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Plusnet eats my Email

dusty_bin
Grafter
Posts: 138
Registered: 12-06-2007

Plusnet eats my Email

Hi,
I set my Netgear 834 to email the router logs.  Everything works fine if I have the emails sent direct to my local email server, but I also wanted the emails to go out when my computer is off - so I set the router to send via relay.plus.net and later tried autoturn.plus.net.  Nothing turns up.
My suspicion is that the Plusnet system think these emails are blatant spam, so they get dropped.   I haven't been able to check rigorously, but I think the router sends very simple emails with no Message ID:, no From: header, etc.
Is there any way to resolve this problem?
The two emails I tried so far would have been sent at 01:00 UTC on 05/06/2009 and 18:00 UTC on 07/06/2009, give or take about 50 mS.   Subject line was: NETGEAR Security Log [F1:29:6F]
Router reports email being sent sucessfully.
Cheers
Geoff
Edit: perhaps better in the IronPort and Email Platform Development  forum - can someone move it?
7 REPLIES
Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 12,799
Thanks: 630
Fixes: 62
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Hi Geoff,
Am I correct to assume that these emails are being forwarded to a Plusnet mailbox? If so, then it's possible that the messages are failing IronPort's SenderBase checks. If this is happening then the server will be returning a 5.x.x error response - I doubt your router knows what to do with that though.
If you haven't done already, disable the 'Discard Obvious Spam' option using the Manage My Mail tool in the Member Centre. If that doesn't work then it's worth checking whether or not your forward/reverse DNS match. Are you able to send these messages elsewhere? If you can then a copy of the headers from one of the received messages would probably shed some light on why these aren't getting through to your Plusnet account.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Products Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

dusty_bin
Grafter
Posts: 138
Registered: 12-06-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Hi Bob,
The emails go to a domain 'hosted' by PN, but to mailboxes on my own email server with delivery by SMTP:
mydomain mail is handled by 5 mail.mydomain
mydomain mail is handled by 10 autoturn.plus.net.uk.
mydomain mail is handled by 20 mx.last.plus.net.
My PN base name and all hosted domains have Spam Protection set to 'off'.
Regarding forward/reverse DNS for mail.mydomain, these do tie up

I'm guessing the router doesn't get a 5xx response as it says the email was sent successfully.
The emails are originating from my router with the WAN IP corresponding to mydomain and are being sent to a mailbox@mydomain
I'll check later (hopefully tonight) and try to extract the headers and SMTP dialogue for one of the successful messages to my server.
If it's OK, I could send by PM to avoid munging...

Community Veteran
Posts: 1,584
Thanks: 59
Fixes: 2
Registered: 17-06-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Can you try forwarding to an external email service like googlemail.
I've found that email going out through relay.plus.net to pn email addresses (or JTN email addresses which forward to PN email addresses) get eaten on the way back in. If I sent the same email to an external email address is arrives.
I've got pretty much the same set up as you. I use my local email server to forward all outgoing email via the pn email server which saves me having to handle any transitory errors and queuing , and also means my email seems to be sent from PN which hopefully gets round a lot of the "don't know this IP as a server, can't do full DNS/MX checks, bin it" sort of problems. Incoming email to addresses on my PN domain is handled by SMTP forwarding.
Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 12,799
Thanks: 630
Fixes: 62
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Quote from: dusty_bin
The emails go to a domain 'hosted' by PN, but to mailboxes on my own email server with delivery by SMTP:
mydomain mail is handled by 5 mail.mydomain
mydomain mail is handled by 10 autoturn.plus.net.uk.
mydomain mail is handled by 20 mx.last.plus.net.
My PN base name and all hosted domains have Spam Protection set to 'off'.

Right, that rules Senderbase out then as it isn't used by the relay servers (which is where your comments suggest the problem is). Having said that, the outbound servers do still perform spam checks.
Quote
The emails are originating from my router with the WAN IP corresponding to mydomain and are being sent to a mailbox@mydomain

And that forwards directly to the IP address of your mail server yes?
Quote
I'll check later (hopefully tonight) and try to extract the headers and SMTP dialogue for one of the successful messages to my server.
If it's OK, I could send by PM to avoid munging...

Feel free to PM me.
Quote from: SteveA
Can you try forwarding to an external email service like googlemail.

That's not a bad idea. You should be able to use SMTP authentication and Google's relay server with minimal effort. This should at least help prove that it is our relay servers that are causing the problem.
Quote from: SteveA
I've found that email going out through relay.plus.net to pn email addresses (or JTN email addresses which forward to PN email addresses) get eaten on the way back in. If I sent the same email to an external email address is arrives.

That shouldn't be happening now as far as I'm aware.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Products Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

dusty_bin
Grafter
Posts: 138
Registered: 12-06-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Quote from: Bob
... Having said that, the outbound servers do still perform spam checks.

I did also use autoturn.plus.net.uk which is incoming...
Quote
Quote
The emails are originating from my router with the WAN IP corresponding to mydomain and are being sent to a mailbox@mydomain

And that forwards directly to the IP address of your mail server yes?

I'm not sure I understood exactly what you meant by 'forward directly'.
I should have said 'the WAN IP corresponding to the primary MX record of mydomain, i.e. the originating IP corresponds to the IP of my server', or:
- my PN static IP is MyIP
- the primary MX for mydomain is mail.mydomain
- mail.mydomain resolves to myIP
- email is sent from myIP
- email is addressed to mailbox@mydomain
- router connects and sends email to PNserver (smarthost or autoturn)
Quote
Quote from: SteveA
Can you try forwarding to an external email service like googlemail.

That's not a bad idea. You should be able to use SMTP authentication and Google's relay server with minimal effort. This should at least help prove that it is our relay servers that are causing the problem.

Well, for now, I just set the router to send to an existing gmail account, and it got through OK - albeit in the spam folder...
I'll drop you that email by PM.
I'll also check, when I get home, to make sure the was no rejection on my side of an attempt by autoturn.
Community Veteran
Posts: 1,584
Thanks: 59
Fixes: 2
Registered: 17-06-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Quote from: Bob

Quote from: SteveA
I've found that email going out through relay.plus.net to pn email addresses (or JTN email addresses which forward to PN email addresses) get eaten on the way back in. If I sent the same email to an external email address is arrives.

That shouldn't be happening now as far as I'm aware.

Well it happened yesterday, but I can see if its cleared up.
Edited to add: No it hasn't. It works going to places like Yahoo (but ends up in the spam folder).  I did post a separate thread on it
dusty_bin
Grafter
Posts: 138
Registered: 12-06-2007

Re: Plusnet eats my Email

Hi Bob
Quote from: dusty_bin
I'll also check, when I get home, to make sure the was no rejection on my side of an attempt by autoturn.

Embarrassed Oh dear, I just found this in my log Embarrassed:
08/06/2009 17:05:20 EHLO relay.pcl-ipout01.plus.net  --->  250-mydomain  250 XFROMIP 
08/06/2009 17:05:20 May refuse use of local FROM address (geoff@mydomain) from non-local client (212.159.7.99)
So it was almost certainly my server that was dropping the email...  I'll delete that non-local check and see if that fixes it...
Sorry!...
Geoff
Edit: Yes - confirmed it was my server being overly picky - emails are now arriving.  Sorry for not checking properly before assuming they got lost in the PN email system.