My line now seems to be permanently set at 135kbps

[#1]

If the problem isn't down to your router, there are two scenarios where changing ISP could help:

• If you could switch to broadband over Virgin cable (TV) service then you would eliminate any problems with your telephone line.


• If you have an unbundled telephone exchange and can switch to an unbundled provider you should avoid any possible faults in the BT exchange equipment and AFAIK the ridiculous BT DLM system.  You would need an ISP who actually does install their own equipment in the exchange, not one like Plusnet who will set the price lower but still use the BT equipment.

On the other hand, if you have been frustrated in your dealings with Plusnet in trying to sort out your speed problem just wait until you try dealing with some of the other ISPs out there!

[#2]

Just to be clear about this. On the whole over the last 10 months with Plusnet, I've no complaints, and if this had have been an easily solvable problem, then I wouldn't be writing this now. My complaint (apart from BT's DLM) is that Plusnets attitude is to blame the customers equipment (which is in fact Plusnets equipment). At first, its reasonable to expect the customer to check the equipment, exchange parts (assuming they have spares to play with), but its no help at all just to keep on telling them the same thing over and over again and basically calling your customer a liar by 'warning' them that they would be responsible for a £170 BT Engineer fee if they came out and found it was down to the microfilter, router or cable. Its no good just to keep on saying "try this and wait 3 days" in the hope that the line stabilises itself..

[#3]

Please understand that at no point have we called you a liar. We can only ever make you aware of the rules and restrictions placed on our service. This charge is levied by BT Openreach, not by us. We're well aware that many customers are unable to obtain alternate hardware which is why we can offer test hardware, when the fault reaches the 'awaiting appointment' stage.
As you have closed that fault ticket I raised for you (34263626) before the faults team were able to complete manual testing, there's not much that we can do. The offer to help is always open so if you'd like the faults team to investigate, please report this to them at http://faults.plus.net . It would make sense to reference ticket 34263626 in your fault so that the checks are clearly detailed.

[#4]

I visit people in their homes to solve their computer problems.  The vast majority of slow internet problems are of the clients own making or their own responsibility.  The most common cause of problems is failure to fit ADSL micro-filters on all sockets in use or fitting the filters incorrectly when there are multiple extensions.  I sometimes see problems due to bad internal telephone wiring.  BT have a device called an iPlate to combat that but I don't think Plusnet supply those.  As I already mentioned, sometimes the problem is down to a faulty router, or sometimes people misinterpret a bad wireless connection between the computer and the router as an internet problem.  One client plugged his fax machine into the broadband side of the ADSL filter then his IP Profile got stuck at the reduced value even after I corrected the miswiring!
If you have any type of telephone fault BT will threaten you with their £175 charge if they send out an engineer and it turns out to be something on your premises.  One client with a poor phone line and terrible broadband had BT out three times before the engineer discovered the line fault.  I don't know if she ever got a refund for the first two visits which were charged.
I think Plusent technical support are incredibly polite and far easier to deal with than the tech. support  of most ISPs.  I recommend you stick with Plusnet for at least a while longer, get them to supply another router and try that.  If it doesn't work then get a BT engineer to inspect the line, confident in the knowledge that you have eliminated everything that would be deemed to be your responsibility.   
   

[#5]

Thanks for your replies
Unfortunately that's exactly the condescending tone Plusnet have taken. Remember, the FIRST time it happened, I followed the instructons, and the SECOND time it happened I followed the instructions. The THIRD time it happened, I didn't follow the instructions, but had the same result. This last time, it just wouldn't reset itself, so I've had 135kbps (or thereabouts) for 2 weeks. I only have one computer (a wireless laptop), no peripherals. The router is in a room on its own with no other electrical equipment. It is plugged into the master socket, via the THIRD Microfilter and THIRD Cable I've tried. The only thing that hasn't changed is the PlusNet Thomson Router. The telephone cable goes through the wall, then outside, and I haven't touched it. The telephone works fine, and the broadband has worked fine for 5 years up until these problems.
Plusnet suggested I try a different Router. I don't have a different router. Its probably true that a customer might know at least one person who has a router they could try or vice versa, but its a bit cheeky to ask. If it 'is' the router, then you would cock-up your friends broadband for 3 days - or - if you tried it the other way round, they'd have to lend you their router for at least 3 days.At the end of all that, you wouldn't have really learnt anything because the line would have reset itself on its own, and merely by unplugging them to change them, you'd lose the speed for 3 days. Clearly, the answer is to send out a replacement router and ask the customer to send the old router back. Surely? If the fault carries on, then the BT Engineer should be called. I don't see that there's any place for a THREAT of a £170 charge.
Imagine if any other industry worked the same. You buy a TV from Curries. After a few months, it stops working properly, so you call them. They say they can send you an Engineer out but if its a problem with your internal wiring or the way you've connected it to the Satellite/Aerial, then they'll charge you £170 for the call-out. In no expert, but I've never in 20 years of home ownerhsip had any problems with my internal wiring suddenly, intermittently and repeatedly going slightly wrong. This does happen to electrical/electronic equipment.
As I sit here now, we haven't been near the equipment for over a week (not even in the same room), and its now up to 3MB. How can it be that after a week of not doing anything, its back up. How can that be anything to do with the wiring?
Life will go on in my family now. The router will continue to be untouched in the spare room, and at some point, yet again, the speed will inexplicably drop to 135kbps. When it does, Plusnet will tell me to change the microfilter, check the cable, plug into the Engineers socket and so on, just like the times before. They'll then tell me I've had multiple disconnections (whilst I was unplugging/plugging everything as they instructed).
I asked the question "How, EXACTLY, can a telephone wire or socket be reponsible for the intermittent drop-outs which drive the DLM to lower the line speed, and how EXACTLY would this be my responsibility (i.e. to pay £170 for someone to come out check the BT line (presumably for 3 daya) and tell me its my responsiblity, without fixing the problem). How also EXACTLY did Pusnets equipment become my responsibility? Do Plusnet really expect their customers to buy a new router every time their line speed drops, or pay out £170 to BT if the Plusnet equipment is faulty? The whole thing is just ridiculous.
Ah well, never mind eh? I'm only one customer. There are plenty more out there.

[#6]

Why can't the we reset the DLM, when it trades down, to see if the fault reoccurs, or switch it off if we want to? It would seem the easiest and cheapest way to proceed as a first step to resolve a problem that may have an explanation and/or may have gone away. If I choose to disconnect my router when I want and switch it off when not in use, (as my 9 year old Daughter wants me to "save the planet"!) why am I told that I must not - there is no sensible reason. If I want DLM disabled on my line, why not? Why can't I just access my own profile and reset it myself? - what harm would it do?  At the end of the day, surely the software does what you program it to.
The current DLM setup and palaver to get it reset seems to be there to deliberately annoy people and make life more difficult than it needs to be...or am I mistaken? It seems, as usual, that BT Wholesale want to ensure that the Customer comes last and BTW continue to exist for their own convenience...Grrrr!
Perhaps better to move to LLU where the ISP is in control of their own DSLAM & get rid of the obstructive and omnipotent  BT Wholesale altogether.
Have a nice day, y'all.

[#7]

Hear, hear !!

[#8]

Quote from: 135kbpshell

I asked the question "How, EXACTLY, can a telephone wire or socket be reponsible for the intermittent drop-outs which drive the DLM to lower the line speed, and how EXACTLY would this be my responsibility

One of the major cause of intermittent drop outs is down to the wiring to the telephone extensions. It is standard to connect the ring circuit from the master to the extensions sockets. Unfortunately this act as an antenna and can introduce noise on the A/B pair which will affect the higher frequencies the adsl signal use. So if you or any of your neighbours use electrically noisy motors (washing machines etc.) this could be the cause of your intermittent problems. The extensions wiring is the responsibility of the house owner and BT could charge if this was proved to the problem, hence the reason why PN request the modem to be plugged into the test socket in the master outlet.

I don't think this is your problem as I can't see from your replies that you have any extensions sockets, and it seem that you are plugged into the test socket at the master outlet. But if you have extension sockets it worth removing the ring wire at the master socket, which is terminal 3

[#9]

Plusnet will send out a test router for you to try, and I am surprised they have not already done this or offered it. I can speak from experience as I had a fault ongoing for over 6 months (yes 6 months....) That I interated over and over again that it was an exchange fault, but I did have to jump through the hoops BT put in place.  If you have tried a test router from plusnet, and you have done everything else, there is no way BT can charge you.  I have had over 7 engineers here, and all said there was no fault, when there was. They all happened to vist on the days it was OK. From what i have read, you need a BT engineer out, after plusnet have sent you a test router to try.  Sounds very much like an intermittant line fault though.  1 more thing to try is a quiet line test.... Dial 17070 from your phone, connected to the test socket, and then option2. If you hear any hissing, crackling or popping noises, then report it as a phone fault to you phone supplier. If this is BT, then when you report it, ON NO ACCOUNT mention broadband, or they will fob you off back to plusnet.

Quote from: BenTrimble

Quote How exactly? This depends on the results of their preliminary checks but they carry a laptop and modem to check for electrical noise / interference on the line, as well as HAWK, Eclipse and REIN test equipment.

@Ben,  sorry but the above is in my opinion absolute rubbish.  Most ADSL engineers are nothing of the sort, and I have alot of experience with them.  Some have even admitted they have had a couple of hours training. There are very few actual ADSL engineers out there.  As for performing HAWK tests, most of them dont even know what a HAWK line quality pair test is, and as for having REIN equipment, then thats just not true.  Sorry to sound negative, but after having the experiences I had with multiple BT engineers, I should know, they even admit it themselves.....  They are still using Voyager 105 modems to check 21CN and ADSL2+ lines for petes sake.  They will just run a few standard tests, and unless something shows up, they are then stumped.

[#10]

Quote from: itsme

Quote from: 135kbpshell One of the major cause of intermittent drop outs is down to the wiring to the telephone extensions. It is standard to connect the ring circuit from the master to the extensions sockets. Unfortunately this act as an antenna and can introduce noise on the A/B pair which will affect the higher frequencies the adsl signal use. So if you or any of your neighbours use electrically noisy motors (washing machines etc.) this could be the cause of your intermittent problems. The extensions wiring is the responsibility of the house owner and BT could charge if this was proved to the problem, hence the reason why PN request the modem to be plugged into the test socket in the master outlet. I don't think this is your problem as I can't see from your replies that you have any extensions sockets, and it seem that you are plugged into the test socket at the master outlet. But if you have extension sockets it worth removing the ring wire at the master socket, which is terminal 3 Sadly, this is again the kind of reply I've been getting constantly. A generic reponse, and then, "oh that's not you is it". The BT cable comes into my house through a small hole in the front wall, then through another hole in the wall from the hall through to my spare room. There is nothing else plugged into it, no extensions (there was [to our sky box], but we took it out). The wireless router is plugged directly into this master socket. I have one laptop, no peripherals. There are no elecrtical appliances in this room, and I'm in an end terrace house. The nearest electical appliance is about 5m away. This set-up hasn't changed since 2005. I've only had this problem with Plusnet. I already swapped the Microfilter and the cable that runs between the router and socket - 3 times. The only thing I haven't changed is the router. For me, the problem has to be the Router, the ISP, or BT. If its the cable, I'd have to follow it back to the exchange to change it. Surely, this is BT? If its the router, then surely its Plusnets responsibility. Electrical components normally have a 1 year manufactuers guarantee. Ours is 10 months old. The problem started as the same time as the world cup (the day of Englands first game). Co-incidence?

[#11]

It's patently obvious that the Customer is an annoyance to an otherwise perfect world where they just count the money from their revenue - BTW & PlusNet (BT). My ADSL has been disfunctional for a week and nobody appears to give a flying ***** .  From what I read on this forum, my issues might be resolved tomorrow or could be ignored for another month.
I think that the whole "privatisation" and "competition" thing has led somewhere that nobody really anticipated: where nobody accepts responsibily for anything and there is virtually no true Customer Service (note Caps). I've been with Sky (Easynet) LLU and they have their own problems, but nothing like this. The Sky service was faster, less managed, cheaper and more reliable (I fell out with them over their inept telephone service).
I've been with PlusNet for 6 months of an 18 month contract, "Not fit for purpose", I think, is the legal term...
I feel a MAC request coming on.

[#12]

Quote from: 135kbpshell

The problem started as the same time as the world cup (the day of Englands first game). Co-incidence?

Coincidence, paranoia, who knows?  You're the guy who (according to your analogy) called Curries because your new TV set stopped working when the aerial fell off your roof!
We don't pay a king's ransom for broadband from Plusnet and for what we pay I think their customer service is pretty good.  My telephone line fails when we have heavy rain because there is an underground junction about 600m from my house that fills up with water and disrupts the circuit, so I know intermittent line faults are possible and can can have a rational explanation.  I know because I've braved the possibility of a £175 charge in order to call out a BT engineer to look at the problem.  The chances are  "135kbpshell's" problem is a faulty router but he doesn't seem to want to do anything about this but moan, and that's becoming tiresome.  Yes, BT's DLM system is crazy but (if you're lucky enough to have a LUU exchange or cable) there are alternatives if you want to take your custom elsewhere in order to avoid it.  Yes, BT's charges to send out an engineer on a false errand are punitive - so it makes sense to ensure that it's not going to be a false errand.  Work the system!             

[#13]

The true colours are really coming out now. Plusnet customer service just assume all theie customers are stupid, and will have then running round in circles while they snigger to themselves like 5 year olds. The inane comments above are deliberately insulting, but it actualy makes a pleasant change from the usual patronising crap. Take a good look anyone who is thinking of joining Plusnet. The empathetic customer service is more like apathetic, and is just training to keep the customer sweet while they provide a crap service. Unliek the imbeciles I've been dealing with (not all I hasten to add), I'm an actual Engineer, not a made up job title, but a qualificaton and a profession. I know the difference between an electrical fault and an aerial thats fallen off the roof.
I've been living with this crap service for a month, and I have another 2 months before I can change ISP (unless I want to incur a £70 fee), so I fully intend to carry on 'moaning' for another 2 months, to let all those potential plusnet customers out there know what you really get for your money.

[#14]

If you claim to be that well educated.  Why dont you do the requested checks and stop moaning
A large number of the moaners have eventually when the buckled down had the problems resolved.

And if you hopefully just migrate to another ISP, you will then saddle them with the same problem

[#15]

I know it is going back a few years to when Curries were owned by the Curry Family - I was doing a Sat Job delivering for them, Got a call out to a house where a well known JP lived.  - His TV had stopped working could we take out a replacement.
Got there and found that his wife had correctly unplugged it during a thunderstorm and not reconnected the leads after wards