the line.
8 ) Stop turning the router off and back on, when I got frustrated with the line performance. This worked on TalkTalk but does not work on PlusNet / BT line.
9) Christmas went away and loads of people up the road packed away their lights and went back to work! Probably had some effect me thinks.
<end snip>
10) Added (2015-01-19) Mrk3 vDSL Plate to master socket, this improved modem sync speed by around 1Mbs but as yet (after 1 day) has made no difference to the download speed.
If 10) improves things over the nest few days, I will finally have better speeds with PlusNet than I did with TalkTalk along with more stability and that would really be a good thing to have ......

[#4]

Quote from: Anotherone

Nice one. Good to see improved SNR and bit loading on the higher tones (generally those above 255). Dave, your reasoning for the improvement was exactly my thoughts, but it could equally just be improved noise conditions around the time of sync. What will be more of a teller will be what the Bits/Tone looks like in a couple of days, and what the SNRM looks like at this sort of time on an evening. Let's hope it all holds OK.

AO, I have a number of Bits graphs (25 off) before the Mrk3 was fitted and none of them have the lift seen above tones 256. The Bits graphs were taken at various times of day and night but none later than 21:00. The only other factor that has changed is we have a frost at the moment.
The 3db to 1db dips seemed better many less of those last evening / night.
Dave

[#5]

With regard the download speeds, check your Current Line speed (Login required) - this should have updated to 12.7 but it may not have. Tell us what it is.
I would have hoped that the night-time dips would be less than previously, the connection is probably benefiting from the common-mode filter.

[#6]

Quote from: Anotherone

With regard the download speeds, check your Current Line speed (Login required) - this should have updated to 12.7 but it may not have. Tell us what it is. I would have hoped that the night-time dips would be less than previously, the connection is probably benefiting from the common-mode filter.

Well this morning the Mrs said the internet stopped. Checked a few things and decided to disconnect PPP wait and power router down, waited 15min and then turn everything I could find in the house off. Rebooted router.
I now have a connection as follows:-
Connection Rate:  14974  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 28    dB
Noise Margin:    3      dB
Max Rate:        16016  Kbps
Connection Rate:  1102  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 17    dB
Noise Margin:    5      dB
Max Rate:        1104  Kbps
Down interleave is ON at the moment. But I guess that may come off once it settles down.
So it appears that the Max rate has jumped up again from 14505 Kbs yesterday to 16016 Kbs today.
The Bits graph showing an increase of 1 to 2 bits across the tones ranging from 64 up to 502.
So I ran the BT tests,
1. Best Effort Test: -provides background information.
Download  Speed 11.64 Mbps
0 Mbps 21 Mbps
Max Achievable Speed
Download speedachieved during the test was - 11.64 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 4 Mbps-21 Mbps.
IP Profile for your line is - 13.21 Mbps
2. Upstream Test: -provides background information.
Upload Speed 0.94 Mbps
0 Mbps 0.83 Mbps
Max Achievable Speed
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 0.94Mbps
Additional Information:
Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 0.83 Mbps
We were unable to identify any performance problem with your service at this time.
Here is the report from PlusNet Member site notice the date seems old.... and the "current line speed" is seems limited, may be due to info from BT not reaching PlusNet?
Estimated line speed:
    11Mb (This may vary between 6.5Mb and 15Mb) - Checked on 2014-11-12 14:24:47
Current line speed:
    11.9 Mb
Finally yes the evening to night time dips seem very slightly from my bit graphs last one was taken 10:49 and didn't differ from the 17:19 in terms of SNR red line. This mornings on @10:42 has a minor drop in the 64 to 256 and a slight rise at the very upper end. A few pixels I would say on the image.
So the profile has gone up but the line speed has not.

[#7]

I've just updated the line speed for you now.
If you log into your router and disconnect then reconnect your connection you should see a increase.

[#8]

Quote from: DDNewCust

Down interleave is ON at the moment. But I guess that may come off once it settles down.

Maybe not, but you can turn it off (though not back on) yourself in the member centre.  
That could then give some errors and result in the target noise margin increasing.
On my line, having experimented with interleaving (which I used to have off, then at a customised low level when on LLU before PlusNet) I have decided to leave it on. The 3dB margin with interleaving is better for me than 6dB without, but your line may behave differently as that will depend on the type and level of interference.

[#9]

Quote from: Matthew

I've just updated the line speed for you now. If you log into your router and disconnect then reconnect your connection you should see a increase.

Matthew
Thank you.
Didn't need the disconnect, I got a new IP without that.
PlusNet Profile now 13.2Mbs
Ookla Speed tests indicates I am now getting 12.9 Mbs on the downloads and 0.93Mbs on the up.
Connection Rate:  14974  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 28    dB
Noise Margin:    3      dB
Max Rate:        16016  Kbps
Connection Rate:  1102  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 17    dB
Noise Margin:    5      dB
Max Rate:        1104  Kbps
@HPsauce,
Interleaving down still ON, I am not going to play with it but thanks for the heads up on that switch in the customer settings. I'll let it settle.
Dave

[#10]

Connection Rate:  14974  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 28    dB
Noise Margin:    3      dB
Max Rate:        16016  Kbps
Connection Rate:  1102  Kbps
Line Attenuation: 17    dB
Noise Margin:    5      dB
Max Rate:        1104  Kbps
PlusNet Profile now gone from 13.2Mbs to 12.7Mbs  over night
Connection rate and Max rate exactly the same, but did have a change in IP address last night.
Uptime (from SF Count):    0 days, 21:14:12    this morning.

[#11]

That's obviously a laggy Delta report from BT's servers that has come through the system. No doubt the current one will arrive in due course

[#12]

Quote from: Anotherone

That's obviously a laggy Delta report from BT's servers that has come through the system. No doubt the current one will arrive in due course

AO, You were right the 13.2Mbs Profile has now turned up! Thanks
Downloads were still pegged around 12Mbs on the ookla speedtester same as yesterday.
So I dropped the PPP then re-enabled it and bingo the ookla speedtester downloads up by 0.57Mbs now 12.57Mbs.
ADSL Link          Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed    14974 kbps 1102 kbps
Line Attenuation      28 db 8.5 db
Noise Margin         3 db 5 db.
Max Rate:        16016  Kbps
Down Interleave on
Now I am going to try a differnt modem/router with a slightly better processor, although having got these rates it seems a bit mad.

[#13]

Quote from: DDNewCust

Now I am going to try a different modem/router with a slightly better processor, although having got these rates it seems a bit mad.

Not run the BT wholesale test yet but it is looking better.....
ADSL Link        Downstream    Upstream
Link Rate          16083 Kbps    1201 Kbps
Line Attenuation    30.0 dB      17.0 dB
Noise Margin            3.0 dB          6.0 dB
Strange how the Line Attenuation jumped from 28db to 30db gone from 2Km to 2.2Km  . Obviously not, may be this one is the real length, although according to Kitz I am getting more rate than the line length should have... 15264 Kbs may be he old router was right...
But obviously the speeds have gone up, I don't want to use Routerstats at the moment so no other data.

[#14]

Just run the BT Wholesale tests with the new router modem.
If I get that profile my PlusNet download rates will be much higher than TalkTalk..... 
Do I have to wait a few days for them to come through from BT?
I'll wait for the "I told you so" on the router front. 
1. Best Effort Test: -provides background information.
Download  Speed 12.83 Mbps
0 Mbps 21 Mbps
Max Achievable Speed
Download speedachieved during the test was - 12.83 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 4 Mbps-21 Mbps.
IP Profile for your line is - 14.19 Mbps
2. Upstream Test: -provides background information.
Upload Speed 0.76 Mbps
0 Mbps 0.83 Mbps
Max Achievable Speed
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 0.76Mbps
Additional Information:  Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 0.83 Mbps
We were unable to identify any performance problem with your service at this time.

[#15]

Quote from: DDNewCust

Strange how the Line Attenuation jumped from 28db to 30db gone from 2Km to 2.2Km

Not really, different routers report it in different ways.
Some I think average the attenuation measured across the tones in use, others take a small sample or just one mid-range figure.
Good result though, what router got you over 16mbps?

Quote from: DDNewCust

I'll wait for the "I told you so" on the router front.

I recall in a very early post:

Quote from: HPsauce

Potential line speed is around 16mbps

So it's good to see you got there.