cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

pwatson
Rising Star
Posts: 2,468
Thanks: 8
Fixes: 1
Registered: 26-11-2012

Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Finally an ISP decides to try to call other ISPs to arms to tackle BT incompetence.  No surprise that it's Adrian Kennard from AAISP behind this.
http://www.wbbf.uk/
Here's Adrian's blog entry which details his latest battle against 'procedure':
http://www.revk.uk/2014/12/bt-hate-site.html
It would be great to hear that PN take this opportunity to join with other ISPs to knock BT into shape as an industry initiative.  Given the lack of any evidence that PN management are attempting to deal with with the root cause of issues, rather than firefighting, I won't hold my breath...   Embarrassed
A New Year's resolution perhaps Smiley
9 REPLIES
Community Veteran
Posts: 3,382
Thanks: 5
Registered: 18-01-2013

Re: BT Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Fair play to that man - it is good to see how much hassle the ISP's actually have to put up with.
I wonder if anyone from PN could comment if this is something that is not uncommon in the industry ?
Community Veteran
Posts: 1,850
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: BT Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

It's fairly very common. Too many diverse, back end and indeed front end, systems across various BT groups and when the computer says no it means no and heaven help anyone trying to unpick some of the crap underneath.
Unfortunately, this scenario is all too common and has been for years. I strongly suspect it would be cheaper for BT to compensate CP's than to rebuild the rats nest of crap which currently exists.
The only thing which surprises me is that it's taken Adrian this long to scream about it.
Community Veteran
Posts: 1,894
Thanks: 3
Registered: 20-10-2012

Re: BT Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

About time BT were held accountable for their (in)actions!  Roll eyes
Geoff,
York.
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,735
Thanks: 12
Registered: 02-02-2008

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Interesting that he says "Would billing you for every time you screw up help matters?"
Some years ago I worked in an IT support role, as a team manager.
Our team was on-call 24*7 for stuff that, largely, we (or earlier team members) had developed ourselves.
Our T's & C's and overall pay meant that we just did the work, on a rota we managed ourselves, no complaints about the arrangement as it was seen as "part of the job".
But over time we noticed the number of calls increasing. Our analysis (which was very thorough) found that essentially this was nearly always down to "laziness" by the operational staff who were working shifts running our software through the night.
Training, instructions, etc. etc. for these staff were reviewed and "improved" (not really needed but we wanted to show willing) but nothing changed.
So we then introduced a payment system, cash paid to the person called. Taken from the "operations" budget.
The amount depended on the agreed cause of the call, worked out at a regular (monthly) review between the development/support and operational teams reps.
Payment for a fault deemed to be within "our" remit was zero.
One that was first (provably) an operational error but that some (incomplete) attempts had been made to check and follow standard recovery was at a standard level.
If no attempts were made to run standard repair/recovery payment was double.
We were paid the same whether it was solved by a phone call or going into work and staying all night.
This "concentrated the minds" of the operational management surprisingly quickly.  Cool
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,718
Thanks: 931
Fixes: 10
Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

I really hope that Plusnet intend to participate in this forum.
If they don't I think we can take it that far from being an advantage that Plusnet are part of the BT group, it is a definite disadvantage as Plusnet will not, not matter how bad the service is, upset their 'masters'.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
198kHz
Aspiring Champion
Posts: 3,485
Thanks: 418
Fixes: 11
Registered: 30-07-2008

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Wot jelv said.  ^^
+1
Remember you are unique - just like everyone else
Community Veteran
Posts: 1,850
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Not necessarily John. The internal channels are a more effective route than Adrian's forum tbh. (Hard to believe I know)
Every arm of BT - Retail, BTB, Corporate, Enterprise, GS and PN experience the back end system problems, engineer issues and offshore service level challenges, and every one of those groups kick off royally at leadership level. It's a mammoth task to fix all that is wrong and has been allowed to go wrong over a number of years. Adrian, as always, makes a bit more public noise, but the regular CP calls / meetings with Openreach and BTW do get quite vocal and noisy. It's a herculean task to fix and it's happening, bit by bit, but I reckon it'll be years before it improves and will cost millions to fix properly.
pwatson
Rising Star
Posts: 2,468
Thanks: 8
Fixes: 1
Registered: 26-11-2012

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Quote from: jelv
I really hope that Plusnet intend to participate in this forum.

Shortly after starting this thread I did see a familiar name listed as 'our newest member' so you never know... Wink
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 12,584
Thanks: 3,864
Fixes: 25
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Wholesale Broadband Buyers Forum

Quote from: Mark
It's a herculean task to fix and it's happening, bit by bit, but I reckon it'll be years before it improves and will cost millions to fix properly.

Mark,
It is a massive task, however fixing is (I suggest) somewhat easier than you suggest.  BT makes massive profits out of other people's misery; therefore the solution is that for every occasion where BTOR / BTw fail to deliver service to SLA they pay out a sizable fine to the CP / ISP and the EU for their failure to deliver service.  A run on the profits will bring about rapid change in management attitude.  BTOR has been shedding experienced engineers for years and is now struggling to train new technicians.  Simple solution - go and re-recruit those skills it dispensed with!