My Netgear router goes in the bin after Digital POTS switchover?

[#1]

One of the freedoms I have just taken for granted is the ability to choose a better router than the one an ISP offers me.

Many here must have built configurations with expensive routers that offer what are to them essential features, such as 4G failover, VPNs using IPSEC or Wireguard, more comprehansive packet filtering than offered by stock ISP routers, &c &c

Am I right in assuming that I will no longer have the option of using my own router and my analogue land phone line on my ADSL service once I am migrated to the proprietary BT hardware?

This seems strongly anti-competitive and monopolistic to me - does the UK market just die for 3rd party router manufacturers?

[#2]

Why do you need to throw anything away?

The POTS switch off is unconnected with FTTP roll out, it works equally well on FTTC lines. Anyway, you can use a third party router on FTTP providing it has a compatible basic interface (WAN port and capable of connecting using the PPPoE protocol).

You can use DECT (analogue) phones over VoIP by buying an adapter that connects to your router over Ethernet or wireless.

There is no conspiracy, you will not be forced to use BT hardware.

Moderators Note

This topic has been moved from Broadband to Tech Help

[#3]

@disfroot When the ADSL/FTTC services are finally retired (after many years) you will still be able to use your own router (on PN at least) when the service is moved to FTTP/Full Fibre, although an ADSL only one will not work - different technology.

The POTS system is scheduled for turn-ff by 2025, but that depends on the whole of the UK having been covered by Full Fibre, so could slip.

There are alternative networks to BT, especially in the the Full Fibre market, but as a lot of these are fairly 'local', if you go to them you will be stuck with them (and whichever ISP/s decide to use that network).

EDIT: @Baldrick1 types faster than me, and gives more info.

[#4]

So what happens to my analogue phone line and number? Plusnet phone will migrate to the proprietary BT Digital Voice which, in turn, requires the proprietary BT hardware, which I can't have connected at the same time as a 3rd party router.

Or am I missing something?

Is my only option if I wish to carry on using my own router to find a 3rd party SIP phone provider as well? and that means cancelling Plusnet Phone and migrating my landline number to a new company?

What a godawful mess - how have Ofcom allowed this to happen?

[#5]

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@jab1 wrote:

The POTS system is scheduled for turn-ff by 2025, but that depends on the whole of the UK having been covered by Full Fibre, so could slip.

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There is no connection between the roll out of FTTP and the switch off of the POTS.

VoIP is alive and kicking today and works perfectly well on ADSL, FTTC and FTTP services. VoIP simply digitises the analogue signal from your phone, converting it to digital at your property rather than it more than likely being digitised at your local telephone exchange. The bandwidth requirements are very low in terms of the impact on your broadband speed.

[#6]

Cheers @Baldrick1 - my apologies for posting duff info, but I'm still learning. I shan't make the same error again.

[#7]

@Baldrick1 but VOIP is not the same as BT Digital Voice, is it?

VOIP is a family of digital telephony products, some standards-based and  others, like BT Digital Voice, are closed proprietary protocols requiring exclusive hardare endpoints.

So, my original question remains unanswered - when POTS is replaced by the proprietary BT VOIP system for landlines, if I wish to carry on the minimum-hassle path, I shall have to use the BT hardware to continue using the Plusnet Phone offering - which means my 3rd party router will have to go in the bin.

Wrong or right?

[#8]

@disfroot 

The fact that Plusnet are not currently providing a digital phone option on FTTP services is a business decision by Plusnet. Nothing to do with Ofcom,

There are other ISPs that do offer this service as well as BT. We don't know what Plusnet might do over the next three years.

I can't speak for both but both Sky and BT do offer hubs with a built in converter that you can use with an analogue phone  but there's no reason why, if the ISP allows the use of 3rd party routers, that you can't use your own. As far as I am aware, BT do not force you down that route.

You will not be forced to do anything until the day when Openreach decide to switch off your local FTTC service and that is probably many, many, years in the future.

[#9]

@Baldrick1 

Thanks for taking the time to reply, but I don't really get how any of those facts are pertinent to my OP. I never mentioned Fibre to the Premises or Fibre to the Cabinet. I have an ADSL service.

December 2025 is the fixed date on which I will have to either

a) lose my landline,

b) buy another router with a standards-based SIP voice port to plug my exisitng DECT base-station into, or

c) buy a separate analogue/DECT-to-SIP box to plug into my LAN

d) get railroaded into BT Digital Voice and the BT hardware

[#10]

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@disfroot wrote:

when POTS is replaced by the proprietary BT VOIP system for landlines,

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POTS is not being replaced by the BT 'Digital Voice' VoIP service. It is simply the BT version of VoIP which you are under no obligation to use. There is nothing to stop you going from using your own router and a third party VoIP service on any ISP broadband connection, including BT Retail.

Sky, for example, have their own proprietary version of the BT service that runs on the BT network

[#11]

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@disfroot wrote:
...when POTS is replaced by the proprietary BT VOIP system for landlines...

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This isn't strictly correct.  Openreach are planning on withdrawing POTS.  BT Retail have a VOIP system (Digital Voice) that they are moving their customers to.

Before Openreach stop POTS, all ISPs will either need to provide some kind of VOIP Service or discontinue that product.  Some ISPs currently have a solution in place, others don't.  Plusnet haven't announced what their plans will or won't be.

[#12]

@Baldrick1 

OK - that helped - thanks. So my freedom to use a 3rd party router is - post Dec 2025 - conditional on the continued existence of a stable, competent untied independent VOIP provider?

What's the independent VOIP market in the UK then in 2022? Is it healthy? or has it already seen a Balkanisation into Big 6 proprietary tech and a few minnows?

[#13]

December 2025 is the fixed date on which I will have to either

I suspect that 'fixed' is a moveable target, we will see

a) lose my landline,

Yes, phones will no longer be connected to the local exchange over analogue lines

b) buy another router with a standards-based SIP voice port to plug my exisitng DECT base-station into, or

Free if you move to an ISP that bundles one in.

c) buy a separate analogue/DECT-to-SIP box to plug into my LAN

True if you don't go with b)

d) get railroaded into BT Digital Voice and the BT hardware

Not True, if Plusnet do not offer a digital phone service and you want to keep both services with the same company then you will need to change ISP, but you won't be railroaded to go anywhere. You only need to use the BT hardware if you choose to to move to BT and use the BT voice service rather that a third party provider.

I guess that it's like when automated telephone exchanges first came into being and customers felt 'railroaded' into having to dial numbers themselves rather than getting a telephone operator to do it for them.

Sorry, but you can't stop progress, especially when it provides a cheaper more reliable option.

[#14]

b)....!! OP was all about freedom to use a better router !!!

d) sorry - using 'BT' to mean 'BT and Plusnet' obviously

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@Baldrick1 wrote:

Sorry, but you can't stop progress, especially when it provides a cheaper more reliable option.

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unless you want to dial 999 and get through. That has become less and less reliable- anti-progress. From Dec 2025, you'll now also need a working internet connection to report a life-threatening medical condition if you have no mobile access.

[#15]

From Dec 2025, you'll now also need a working internet connection to report a life-threatening medical condition if you have no mobile access.

I thought the Dec 2025 date had been paused. After the storms and extended power cuts, OFCOM finally woke up to the potential problem and told BT/Openreach to consider the problem. No doubt though that ultimately OFCOM won't actually do anything...