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So much for fracking democracy.

Minivanman
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So much for fracking democracy.

So much for fracking democracy and the will of the people.

A contentious issue to be sure, but why should the pursuit of profit overrule that of local objections and valid concerns? This is all so terribly wrong in my humble opinion. It just does not smell right.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-37567866

 

All views expressed are my own but you can express them too if you want to be right about everything like I am.
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

As I said in another thread, those with the most money get their way...

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

And that is precisely why, despite all the pronouncements of a "new world" on the horizon, our new leader will find it nigh on impossible to change anything in real terms. She also has to be very careful with what she says because there will be quite a few disappointing decisions which have to me made which will contradict her apparent attitude. 

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

@Minivanman that's a very narrow definition of democracy, the nationally elected government considering the greater good for the nation and the individual citizen versus local NIMBYs and the usual suspects Friends of the Earth and Greenpeace. 

 

THe Secretary of State was asked to decide on local issue of noise and traffic disruption and made the only sensible decision. Now the opposition is considering a vexatious legal review

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

"The greater good"

 

A term often abused throughout history, from forced relocations to irreparable environmental damage, it's been a mainstay as the excuse for those who have the power to influence governments...

 

Of course, there's absolutely no alternative to fracking for gas, is there? For example, there's no such thing as biogas produced from waste (plant waste, animal waste, human waste, etc.), there's no extracting gas from old landfill sites instead of just venting it into the atmosphere, there can't possibly be something like sewer gas (akin to biogas, just from sewage systems), and of course, there's no ideas of not actually using gas on such a big scale... Wink

 

But of course, those with the money & lawyers have told the government that such alternatives, which are cheaper and can yield more gas than fracking, aren't an option...

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

@twocvbloke not at the right price!

AS an example the price for electricity from Hinkley Point ha been set at £95/MWH as compared with £55 for a gas CCPP. This seems high but it is pitched to match renewables. And it's the public particularly the lower paid who suffer from this policy. Your examples are all renewables and won't compare with fracked gas. Also fracked gas is required as a feedstock to save our chemical industry. The selection of gasses you quote don't meet the spec for that 

 

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Minivanman
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

So local issues like fracking are decided by our elected representatives, while national issues are decided by way of referendum? Sounds to me like we have that round the wrong way. Democracy is as much about local issues like Parish Councils as well as national issues such as who governs our nation - and I see nothing 'narrow' about that.

We are all aware of NIMBYs but to put organisations like Friends of the Earth and Greenpeace into that category and to refer to them as 'suspects' is just plain wrong and anyway, this is not about visuals such as pylons, windmills and supermarkets, this is about sucking the life out from under our feet and profit for the few at the expense of the many. Coal mines anybody?

I'm guessing that Secretary of State has not heard the last of this.  

All views expressed are my own but you can express them too if you want to be right about everything like I am.
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.


PeterLoftus wrote:
Your examples are all renewables and won't compare with fracked gas.

 

But, when the fracked gas runs out, it's gone for good, but, there will always be poo... Smiley

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

@twocvbloke meanwhile, the government is extracting the urine , democratically speaking, of course... 

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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

This is Scotland but it makes my point, Scotland has banned Fracking so the investment and jobs are probably going to come to England. And it's not gas for burning but a chemical feedstock https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/opinion/jenny-hjul/182707/fracking-scotlands-costly-mistake/

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Minivanman
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

Bit hypocritical considering they are importing the stuff. International nimbyism no less.

Local views, local voices and Local Authorities should not be stamped on in this way. Why on earth should Cuadrilla be the winners here after submitting an appeal, it makes no sense..... unless you follow the money. As for that Tory placeman Mark Menzies, that guy needs to get off that fracking fence and listen to those that voted for him - albeit with a large majority, otherwise he's going to find himself out on his ear come the next election and no mistake.

All views expressed are my own but you can express them too if you want to be right about everything like I am.
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

Of course fracking should take place, if you are against fracking then by definition you must be against extraction of coal, oil, slate and every single mineral that comes out of the ground, there have been numerous accidents with the extraction of things such as coal, oil etc but there is no opposition to getting these things.

Think of the benefit you have got, or what you would not have had if activists had managed to keep things in the ground.

Now lets move on to fracking in Lancashire where I live. The objection by the Labour council is political, you would have to live in Lancashire to know what these numpties on the council have done, many essential services have been cut and the Council will soon be in debt, fracking will bring much needed money and jobs to this area and the sooner they get on with it the better.

Residents who object are really bothered about the visual impact and loss of value to their properties and all this other rubbish about contanimation of water etc is just a red herring.

I bet if your energy bill is kept low because of this you will not be quick to object to that.

Luzern
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.


twocvbloke wrote:

PeterLoftus wrote:
Your examples are all renewables and won't compare with fracked gas.

 

But, when the fracked gas runs out, it's gone for good, but, there will always be poo... Smiley


Well then, in that case I can wait for the poo, and will as long as it's possible.Roll eyes

To be blunt, the needs of the country come first, so the Greens and their ilk should kick up their stink somewhere else.Ticked off

No one has to agree with my opinion, but in the time I have left a miracle would be nice.
Minivanman
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

Hey c'mon, you cannot be serious!

To say that the needs of the country comes first and by implication I suspect you mean yourself, is an outrageous thing to say even in jest. Are you having a laugh, trying to wind us up, or both?

France, Bulgaria, Germany and now Scotland have all banned fracking and Labour is also opposed to it.

Unbelievable.

All views expressed are my own but you can express them too if you want to be right about everything like I am.
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Re: So much for fracking democracy.

@Minivanman no @Luzern is spot on when I refer to the needs of the country I'm considering all those scientists, engineers, financiers, regulators and civil servants who act professionally working within the bounds of the agreed regulatory framework to deliver on these projects. They will have wives and kids and aren't setting out to destroy the planet like some James Bond villains!

On the other hand I've seen some of the " information" put out by the pressure groups and the best science is on the side of industry and government.

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