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PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

mikeb
Rising Star
Posts: 447
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Registered: ‎10-06-2007

PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

OK, I've officially had enough of this PN billing gross stupidity that without any doubt whatsoever can be proven to be breach of contract. Yet there's still no sensible and permanent resolution despite the number of attempts that have been made Sad  I can also see from posts here that I'm apparently not the only one suffering with this either which makes it even worse because PN clearly know about the fundamental billing problems and cannot or will not fix them.

Just how long does it take for several different personnel to investigate and fully understand the fundamental PN problem here, deal with this ridiculous situation properly and actually arrange for me to be charged the CONTRACTUALLY AGREED PRICES ?  It takes long enough to get past the front line " total denial of there being any problem because it's all in your TS&Cs " to get through to someone who does at least understand that it isn't in *MY* Ts&Cs and acknowledges the PN billing error but still no actual fix.

Alternatively, perhaps someone can advise which of the following direct quotes taken from official PN documentation various constitutes the blatant lie(s) and/or intentionally misleading information that needs to be escalated to the relevant regulatory body and/or Ombudsman for formal review ?


THE OFFER ON THE TABLE

" Sign up before the 7th October and get fixed price broadband and line rental – this won’t change during your contract "


THE CONTRACTUAL TERMS

" Prices, content and terms may change at any time during your contract, except for your broadband and line rental prices.  We'll tell you about important changes in advance. "


THE ORDER CONFIRMATION

" Great news, you're on a fixed price contract, That means the cost of
your broadband and line rental won't go up while you're in contract.
We'll send you an end of contract reminder, and offer an account
review too, to make sure you're still on the right package for you. "


THE ATTEMPTED RIP-OFF BEGINS !

" We need to let you know about some upcoming changes to your prices.
   
On 30 June 2021, as set out in your terms and conditions, the price for some of your Plusnet services will be increasing in line with the 0.7% Consumer Price index (CPI) rate of inflation published in April this year, plus 3.9% If you have a discount on your package price, the increase is applied to this discounted amount.

Here’s the detail of how much your price/s will increase:

Line Rental: £0.87 ... "


Several months of lots of talk, several attempts to allegedly resolve, BUT very little relevant action in reality and no permanent fix. Just lots of talk, lots of nice words and apparent promises just to get the customer off the line ... and then surprise, surprise, repeat it all again next time.  Billing has been screwed since day 1, has been put right at least once but here we are in August and it's still wrong again despite more promises to put it right. August brings yet another 100% incorrect billing advice and a Direct Debit to be taken in breach of contract, another seemingly random amount.

I've lost count now of just how many hours have been wasted simply attempting to get PN billing system corrected so that it's charging in accordance with the IRREFUTABLE CONTRACTUALLY AGREED TERMS. The Ofcom/Ombudsman route is rather sadly looking like it's really going to be the only way that this fundamental PN problem is ever going to get sorted out satisfactorily once and for all. It's been going on for approaching a year now so it's not for the want of trying to get things sorted sensibly with PN !

What's the official procedure for escalating this matter for 3rd party independent review because it's really looking like PN really have absolutely no intention whatsoever of dealing with this properly ?



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
18 REPLIES 18
BD
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
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Posts: 1,359
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Registered: ‎24-04-2017

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Hi @mikeb, thanks for getting in touch and I'm sincerely sorry to hear of the billing issues you've had as of recent.

I've begun looking into this for you and have raised a complaint ticket on your account I'll personally be monitoring for you moving forwards. the complaint ticket can be seen here.

I'll be reaching our to our billing team tomorrow to dive into the issues on your account a little further before I look into making any adjustments as I wish to resolve this one for you once and for all. As mentioned on the ticket, I'll be back in touch tomorrow once I know more and I've also included on the ticket steps on where to escalate the complaint to should we not be able to resolve this for you.

ellythemoo
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Registered: ‎19-09-2018

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

These small raises are I believe in all phone, etc contracts.
dvorak
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Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

they weren't in the fixed price contracts that were on sale for time.
Customer / Moderator
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If it fixed it click 'This fixed my problem'
mikeb
Rising Star
Posts: 447
Thanks: 15
Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Oh dear ... another month, another seemingly random number on the DD  Sad

Thanks for trying to sort this stupid mess out BD but I'm afraid you probably need to have another look at what's going on now after the changes made last month.

I can confirm that I did receive a credit as advised was due for overcharges going back to October 2020 but unfortunately this month's DD advice still isn't the contractually agreed price. TBH, I have absolutely no idea what you (and others) have actually done since October 2020 and/or how the amount is being determined because my bill has never been just the single agreed charge as per the contract. It's always shown a lengthy list of more debits, credits and adjustments than my bank statement normally does  🙄

Even if you do somehow manage to get the charges correct after the last general price increase, you're dead right that billing will go wrong once again following the next scheduled general price increase. Now that PN has fully embraced the BT "make totally unreasonable and totally unjustified price increases at least once each and every year without fail no matter what" policy, I think that's going to be March 2022 or thereabouts.

However, things will also go *VERY* wrong indeed when the contract comes to an end of course ... a date that's so shrouded in secrecy that absolutely no one is apparently allowed to know what it actually is ! Everyone that I've spoken to since day 1 has given me a totally different end date somewhere between October 2022 and March 2023.  Can someone please confirm exactly what the definitive contract end date actually is at some point in time prior to the monthly charges suddenly increasing to something totally unreasonable.

Gotta say that the portal is getting more and more cranky every time I venture in there but after much poncing around with links that just don't work properly and so on, my September bill is apparently the amount advised by email and definitely not the contractually agreed amount. It's gone from over-charging to under-charging. The portal also very helpfully confirms that my contract actually ends on 1st Jan 1970 ... a classic case of 'uninitialised data' if ever I saw one  Tongue

I know none of this is your fault per se, but just how it's in an way possible for any company to make such a dog's dinner of what quite clearly should have been a simple fixed monthly charge as agreed for all services rendered defies comprehension. One thing's for certain though, there must be a muppet hiding in the darkest corner of a back office somewhere in need a bl**dy good slap for giving all of us such totally unnecessary grief  Wink



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
BD
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
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Posts: 1,359
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Registered: ‎24-04-2017

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Hi @mikeb, thanks for getting back to us and I'm sorry to hear your latest invoice is also incorrect. I've been monitoring your account awaiting this latest invoice to generate and despite my adjustments last month it looks like we still haven't got the discounts set right. I'll be querying this with our billing team tomorrow and will be sure to update the ticket on your account as soon as I know more regarding how we can correct this for you moving forwards.

In the meantime, I've updated the ticket answering some of your queries and worries such as the contract end date and what happens when the next price increase occurs next year which can be seen here.
 

mikeb
Rising Star
Posts: 447
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Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Ye Olde Thread resurrected (rather than starting a new one as advised by the forum system) to hopefully avoid the usual assumption(s), discussion(s) and claim(s) of me being in the wrong because I knowingly signed up fully aware that these price increases would be coming along Wink

 


[quote]

 

We need to let you know about some upcoming changes to your prices

and your terms and conditions, which you can find out more about further

down this email.

On 31st March 2022, as ( QUITE CLEARLY AND IRREFUTABLY NOT ! )

set out in your terms and conditions, the price for some of your Plusnet

services will be increasing in line with the Consumer Price index

(CPI) rate of inflation published in January this year, plus 3.9%.


[/quote]

 

 

Well, Quelle Surprise and all that, 'ere we go again !!!


Please can BD or someone else check/fix this problem (once again) and preferably BEFORE it becomes another proven case of PN breaching the contract, abusing the DD agreement or giving anyone another bucket load of unwanted grief !  Mucho thanks (once again) in advance Smiley



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
adamwalker
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Hi Mike, sorry that's an issue again, I'll need to get the discounts adjusted in line with your contract, I'll see to that and have opened a ticket on your account with further details.

If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Adam Walker
 Plusnet Help Team
mikeb
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Posts: 447
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Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

[QUOTE]


Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2022 11:37:31 +0100
Subject: Your bill is ready to view

We'll soon be taking a payment of £(NOT THE CORRECT AMOUNT)

for your service ...


[/QUOTE]

... and you did today, 26th April 2022.  It's an underpayment this time.

TBH,I haven't even bothered to look at the actual bill because it's no doubt just going to be the usual totally confusing lengthy list of pluses, minuses and adjustments but it's obviously still ending up at the incorrect contractual amount for this fixed price fixed term contract.



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
LaurenB
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Hiya @mikeb, I can see that the needed adjustments have been made for you and the latest bill will include pro rata amounts for the price increase/ discount adjustments etc. 

 

I can see that going forward the monthly amount will be the amount Adam advised for you. If you have any further queries at all, just get back to us.  

If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Lauren Barry
 Plusnet Help Team
mikeb
Rising Star
Posts: 447
Thanks: 15
Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

[QUOTE]

Date: Mon, 16 May 2022 11:51:15 +0100
Subject: Your bill is ready to view

We'll soon be taking a payment of
£(A-DIFFERENT-BUT-STILL-NOT-THE-CORRECT-AMOUNT)
for your service. This will leave your account
on or after 23rd May 2022.

[/QUOTE]

 



And it apparently did.  So that's 2 months on the trot that PN have once again completely failed to charge for contracted services in accordance with the irrefutably agreed Contractual Ts&Cs. Both payments are an undercharge.

 

I'm somewhat confused with the reference to tickets and adjustments that have apparently been made to fix the problem when 1 month later, charging still bears no resemblence to the contractually agreed amount and doesn't appear to take into account recent previous mis-charging either.  It's nigh on impossible to satisfactorily get into, out of and generally navigate around the Portal these days let alone trying to find some obscure ticket reference that may or may not actually exist somewhere on the pages various which can actually be seen rather than those which don't display properly or just #404.


Now, if PN wish to continue mis-charging (currently undercharging) me for the remains of the contract rather than comply with the contractual terms then so be it. TBH, I'm sooooo far past the caring stage after almost 2 years of trying to get what clearly should be such an incredibly simple billing issue fixed that all I can hear is This Fine Music whenever I have to do anything at all that's even remotely PN-related Tongue

HOWEVER ... please do be aware that should some uninformed or auto muppet somewhere in PN Towers so much as even think about sending me a Snot-A-Gram advising of a suspended service due to 'account issues' and/or 'missing' payment(s) or whatever ... then there will be considerably more grief for all of us as opposed to just hearing unsolicited relevant clown music with or without feeling the urge to wear big shoes and have fake tears & honky horns available as well !!!  



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
SammyM
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Hiya @mikeb

 

I'm really sorry this is still ongoing and for the hassle this is causing. I can see that Adam was managing this for you and he is out of the office over the weekend.  

 

He is back tomorrow and I have reopened the complaint ticket for you. 

 

I have emailed Adam to let him know that the discounts are still incorrect and he will look into this further for you.  

 

He will be back in touch tomorrow. 

If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Sammy M - Sheffield Team
 Plusnet Help Team
mikeb
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Posts: 447
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Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Really sorry, I genuinely DO appreciate that it's not your fault, but ...

clown%20horn

Do do, doobee doobee, do do, do do.
Do do, doobee doobee, do do, do do.
Do doobee do do.
Do doobee do do.
Doobee doobee doobee doobee doobee doobee, do do.

... things are still not looking correct.

Just how difficult is it really to calculate a bill and charge a Bank A/C the correct amount once a month for 2 years having gone to the trouble to formally agree a fixed price fixed term contract ?

I haven't checked as yet whether the various charges that have been made since day one actually average out to something almost correct but at least the payments for October 2021 to March 2022 were actually for the agreed monthly amount.  Since then, it's still not right despite the recent attempts to fix it and the various debits, credits and adjustments that have been made along the way.

What should have been 3 simple fixed monthly payments as agreed have actually been as follows:

Apr    2022    16.79
May    2022    17.23
Jun    2022    24.97

Just how is it even possible to come up with all these seemingly random amounts ? The Jun figure apparently consists of a monthly charge of 39.66 less an adjustment of 14.69.  These 3 payments combined clearly DO NOT equate to 3 x the agreed monthly charge and god knows what figure is going to appear as if by magic next month but I'm sure we're all waiting with bated breath to find out  Roll_eyes

Give the accounts dept a good slap from me please !  I'll get a statement for all PN transactions with my Bank in due course to check how it all works out over the full contract term.



B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue
adam945
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Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

hi there, hanks a lot for getting back to us and I'm so sorry for the ongoing issues with your bill. With so much going on here, do you have a suitable contact number that you'd be able to pop over via PM? I'll be more than happy to give you a call and go through everything with you. 

I believe your case handler Adam (Sheffield) is on annual leave now, so I'll be more than happy to help in his absence. 

 Adam
 Plusnet Help Team - Leeds
mikeb
Rising Star
Posts: 447
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Registered: ‎10-06-2007

Re: PN Billing: Persistent Breach Of Contract

Oh come on PN, now

you're 'avin' a giraffe.jpg

And as for the recent "the correct discounts are now in place so the issue is now fully resolved and being handed back to you" statement, I'm doing my very best McEnroe impression when I type ... You Cannot Be Serious Tongue

As far as I can see, the invoiced amounts debited (less credits various that have apparently been made) still do not add up to equal the contractual charges that should actually have been made ... and they really don't appear to have ever done so at any point in time since day 1 !

I have absolutely no idea what the BT/PN A/Cs people are playing at or indeed what planet they were actually on at the time ... but I'm quite certain that there's no shortage of people who would pay good money to have some of whatever it is they're on and join them  Roll_eyes

To anyone playing "guess the random number on the July invoice" game, the correct answer was £1.33 ... and no, I have absolutely no idea how that was arrived at either or why. It makes even less sense than pretty much every other previous invoice to date. So the seemingly random amounts charged for my fixed price contract following the recent price increase to most other customers that DID NOT apply to me are now as follows:

Apr    2022    16.79
May    2022    17.23
Jun    2022    24.97    
Jul    2022    1.33

Suffice it to say that once again, these 4 payments combined still do not equal 4x the agreed contractual monthly amount AND especially not because it looks like there was probably also a credit of £5.98 made to my Bank on 27th June. Unfortunately, there is no detail of who actually made this credit and/or why, it just says DD Refund £5.98 on my Bank Statement and nothing else. However, it is very suspiciously for the same amount mentioned in the ever growing list of debits/credits that made up the July bill. The stupid Bank is clearly just as totally bl**dy useless as BT/PN A/Cs dept for keeping highly relevant information like who actually sent me a refund such a closely guarded secret Roll_eyes

Who could possibly have imagined that charging a customer the correct & contractually agreed fixed amount once a month for 2 years would be such an incredibly difficult & time consuming task fraught with no end of 'serious' technical issues. Not to mention be an on-going issue for the entire duration of the 2 year contract.  I'm beginning to think that I've probably got a far better chance of winning the lottery each and every month (despite never actually buying a ticket) than getting charged the correct amount.  The book is now open for guessing the random amount that'll appear on the Aug invoice Wink

 


as if there weren't more than enough already !

Do do, doobee doobee, do do, do do ...

#MoreDoobeeDoobeeDosThanOleBlueEyesCanManage

 

#ButLessDoobiesThanAccountsAreApparentlyEnjoying




B T Plusnet, a bit kinda like P T Barnum ...

... but quite often appears to feature more clowns Tongue