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New Invoice Changes

Andy_Hampshire
Hooked
Posts: 8
Thanks: 19
Registered: ‎14-02-2012

Re: New Invoice Changes

Agreed ...... after many years of loyalty, if i can't get a VAT invoice i'll have to leave, as my employer will not reimburse me without one ...

 

What's frustrating is to make it VAT compliant is such a simple process.....



Went through this with Vodafone and Skype years ago .... VF will supply on request (it's a pain but once setup can be done) .... Skype, well lets just say i'm no longer a customer .....

Plusnet, we'll do you proud ....... more like "we'll do you over"

corringham
Pro
Posts: 208
Thanks: 111
Fixes: 2
Registered: ‎25-09-2015

Re: New Invoice Changes

I have now received my first bill in th new format. I can confirm that it is not a VAT invoice in any way shape or form as it does not have Plusnet's VAT number.  I had assumed that they would use the simplified format, but no.

My understanding of the VAT requirements imposed by HMRC is that there is an obligation to provide a VAT receipt (in one of the 3 acceptable forms) apart from in a very few special cases.

How do I ask for one?

If the VAT regulations have actually changed, and HMRC have forgotten to update their on-line VAT guides, could someone please provide a reference?

EDIT: Actually I have realized that the (my?) problem is partly one of terminology:

- there is no obligation to provide a VAT invoice to a non-VAT registered customer. The invoice is usually issued before it is paid. (so Plusnet are OK to not issue a VAT invoice to residential customers)

- there is no requirement to issue a (VAT) receipt (issued after payment) unless the customer requests one (most won't ask, so again Plusnet are mostly OK - unless someone asks for a receipt).

- Plusnet issue a bill, usually before payment if you pay by direct debit. That isn't a term that HMRC use - and it isn't clear to me whether that is intended to be an invoice or a receipt. It doesn't satisfy either from the VAT perspective.

So if Plusnet consider their bill to be an invoice to a non-VAT registered customer, then there should still be some mechanism to request a VAT receipt once that is paid.

Jonpe
Champion
Posts: 2,055
Thanks: 560
Fixes: 7
Registered: ‎05-09-2016

Re: New Invoice Changes

Although more expensive, PN business BB has certain advantages I believe, like 24 hr support without the long waiting times, static IP (not very expensive to get on any of their products anyway).  However, the government should perhaps be encouraging more people to work from home (fewer cars clogging the roads etc.), and in order to facilitate this they could either make VAT invoicing compulsory for all VAT registered companies, or just assume that the amount charged includes VAT at the current rate if the invoice is from a reputable company of a size that would require it to be VAT registered.  Or is this too simple?

Have you approached HMRC re. claiming part of the cost of your home BB as a tax deductable expense?

Andy_Hampshire
Hooked
Posts: 8
Thanks: 19
Registered: ‎14-02-2012

Re: New Invoice Changes

Why should I, as a private individual be forced to take out a more expensive "business" contract when i'm not a business ? For what benefit ? Priority support that i've used once in the last few years ? Static IP, that I already pay for ?

When all that is needed is a minor adjustment to the formatting of a pdf invoice to include the VAT number and breakdown ? Really ?

HMRC allow the reclaiming of BB charges for employees who are home based or partly home based.

BazFitzpatrick
Dabbler
Posts: 15
Thanks: 24
Registered: ‎24-07-2018

Re: New Invoice Changes

The silence from Plusnet is deafening.

corringham
Pro
Posts: 208
Thanks: 111
Fixes: 2
Registered: ‎25-09-2015

Re: New Invoice Changes

As you are not VAT registered, Plusnet are within their rights not to issue a VAT invoice. However, you do not need a VAT invoice to reclaim expenses - but your employer will require you to have a VAT receipt. A VAT receipt can be the simplified format, which does not itemize VAT (other than the total for each band). That is enough for a VAT registered business to reclaim VAT (for the amounts involved anyway).

If Plusnet put their VAT number on their bills, that would suffice as a simplified VAT invoice, and all would be good.

SM_queries
Hooked
Posts: 8
Thanks: 15
Registered: ‎24-07-2018

Re: New Invoice Changes

Knowing that HMRC's rules on VAT reporting only require publication of a suppliers VAT number to be a good enough receipt under Simplified Format, then the reason that Plusnet has chosen not to do this is blatently obvious:

"they want you to upgrade to a business account and pay the premium that account entails."

I'd be very surprised if they relent and so it's a case of closing/moving your account from Plusnet if one wants to reclaim the VAT element in the invoice. HMRC will not allow it to be reclaimed unless it is either a full vat invoice or one in the Simplified Format.

Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 2,367
Thanks: 3,993
Fixes: 75
Registered: ‎29-09-2011

Re: New Invoice Changes

We previously were able to offer VAT invoices to residential customers on an ad-hoc basis. Due to our recent systems update, the functionality to do this is no longer in place.  We let our customers know in plenty of time so that they were able to change to a business account, if they still needed to receive a VAT invoice after the 1st September.

 

It’s fair for us to assume that customers needing a VAT invoice are using our broadband to support a business and require the invoice for tax purposes. This goes against our residential broadband terms and conditions, which states that it is for personal use only, and not for use in running a business. We have tailored business broadband packages and are really proud of the work we do in supporting small businesses. Customers are able to create a new business account with Plusnet, and can take advantage of our new customer deals. They can also keep any domains or email addresses that they currently have with their residential account, as we know that changing these details can be annoying.

 Jono H
 Plusnet Community Manager
Andy_Hampshire
Hooked
Posts: 8
Thanks: 19
Registered: ‎14-02-2012

Re: New Invoice Changes

Wow,  that has to be the most arrogant post from Plusnet i've ever seen.

 

 

There's a lot of difference between running a small business, and working from home. By that definition i guess 95% of your customers are breaking the T&C's because they access work email/services via their broadband. 

Simply including Plusnet's VAT registration number on the standard invoice would be sufficient, but I can see you're not even prepared to consider it ....

BazFitzpatrick
Dabbler
Posts: 15
Thanks: 24
Registered: ‎24-07-2018

Re: New Invoice Changes

Totally agree.

This "sod the customer" attitude that pervades big business in this country. It would take nothing to include the VAt number in the header or footer. But no for the sake of s****ing a few extra quid out of they are upsetting thousands.

They've been taking lessons from RyanAir - Plusnet you're taking the p**s and wanting to charge us for it.

corringham
Pro
Posts: 208
Thanks: 111
Fixes: 2
Registered: ‎25-09-2015

Re: New Invoice Changes

@@JonoH, that's an interesting post. I don't really want to hijack this topic, but I feel the need to respond. When I moved house just under 5 years ago I considered a business account (I work from home for an employer, so I'm not actually a business, but I obviously do activities that "support" a business). I was advised that there would be no detectable difference in the broadband (it is ADSL only, and no contention in the local network), and that the only difference was marginally better support (you can report a fault anytime, but it still takes ages to get it fixed), higher cost, and a longer contract period.

Nothing appears to have changed since then, apart from Plusnet's terms and conditions.

I had been planning to move to a business account as my contract has ended, but now I'm thinking that as my static IP address would change anyway (with all the hassle that will cause) it makes more sense to move somewhere where I can get IPv6, configurable rDNS, and a more constructive attitude.

 

SM_queries
Hooked
Posts: 8
Thanks: 15
Registered: ‎24-07-2018

Re: New Invoice Changes

JonoH - I'm sure your comments supporting Plusnet's actions removing VAT details are well-intentioned, but the reality is that just about all working adults use their personal home broadband for business emails/web searching - a moment's thought and you will see how flimsy is the basis of your argument.

corringham
Pro
Posts: 208
Thanks: 111
Fixes: 2
Registered: ‎25-09-2015

Re: New Invoice Changes

JonoH stated "Due to our recent systems update, the functionality to do this is no longer in place."

I don't doubt that - but the question is why is it no longer in place? I'm guessing it isn't a technical issue, and is in fact  a policy issue which required a conscious decision not to provide that functionality in the new "improved" billing system. Particularly so as the billing for business accounts must support it. Is there in fact any other difference between residential and business billing?

arnold4
Hooked
Posts: 5
Thanks: 5
Registered: ‎12-09-2018

Re: New Invoice Changes

Absolutely disgraceful , new bill is a classic of someone with nothing else to do other than make peoples day worse. Great blocks of colour that will empty my ink cartridge. No VAT showing. Useless. Customer is always right? blah

been with you years, will be searching for better now

mgelder
Dabbler
Posts: 14
Thanks: 1
Registered: ‎06-11-2011

Re: New Invoice Changes

Come on Plusnet, do us proud.

Its a simple task to change the new invoice line from This is not a VAT Invoice

to show VAT No: 245 7193 48

 

We'd love you forever ... well at least another 15 years !