Another unhappy customer

[#1]

Plusnet's customer service has to be amongst the worst of all service providers in the UK. No-one cares, no one takes responsibility for resolving problems and their communications are appalling or non-existent, both within the organisation and with their customers. I have been a customer for 10 years and everything is OK until .... you want to make any changes, like moving house.  We gave Plusnet 3 weeks notice of moving house in early October (only 2 miles down the road so same exchange, same number, a simple flick of a switch - should have been straightforward)  We were told everything was lined up to transfer the line but on the appointed day nothing happened.  I contacted Plusnet and after the usual 20 to 30-minute wait I was informed that there was a problem as Openreach had been unable to locate the address.  When I asked Plusnet how long they had known about this they replied 3 weeks ago, just 20 minute after they had confirmed to me that that the line transfer was all set up.  So why hadn't Plusnet told me about this at the time - they claim that their system doesn't allow this to happen - some system!!  To cut a long story short it took Plusnet 3 weeks to resolve this problem, involving hours spent on countless futile calls by me to customer service staff who just passed the buck and made excuses,  two missed appointments by Openreach engineers etc.  For 3 weeks we were without landline or broadband which was hugely inconvenient - thanks Costa Coffee for your free w--fi!  When the line was finally transferred the wrong number was allocated because apparently Plusnet had not advised Openreach that our old number had been transferred.  I am now in the process of trying to claim a reasonable level of compensation from Plusnet for my losses.  They promised to get back to me by 1st December with a response.  It  is now 4th December and I haven't had a reply - that sums up Plusnet.
Andy Hill is the CEO of Plusnet.  Mr Hill, if you ever read these comments why do you not do something to improve your organisation.  Instead of spending vast amounts on TV advertising why don't you spend more on improving customer service for your existing customers.  Recruit more people, train them better and imbue a culture of customer care and accountability.  Or are you unconcerned about losing loyal customers, just as long as you attract a larger number of new ones from your marketing efforts. 
Very happy to discuss with you - my number is on your database!

u

[#2]

"Andy Hill is the CEO of Plusnet"
Someone will be along soon to correct you on that! He probably never stoops to reading or visiting this forum either. He could well be sat at his desk wearing headphones from which there will be his daily BT brainwashing message.
Secondly that someone will blame it all on Openreach.

[#3]

Oh dear, another tale of woe. Why don't the agents that deal with such transfers and the like, make paper notes so that they can follow up on these things as the Plusnets systems seem to be so bad?

[#4]

Hi John,
A warm welcome to the forums - where have you been through all of those 10 years with PN?  Sorry to heard of your trials and tribulations which only PlusNET can answer.  As NAT suggests, it is likely that BTOR will have had a significant role in these failings - that is not blame but an unvarnished truth - however the responsibility to manage such situations better clearly lays with PlusNET, ultimately the CEO Andy BAKER (not Hill).
The catalogue of failings you have identified paint a not untypical systematic picture of BTOR cock-ups seen time and again.  Remember anything to do with everything "on the ground" is entirely within BTOR world.  Knowledge of what equipment / wires etc is where should be in BTOR's database.  Until earlier this year I ran a pub in which I had PN business services for 4 years.  Each time BTOR attended, they looked for the place by the name the pub was called back in the early 1990s.  Clearly they never found it despite PN giving BTOR the correct current name - yes BLAME laid with BTOR.
The reports on here of BTOR failure to not turn up at the appointed time (often claiming that no one was in) or not transferring the number are legion yes the BLAME lays with BTOR.
BTOR is wilful in its failings, ISPs ought to be taking them to task, however for reasons which are not apparent none of them are using the right to complain to Ofcom.  That said anything they might then seek to sanction needs EU / Brussels approval.
Andy has been invited to tell of what is being done at a CEO level to drive improved performance from BTOR, but to date this forum community have not had a response.
Hopefully CRT - the PlusNET staff who look after this forum - will respond to your specific experience.
Kevin

[#5]

Even though I am a long-term satisfied customer of PlusNet, some of the issues I see flagged up on this board are starting to concern me somewhat. There do seem to be many “silly” mistakes made possibly down to staff training issues and education needs. I wonder why management are not doing anything to address the problems as they seem keep recurring. I don’t think it is fair just to blame BTOR as many of the failings are clearly in PlusNet’s court.

[#6]

Well if Openretch couldn't locate the address, whose fault was that 

[#7]

It is unarguable that PlusNET is failing to manage the volume of issues consequential to BTOR failures.  Which if the following is PlusNet's fault...?
Not knowing where a property is?
Not knowing what BTOR equipment is installed at the property?
Not turning up for a booked & confirmed appointment?
Not knowing that the number was to be transferred?
Not managing the issues?
The last is clearly PlusNET, we do not have enough facts to judge the penultimate issue, though BTOR failure on this are legion around here.  I await someone explaining to me how the first three substantive issues are PlusNet's fault.  Assigning responsibility for failure to BTOR on those points is reasonable, however accountability fir managing the situation squarely resides with PlusNET.
Until people sort out the difference between blame / responsibility and accountability then tempers will become inflamed.  As far as BTOR are concerned, both PlusNET and the end user are just customer in the same boat over whom BTOR acting as a quasi nationalised industry just don't really give a dam.  Though they operate under the BT brand they might just as well be government owned - that is untouchable.

[#8]

This looks like a PN or BTW fault to me regarding the address.
The Openreach database is updated on a daily basis using the PAF.
Even if an address cannot be found then, manual orders can still be placed for WLR.

[#9]

Quote from: AndyH

The Openreach database is updated on a daily basis using the PAF.

Andy,
Based on personal experience, I do not think it is that simple.  Harping back to the pub, it changed its name back in the early 1990's.  When I was there 2010-2014 the PAF had no record of the old name, just he current name.  PlusNET never knew the old name, so could never order services against the old name (note there is no building number for this rural property) however when trying to attend site BTOR ALWAYS looked for the premises by its old name.  Indeed BTOR equipment was labelled as "opposite or adjacent to the old pub name".
When trying to sort this BTOR told us that the PAF file needed to be updated, well it was up to date!  BTw might be up to date - I guess it had to be to allow PlusNET to order the services... I remain convinced that BTOR is in a complete mess.

[#10]

@Townman and @AndyH are both right.
@AndyH's bit:
I'm currently going through a house move, that is failing miserably. The order started with the property being a "silver key address" which means BTO have no records, but are taking the address from the PAF. These properties appear in the address checker, but end up with a result indicating "address recognised, but cannot estimate DSL speeds".
Such a property requires a survey before the order can be confirmed ... and within 2 days, this was done. DSL checkers started saying it was connected to cab 21 (right outside) and giving speed estimates.
But looking at the checker result (using just a postcode in the address checker), I can currently see 3 different addresses that could refer to this property, including the original silver-key version and the new one added due to my order through plusnet (they differ only by the addition of the word "THE"). At our last address, there was a silver-key record for our proper address "Flat 3 ...", while service was actually provided through a record named "3rd Floor Flat ..."
It seems that BTO's record can use the PAF as a starting point, but can then branch off to become a separate entity with its own life. Subsequent changes to the PAF don't get automatically brought forward into the record for the service.
@Townman's bit:
Unfortunately, the reason things are going wrong for me is because the copper line that exists at the house is actually routed to a different DP and a cabinet in the next street.
With a line in place, including some components that can only have been added since the sell-off in the eighties, you'd expect that it ought to have been in BTO's database properly. Still...
After many appointments & external fault fixes (some no-show, and some attended), where engineers *know* where the line goes (and have given me all the routing information), the BTO system still hasn't been updated. It seems like it is almost impossible to get historical records updated. Most of the time it doesn't matter - the attending engineer can work around things. However, having the wrong cabinet in the records is fatal for an FTTC order, as the port gets allocated in the wrong DSLAM.
My bit:
It seems like Plusnet's IT system & processes work OK for standard orders, or a simple amount of failure. And that the CSC are capable of pushing a failed order on to the next step. However, there is a certain point where complex orders really need a single point of contact; someone to whom you don't need to go through a ten-minute explanation of what has happened in the past.
In the end Adam Walker has picked up my issue; it doesn't necessarily make BTO act any faster or any more reasonably, but it does save you the hassle of so many lengthy waits for the CSC phone, and so many explanations over the next failure in the chain.
Plusnet probably could do with a dozen people like that...

[#11]

The issue tends to be when an order is placed for a property with an incorrect address (as WWWombat has explained):

Quote

Many data integrity errors exist because of the many years of manual interactions and recording associated with the copper network. As an example, a customer may provide an address and the engineer on the day has determined that the service is to be delivered to a slightly different address, e.g. Flat 1, 33 Victoria Street, not 33 Victoria Street. Although the address error is not inaccurate enough to stop service being delivered on the day, the records in the system record the line at 33 Victoria Street and no line at Flat 1. Subsequent orders be it MPF, WLR etc. rely upon the accuracy of that information to effect the correct provisioning scenario be it a working line takeover, start of a stopped line, new copper etc. Each of these scenarios impact lead time so a small data error will change the future decision making process in both the Openreach and CP systems.

This should all be changing though with the way Openreach handle addresses.

[#12]

WWW, I believe they are called "Provisioning", in connection with Townman's old premises, one wonders if they could organise a..................never mind, forget it, no-one will do anything up there anyway, we'll just have to rely on CRT.