Move Master Socket

[#1]

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@Baldrick1 wrote:

CAT 6 is fine but the central separator makes it relatively stiff, CAT5e is good enough for 1000Mbps up to 100M and is more flexible.

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Does it need to be flexible ?.

Stranded Cat5e is good for easy to use flexible patch cables to hook-up between home network devices, or movable things like laptops, but permanent wiring within a house, particularly if between wall mounted ethernet sockets, the cable is usually solid-core copper wires and stiff.

Now that Openreach are installing 2.5Gbit ONTs, if you are having new cables installed, why would you limit yourself to 1000Mbps Cat5e, when 2.5Gbit ethernet will be the standard for the next decade.

I'm currently in the process of building my next router, and the WAN and LAN sockets are all 2.5Gbit -

[#2]

Just to be clear. You don't even need Cat5e for Gigabit:

Old 4-core phone cable (Cat3 maybe) - fine for 100mbit domestically

Cat5 - Gigabit (honestly) so don't bin it, use it.

Cat5e - Gigabit but better for longer runs and more "challenging" environments (i.e. commercial)

Cat6 - Up to 10Gigabit at domestic distances (55 metres?)

I still use old phone cable for some links as it's easier to run, less obvious and works fine. Usually better than WiFi too. And as I'm now on FTTC at 60mbps it's still more than adequate for downloads.

Just be aware that there are various old patch cables around (typically supplied with old routers) that may appear to be Cat5/5e but only have 4 cores; they only run at 100mbps.

[#3]

I think my option will be CAT6 Direct burial LLDPE with UV jacket to my garage to a POE switch for the Solar and cameras and a WAP fitted for the Zappi/Harvi

[#4]

@ph0enix1962 That sounds fairly future-proof. I'd definitely get the existing master socket working before even thinking about having it moved.

And bear in mind the comments about upgrading to full fibre, that requires a powered unit on the end of the fibre inside your property. Then an ethernet cable from that to "your" router, which can be elsewhere.

[#5]

@ph0enix1962 

Whatever you eventually decide to do, I would wait until you've got your PN connection up and running. Assuming no OR visit is required, then you're free to do what you wish.

If Full Fibre does come your way (you can check www.openreach.co.uk to see what they say about your property) then, as stated, the arrival point is where your current copper cable is. There is a certain leeway in the location of the internal ONT but that can only be finalised on the day of install. It does need a power source. The router is attached via ethernet cable so can go anywhere you want.

If you're doing work to sort out your home network then it's worth considering if Full Fibre would make a difference on how / where you run cables.

As an aside, I think Cat5e is more than enough for home networks.

Brian

[#6]

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@HPsauce wrote:

Nothing wrong really with an extension if you do it properly. 😎

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True, if you do it properly.

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If you use rubbish cable, use the real master socket and/or leave an extension cable, fixed or otherwise, connected at this point then that is not doing it properly, and can introduce a bridge tap.

I have tried using telephone extension cable to see if it would work at 10/100Mbps without success. I guess that it was the quality of the cable. Much better to do the job properly. 

[#7]

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@HPsauce wrote:

And bear in mind the comments about upgrading to full fibre, that requires a powered unit on the end of the fibre inside your property. Then an ethernet cable from that to "your" router, which can be elsewhere.

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Taking that thought process a little further ...

Assume that the network layout was based on the future plan for having the inevitable full fibre, where as @HPsauce says, "your" router could be located in a more ideal place elsewhere, and have it's WAN connected back to the ONT (assumed to be where existing Master Socket is) with an ethernet cable.

In the short term while waiting for full fibre, and therefore needing to use the existing Master Socket (where it is), if the aforementioned ethernet cable was 'ready' to plug in to the ONT,  then while you are still on SoGEA you could use a small VDSL modem next to your Master Socket to convert the copper broadband to PPPoE ethernet (as if it was the ONT).

Therefore when the time comes for full fibre, all you would need to do to move from SoGEA to FTTP, is replace the Master Socket with the new ONT, unplug the ethernet cable from the VDSL modem and plug it in to the ONT, and reuse the mains wall power socket for the ONT PSU instead of the the modem's power plug.

You can easily get a decent DrayTek stand alone VDSL modem on eBay for about £20.

The modem below has keyhole wall mounting slots on the bottom, so you can hang it on the wall with two screws to keep things tidy, or laid flat as shown.

[#8]

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@ph0enix1962 wrote:

Would an ex BT enginner be authorised to move it ? Vodafone have said they can't help me

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This may be of interest

https://www.btengineerlondon.co.uk/can-i-move-my-master-bt-socket/

[#9]

I have always run my routers from the extension socket in our study (5-6 meteres from the Master socket by the front door). The extension socket was part of the original new build house.
My Plusnet Hub 2 currently gets c. 65 Mbps from the extension socket which is perfectly respectable for my "63-71Mb" package and is plenty for my needs.

[#10]

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@Baldrick1 wrote:

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@HPsauce wrote:

Nothing wrong really with an extension if you do it properly. 😎

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True, if you do it properly.

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If you use rubbish cable, use the real master socket and/or leave an extension cable, fixed or otherwise, connected at this point then that is not doing it properly, and can introduce a bridge tap.

I have tried using telephone extension cable to see if it would work at 10/100Mbps without success. I guess that it was the quality of the cable. Much better to do the job properly. 

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OTOH I was using nothing but an extension socket (complete with its own duplicate master socket components!) for years; from Dial Up, ADSL 2+, to VDSL (FTTC). Most successfully on VDSL, albeit I was on the restricted 10/40 Mbps service rather than the maximum reported ~72Mbps for my circuit. (Currently using Wi-Fi as am now on FF)

IMO (😁) this extension socket aversion is just one of those 'things' - like "never turn your router off overnight". 

[#11]

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@198kHz wrote

This may be of interest

https://www.btengineerlondon.co.uk/can-i-move-my-master-bt-socket/

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"Who wants a master socket installed behind their front door or on a window sill?"

Hah! "behind their front door", that's where my original master socket is - leading to lots of 'interesting' experiences* and problems, from environmental issues. Still, it was as they say: A learning experience.

* Including online rows with some of the then (somewhat conflict oriented) online Plusnet Community experts!

[#12]

“IMO (😁) this extension socket aversion is just one of those 'things' - like "never turn your router off overnight".”

Yes I agree, until I switched to FTTP my router was plugged into a phone extension socket in my study and achieved over 70Mb on FTTC despite there being 3 other extensions in the house as well as the master which was itself unused as it was in an inconvenient position. Phone wiring is pretty tolerant of all sorts of loads and mismatches as long as you use decent cabling, not some random length of bell wire etc.