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Petition to get FTTP to every home

Community Veteran
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Registered: 21-03-2011

Petition to get FTTP to every home

Here a petition to the Gov't "Require all UK broadband/telephone lines to become fibre to the property (FTTP)"
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122924

The idea is to get the topic discussed in Parliament. The originator, not me  Smiley, told a Parliamentary Sub-Committee  that describing BT Infinity as "Fibre Broadband" is the biggest con trick played on the British Public since the South Sea Bubble. He regards the FTTC implementation as a technology dead-end.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
15 REPLIES
Community Veteran
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

The Fibre con has been going on long before BT Infinity was a thing, VirginMedia pulled it out of their hat over 10 years ago, I was using them for internet (whopping 10Mbps at the time!!), and received a promotional letter saying something along the lines of "Congratulations! you're now on a fibreoptic network and will receive faster speeds", but the same1990s Nynex-installed copper coax was still in place, the street cabs (occasionally left unlocked and wide open) were all still using the 1990s Nynex coax, so where the fibreoptics were, I don't know, but it was pretty much FTTC, and never went above 10Mbps... Grin
Community Veteran
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

Unless the cost drops significantly I certainly couldn't afford it.
Community Veteran
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

"Call me dave" wants everyone on the internet by the time he leaves, so if the costs don't fall, he'll look a fool (again)... Grin
Kremmen
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

FTTP would be nice but very expensive IMO.
I'd be happy if they increased the fibre cabinets. I'm in London with my nearest cabinet 800 metres away, cable length, on an aluminium phone cable to outside my house. Cheaper option and do-able, maybe.
Let's be careful out there !
Community Veteran
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

How expensive will it be to not have true fibre optic in the coming years?  I exclude the people within 200 metres of their exchange, but BT is using all kinds of tricks to push twisted  copper to its limits for an asymmetric service. Demand will soon exceed those limits. Effectively all the money spent so far on FTTC has been wasted.  The funding for FTTP could be raised by financial Bonds and repaid by the telecoms industry over 20 years. There is need to load the installation cost upfront.
BT could also reduce its operational maintenance costs by moving away from copper pair technology. The only real barrier is corporate short term profit motive.

Here's an astute take on the development of telecomms in the UK.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
itsme
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

So how will this be implemented? A single fibre feed to each house from the exchange or the use of splitters? The former very expensive the latter could be more problematic than copper joints.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 27-10-2012

Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

Quote from: AlaricAdair
He regards the FTTC implementation as a technology dead-end.

Yet it's a technology used by every industrialized country and still being rolled out worldwide.
Kremmen
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

I wish I was on copper  Undecided
Aluminium is dreadful. According to the engineer 58Mbps is being pushed out from the cabinet but only 20Mbps of that is getting to me.
Let's be careful out there !
nanotm
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

@Kremmen and the fibre optic cable would be cheaper to install when replacing that metal cable, as well as giving a monstrous speed and bandwidth boost.
the cost of replacing the copper system isn't the only consideration, some copper lines would have to be maintained (although in fairness less than 100 lines in most exchanges) and everything else could be replaced by fibre, the existing street cabs could have the current cards changed and fibre be used to replace the metal cables to each subscriber (but they would need ot work on how to do that) instead of running new fibres from the exchange direct to peoples homes,
the costs of doing the work are the single biggest expense in any case and you would need to pass new laws preventing people from being able to block the works from getting undertaken for them to run at peek efficiency (because its no good demanding the upgrade only for some nimby to moan they need to drive down the road and your not digging up my rhodidendrums...... wasting billions nationally in pointless court costs and adding years to the timetable)
and therin lies the problem (no matter who is laying the lines or what there made of) they cant just unplug the old lines and pull new ones through the same routes so they have to lay down new ones (so as to cause minimal disruptions to service) and the old stuff just gets left in place, (because recovering it needs new works access and permits and the same nimbyism problems) meaning its dead money.
if BT were able to unplug you at the exchange and run the fibre up the existing trunking a lot of the upfront costs would be mitigated by sales of recovered assets (metals and other working assets like cabinets) but not giving that option means you have to front load the cost of the national project through bond sales and then hope you make enough to cover the interst annually and save up enough to repay them at the end point (without some chancellor deciding to steal it all out of your corporate accounts through new legislation like brown did in the past)
i'd be happy if my local council front funded the cost off FTTP for everyone in the area (going zone by zone) and BT repaid them as it sold off the recovered gear, and if they set up wifi repeater nodes for the interim to provide a minimal service level for the weeks of disruption i'd even be okay with that (most people have mobiles anyway) if it meant getting real fibre across the entire town, of course the roads disruption would be another problem and so in reality whilst necessary such a project would never be possible (it took them 24 months to replace the 100 year old water pipes so the roads could be kept open for most of the time, instead of just closing them for a week and doing the work all at once on the main traffic arteries......)

as with most things it sounds great looks good on paper but fails the second it contacts the real world....
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Kremmen
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

When I had my service upgraded to FTTC the engineer was an 'old boy' who know's the area as he's been working locally for a few decades. Really nice guy who spent loads of time switching cabinet pairs to give me the best connection.
He told me that the ally cable on my estate isn't in trunking but just laid underground. It will remain in situ until the phone network starts to break as that is what it was designed for. In his opinion the cable is degrading quite badly, he reports it on a regular basis, but whilst the phone works.....
Let's be careful out there !
nanotm
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

@Kremmen if that was my estate I think i would be ensuring that the local soil was topped up with NaOH and then when it rained i rather suspect those lines wouldn't work for anyone anymore .... of course given the rate of degredation its likely the area has naturally peat soil which is probably just what you don't want for ally cables....
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
rwaller
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Registered: 13-12-2013

Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

Your tag looks familiar - Vaper Somerset ?Huh
mav:quote
nanotm
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

anything is possible
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Community Veteran
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Re: Petition to get FTTP to every home

The Institute of Directors is not impressed with Superfarce Broadband - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35681475
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.