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Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Community Veteran
Posts: 26,695
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Today I changed to Plusnet Extra from PAYG. I didn't immediately put on the Pro add-on to see how things went.
I've always had speeds around 6Mbps. This is a very typical recent speed test:

Earlier today speeds seemed fine, but during this evening speeds were not good. For example

As you can imagine to say I was concerned would be an understatement! Angry
I therefore put on the Pro add-on at 20:15. We have been told that takes affect immediately. This did seem to improve things a bit:

But I'm still way below my normal speeds.
I wondered if it may need a fresh connection to pick up the new profile so I've rebooted the router.
I've just rerun the Thinkbroadband speed test and got this:

We had been told that the traffic shaping with the Pro add-on would be very similar to the old Pro/PAYG - this is looking very much like a lie! Sad
There's nothing on the Broadband usage graphs to indicate there are issues this evening.
I AM NOT HAPPY!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
23 REPLIES
TicnTac
Grafter
Posts: 426
Registered: 03-08-2010

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

.........welcome to our world Smiley
Something is not right there, and you really shouldn't be happy, I would have maybe gone for an even larger font, and in bold though Wink
They'll get it sorted, just the usual PN hiccup as usual!
You might get chance to explore new features of life without looking at millions of pixels, or like us sit frustrated with it night after night for over a year wishing there was an alternative way that wouldn't cost the earth!  Grin
Don't forget your line might be in 'not knowing what it is doing therefore must learn how to work again properly mode' - this will take around 72 hours+
The profile might have been splattered during some fly swatting episode, and might require a reset.
Or due to the warm hot sunny weather bugs seem to be abundant, but I'm sure the likes of our Adam Walker with his great Nordic Metal Hammer feet will soon stomp about enough to get rid of them or will I'm sure call the likes of Rentokil!
All the best!  Smiley
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,695
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

Because a considerable time ago I tested IPStream Connect, as well as my usual username@plusdsl.net login I have username@plusdsl2.net available. Just for a giggle I thought I'd see what my speeds were like using the plusdsl2 login:

Looking promising! So back to my normal login.

Still looking good.

Whoever it was that said that when you added the Pro add-on it took immediate affect was talking absolute rot!
It appears it took me using a very blunt instrument that is not available to most users to get it to take affect on my account.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
TicnTac
Grafter
Posts: 426
Registered: 03-08-2010

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

...ummm, may we borrow your rather blunt instrument to see if it helps us? Or at least put in an insurance claim for a new router  Grin
Community Veteran
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Registered: 29-01-2009

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

The usage graphs are all broken, except for the user count. The traffic volumes have shown the same 2 graphs for weeks, while the others are also stuck (see the timestamp at the far right of each). The QoS graphs suffer from a lot of NaN numbers too, suggesting they aren't being fed valid data.
BobP says they haven't got around to getting them working properly with the shift around of central pipes recently.
We shifted from Premier to Extra a month ago, without Pro, and I've been closely watching the impact on download speeds. I've always had some statistics-gathering going on, but had to make the download tests off-peak only as we approached the monthly limits. This month, with a fresh 60GB to work with, I've turned up the volume a bit, and had tests running through peak hours. Still only once an hour, and can show speed drops if we happen to be doing something else at the same time - so can't be used as a fault-indicator unless you know what else was happening.
Having said that, we were away for 1 week this month, so the tester had the line to itself... I've stuck some screenshots of the graphs on the attachments.
But it does seem to show that this evening was a little slower than normal. Remember this is all without Pro.
Plusnet Customer
Using FTTC since 2011. Currently on 80/20 Unlimited Fibre Extra.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 29-01-2009

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

BTW - I notice something about your graphs from Speedtest.net:
a) The original ping times are huge
b) Their grading scheme isn't very consistent!
Plusnet Customer
Using FTTC since 2011. Currently on 80/20 Unlimited Fibre Extra.
Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
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Registered: 18-07-2007

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

Quote from: jelv
It appears it took me using a very blunt instrument that is not available to most users to get it to take affect on my account.

Not sure if you're talking about our conversation last night (if not, apologies) but I haven't made any changes for you. I know Bob's looking at this too now but afaik we didn't do anything last night.
Community Veteran
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

Remember I managed to force my Pro add-on to take affect at about 10:45 last night - now look at my thinkbroadband Broadband Quality Meter for yesterday.

(click the graph to see a larger version)
I had thought it would take a few days to decide whether I needed the Pro add-on after changing from PAYG to Extra. It really says something about how bad Extra is without the add-on that it took such a short time to decide I did need it!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Community Veteran
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on no help

Quote from: WWWombat
The usage graphs are all broken, except for the user count. The traffic volumes have shown the same 2 graphs for weeks, while the others are also stuck (see the timestamp at the far right of each). The QoS graphs suffer from a lot of NaN numbers too, suggesting they aren't being fed valid data.
BobP says they haven't got around to getting them working properly with the shift around of central pipes recently.

Following my experience last night I really do wonder if Plusnet have an ulterior motive in leaving these graphs broken.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Community Gaffer
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Quote from: jelv
We had been told that the traffic shaping with the Pro add-on would be very similar to the old Pro/PAYG - this is looking very much like a lie! Sad

It is not a lie. The 'service offer' our traffic management platform uses for customers with the pro add-on is identical to the one used for those on the old Pro/PAYG packages.
Quote from: jelv
Because a considerable time ago I tested IPStream Connect, as well as my usual username@plusdsl.net login I have username@plusdsl2.net available. Just for a giggle I thought I'd see what my speeds were like using the plusdsl2 login:

Looking promising! So back to my normal login.

Still looking good.

Whoever it was that said that when you added the Pro add-on it took immediate affect was talking absolute rot!

I'm not 100% sure how quickly the accounting platform is updated after activating the Pro add-on but it is my understanding that it should take effect pretty quickly. I've checked your traffic management profiling and all is as it should be (currently on the plusdsl2.net realm). Unfortunately it's difficult for me to see what was going on during the time you were experiencing problems. Regardless, even if the Pro add-on hadn't 'kicked in', your speeds should still have been nowhere near as low as the speedtests were reporting.
Quote from: jelv
It appears it took me using a very blunt instrument that is not available to most users to get it to take affect on my account.

I don't think the realm change had much to do with it TBH, it's probably more likely the disconnect/reconnect. FWIW (and I think you know this) when you switch realm it takes some time for our systems to update at this side and until they do there's the potential for you to be assigned a default traffic management profile.
Quote from: jelv
Quote from: WWWombat
The usage graphs are all broken, except for the user count. The traffic volumes have shown the same 2 graphs for weeks, while the others are also stuck (see the timestamp at the far right of each). The QoS graphs suffer from a lot of NaN numbers too, suggesting they aren't being fed valid data.
BobP says they haven't got around to getting them working properly with the shift around of central pipes recently.

Following my experience last night I really do wonder if Plusnet have an ulterior motive in leaving these graphs broken.

Not at all. In fact I believe I've something in my in tray somewhere to review the proposed replacements.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

Community Veteran
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Bob,
I only tried the realm switch after I had already tried a reconnect and also a full router reboot.
As you can see the Pro add-on only took affect at around 10:45pm after I switched realms.
If you look at ticket #108698750 it is timed at 8:15pm:
Quote
Service Notification
8:15pm, Tuesday 3 May 2011
The customer was mailed the following message to address(es) (aaa@xxx.plus.com, postmaster@xxx.plus.com):
Subject: Your new Add-On is active
Dear Mr xxx,
Account username: xxxxx
The following Add-On is now active on your account:
Add-On: Pro Add On
Monthly cost: £5
Start date: 2011-05-03
You can remove this at any time by going to:
http://portal.plus.net/AddOns.html

It took a full two and a half hours and me forcing it for the Pro add-on to take affect.
Quote from: Bob
Quote from: jelv
We had been told that the traffic shaping with the Pro add-on would be very similar to the old Pro/PAYG - this is looking very much like a lie! Sad

It is not a lie. The 'service offer' our traffic management platform uses for customers with the pro add-on is identical to the one used for those on the old Pro/PAYG packages.

Accepted - once I managed to force the Pro add-on to take affect everything returned to looking like PAYG.
Quote from: Bob
I'm not 100% sure how quickly the accounting platform is updated after activating the Pro add-on but it is my understanding that it should take effect pretty quickly. I've checked your traffic management profiling and all is as it should be (currently on the plusdsl2.net realm). Unfortunately it's difficult for me to see what was going on during the time you were experiencing problems. Regardless, even if the Pro add-on hadn't 'kicked in', your speeds should still have been nowhere near as low as the speedtests were reporting.
I don't think the realm change had much to do with it TBH, it's probably more likely the disconnect/reconnect. FWIW (and I think you know this) when you switch realm it takes some time for our systems to update at this side and until they do there's the potential for you to be assigned a default traffic management profile.

As I posted above I'd already tried disconnect/reconnect and a complete router reboot. Here's an extract from my router log:
Tue, 2011-05-03 21:57:09 - Receive NTP Reply from time-g.netgear.com
Tue, 2011-05-03 21:54:49 - Router start up
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:38:38 - LCP down.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:38:39 - Initialize LCP.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:38:39 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:38:42 - CHAP authentication success
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:38:49 - <DDNS>Update OK: good
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:41:22 - LCP down.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:41:23 - Initialize LCP.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:41:23 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:41:27 - CHAP authentication success
Tue, 2011-05-03 22:41:44 - <DDNS>Update OK: good

The router reboot at 21:54:49 had no affect.

Quote from: Bob
currently on the plusdsl2.net realm

No I'm not.
I was on the plusdsl2 realm for as long as it took to run a speed test and then switch back to my normal realm (on plusdsl2 from 10:38 to 10:41).
On my plusdsl I have a static IP. On plusdsl2 I have a dynamic IP. whatsmyip says I currently have my normal static IP.
I switched to plusdsl2 at 10:38. I've just found a closed ticket on my account:
[quote=#42236703 ]Your Response
5:12am, Wednesday 4 May 2011
Provisioning of your ADSL Account Information
ADSL Realm change from "plusdsl.net" to "plusdsl2.net"
It took your systems 6 and a half hours to catch up with the switch to plusdsl2 - it obviously still hasn't caught up with the switch back!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Community Gaffer
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Quote from: jelv
It took your systems 6 and a half hours to catch up with the switch to plusdsl2 - it obviously still hasn't caught up with the switch back!

No it hasn't and our traffic management platform only has you authenticated on the @plusdsl2.net realm. There is currently no entry for @plusdsl.net (and I doubt there will be until our systems update and another closed ticket is added to your account).
I'd try adding the pro add-on to my own account to see what happens but I can't with it being legacy Undecided

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

Community Veteran
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

I wish I had PPP logging turned on in my router which would prove exactly what happened. If I turn it on now it will trigger another reconnect which would defeat the object of waiting to see how long it takes to recognise the realm change back to plusdsl.
Theory: The realm switch to plusdsl2 and back was within 3 minutes. Is it possible that it saw the records out of order (different radius servers?). If so seeing the second record first it would be for the same realm as I'm normally on and not record a change. Then the first record is processed which is recognised as a change. I can well believe that having switched over and back within a very short time frame might have screwed things up!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Community Gaffer
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

Quote from: jelv
If I turn it on now it will trigger another reconnect which would defeat the object of waiting to see how long it takes to recognise the realm change back to plusdsl.

The realm change scripts are run once every 24 hours.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

Community Veteran
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Re: Switch to Extra - speeds gone to pot - Pro add-on see reply #2

In that case it's looking very likely that the events were not processed in the correct order - or does it only process one event per account.
I'm now going to do a reconnect to see if you then see me as being on the normal realm.
Edit: Done - I've gone from pcl-ag05 to pcl-ag03
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)