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New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

wotsup
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

Call it what you will but by their constant undermining of the referendum result some remain voters ( the ones who refuse to accept that country voted leave ) have more or less guaranteed that no deal worth having would be offered - an EU emboldened by the division in the country have just concocted a deal they knew would never be acceptable to UK parliament and are cocky enough to say they will not reopen it even though it was voted out 3 times... 

 

With Euro on life support and Germany in recession and civil war in France the EU would seem to need all the friends it can get..

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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

Please allow me to give you an example of why reverting to WTO rules would be a bad idea.

The recent announcement that PSA is considering closing its Vauxhall plant has been dismissed as "noise" by those who say that it's nothing to do with Brexit, but more to do with the general turndown Globally, despite what the chairman of PSA said.

Ok. All vehicle manufacturers have reduced their output to cater for the global downturn. PSA has said it will close its plant and set up alternatives in Europe. This alternative plant will be to manufacture the same number and type of units that would have been made in the UK. So why would they do that? It costs a small fortune to close a car plant. Nothing to do with global downturn, everything to do with expected supply-chain problems, and they are these...

If we left the EU without an agreement to negotiate a trade deal, we would automatically have to trade under World Trade Organisation rules. That's the way it is and we couldn't argue about it. We would be considered a "third country" under the WTO rules and any trade would be subject to those rules, which allocate trade tariffs in many (and I mean many) different ways according to what the item being traded is. Some have tariffs in excess of 30%, some as low as 5%.

We currently have seamless passage of ALL goods through ports into and out of the UK. This means that trucks containing mixed loads of many items don't need to be individually checked because the tariff on all the goods is the same, ie zero.

Now then, please think about this... all of our ports are extremely busy with two-way trade, with ships leaving every 20 minutes or so, some car ferries, others Roll-on-Roll-off ferries just for trucks, and other container vessels carrying goods and exports to the United Kingdom and larger European ports such as Rotterdam where they will be transferred to container ships and carried across the world. Come no-deal Brexit day, every truck arriving from the UK into any EU port will need to be inspected. And that will involve physically opening those trucks, making sure that the paperwork matches the load, accessing the World Trade Organisation’s (WTO) list of tariffs, applying the appropriate rate.

There are 164 nations that are members of the WTO. And everything that moves under the WTO rules are assigned numbers, all part of its “Harmonised System”. Basically, everything that moves is given at least a six-digit number that describes its category.

There are 99 broad categories, which form the first two numbers, with sub-categories coming in the following four. Here’s an example: 04 is dairy products, eggs and other edible animal products. These are then divided by adding more digits. So, 0403 would indicate it’s milk, or 0403.10 would be yoghurt, or 0403.10.11 would be low-fat yoghurt, and 0403.10.11.04 another variation on that theme.

But if it was yoghurt made, for example, from goat’s milk, then the coding is different. And does this process take the product beyond its sell-by date? And how would that affect a truck load of car parts, maybe 200,000 or more per load, many with different tariff rates?

It's complicated. Now imagine every truck leaving the UK having to be checked, figuring out what’s on the truck, assign numbers — or if numbers have been assigned by shippers, making sure that those numbers are right to eliminate fraud. Then assessing tariffs — and tariffs are not the same on all products according to WTO rules.

That truck will then have to be placed under a customs seal, with that seal number recorded on paperwork and records, either electronically or by hand. And once the customs officers are happy with that paperwork, the tariffs have to be paid.

Who pays it? And when? Does the truck driver have to pay? What if his company isn’t bonded or has a bad payment record? Have those tariffs been paid in advance? This could all be totally automated no doubt, but that will take a long time and will need total cooperation from truck operators in all countries. So in the mean time before any other deals could be made? We are snookered.

This might be read by a few on here, and possibly believed by even fewer. I can assure you that this is totally factual. To be honest it frightens me, so this could be what we are in for. Imagine the effects it will have on the country.


The more a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it -- George Orwell.

Beware "alternative facts".

"Nineteen Eighty-Four" is set in Landing Strip, which is understood to be Great Britain in the future, a division of Oceania, a superstate that is continually at war with other superstates. Currently being organised by an American administration near you.
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@wotsup wrote:

Call it what you will but by their constant undermining of the referendum result some remain voters ( the ones who refuse to accept that country voted leave ) have more or less guaranteed that no deal worth having would be offered - an EU emboldened by the division in the country have just concocted a deal they knew would never be acceptable to UK parliament and are cocky enough to say they will not reopen it even though it was voted out 3 times... 

 

With Euro on life support and Germany in recession and civil war in France the EU would seem to need all the friends it can get..


 

If a majority voted to shoot themselves I for one would not join them. 


The more a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it -- George Orwell.

Beware "alternative facts".

"Nineteen Eighty-Four" is set in Landing Strip, which is understood to be Great Britain in the future, a division of Oceania, a superstate that is continually at war with other superstates. Currently being organised by an American administration near you.
Champnet
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

Let’s leave aside the thought that some CEOs and Chairpersons of large Companies may have the idea they can influence decisions affecting the Country.....

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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

Along with more than a few celebs.

And I expect Prince Charles is biting his tongue.

wotsup
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

@nozzer 

You go on at great length to explain why a WTO exit would be so bad for UK in your judgement ....

But WTO rules exit from EU is the one that people who refused to accept the result have caused....if country had stuck together we would probably have left a year ago with an acceptable trade deal.  It pays to remember that the present withdrawal agreement is an EU treaty with no exit clause.

RobC
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@wotsup wrote:

Call it what you will but by their constant undermining of the referendum result some


 

You really are deluded if you believe that.

The EU knows everything there is to know about the UK. We've worked hand in hand for decades.

 

The only real fear they had (look it up) was the UK's historic incredible negotiating powers, which the EU has benefited from in our intense involvement in the EU's great trade deals.

- but instead of competent and efficient civil service professionals,  the UK 'sent' David Davies when he bothered to even go - 4 occasions wasn't it?

 

During which time the UK spun fantasies and nasty rhetoric (just like you lot still do) rather than making strides in

competently and efficiently dealing with the situation as the EU initially expected.

THAT was what the EU feared.

 

ALL the blame for the UK's failures are down to the utter failure of the Brexiters to act and manage in any sort of competent manner.

They preferred to spin [-Censored-] and whip up sentiment rather than try to deliver even something of the lies they spun to get the result - just like you Brexiters here

 

 


@wotsup wrote:

With Euro on life support and Germany in recession and civil war in France the EU would seem to need all the friends it can get..


 

You simply aren't real.

Which currency is on life support? Its just been in a big picture and explained to you.

Which nation is actually currently dropping into official recession? Take a look - its us.

Which nation has a very uncivil war going on and has NO friends?  Clue - read this forum.

 

 

You Brexiters here are perfect examples of why Brexit is and will fail - even if we do leave

All you have is rhinosh** and fantasy without a justifiable case or idea among you all.

Demonstrated day after day both here and by the countries Leaders.

 

You mirror the Brexit politicians, and they mirror you - and That should worry you immensely if nothing else does.

 

You Brexiters are the causes of these failures. Not people offering reasoned opinion and observation.

 

Show us ONE just ONE real, defined benefit for the British public from Brexit
Other than: Bankrupt businesses, Devalued currency, Chlorine bleached chicken, Climate Science Denial, Milk from infected udders and the NHS sold to US pharmaceuticals and insurance companies?

Brexit - Built from Bovine Manure by Bots
RobPN
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@ffox wrote:

if you can't produce a worthwhile argument, create a diversion by insulting  people who have a different view.  I was an RAF pilot and find "traitorous" extremely offensive.  What is worse, 3 other members thought your unpleasant post worthy of thanks.  


 

 


@nozzer wrote:

@wotsup 

 

And let me put you straight on this.... I personally am NOT, repeat NOT, a traitor, and never accuse me, or anyone else who voted to remain,  of being one. 


@ffox  @nozzer 

Well I hope neither of you buy Dutch tomatoes in that case, because according to our resident deluded remoaner @RobC  those that do are traitors.  Roll eyes

 

 


@nozzer wrote:


I reckon that using the word "traitorous" in the way that he did is sufficient reason for banning the poster and those who agree with him. 


@nozzer 

Sauce for the goose?  Roll eyes

Luzern
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@nozzer wrote:


 

If a majority voted to shoot themselves I for one would not join them. 


Ze order isst ze order and musst obeyed be. If you refusal make, ze Brexleiter someone to hold your finger on trigger to pull appoint will.

Plusnet BrexSSR RepresentativeRoll eyesFunny

No one has to agree with my opinion, but in the time I have left a miracle would be nice.
Luzern
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@billnotben wrote:

Along with more than a few celebs.

And I expect Prince Charles is biting his tongue.


@billnotben I can't see why what Charles is doing has any relevance to Brexit, biting his tongue, playing marblles, pocket billiards, or reading the Fall of Ancient Rome.Roll eyes

No one has to agree with my opinion, but in the time I have left a miracle would be nice.
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

@RobPN 

"Well I hope neither of you buy Dutch tomatoes in that case, because according to our resident deluded remoaner"

I grow my own thanks. And cucumber, and chillis, spuds, broad beans and runner beans. But thanks for your concern.


The more a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it -- George Orwell.

Beware "alternative facts".

"Nineteen Eighty-Four" is set in Landing Strip, which is understood to be Great Britain in the future, a division of Oceania, a superstate that is continually at war with other superstates. Currently being organised by an American administration near you.
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@Luzern wrote:
 I can't see why what Charles is doing has any relevance to Brexit

None whatsoever of course. Just that he has a bit of a rep for voicing his political opinions which I'm sure you already knew.

But probably more relevant than discussing a vote to shoot yourselves. Whatever that was about.

RobPN
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson


@nozzer wrote:

@RobPN 

"Well I hope neither of you buy Dutch tomatoes in that case, ...

I grow my own thanks. ...


@nozzer 

Presumably you go without fresh tomatoes outside of UK growing season then?

Unless of course you have a sophisticated growing system?  Roll eyes

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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

If we're talking about terrible veg/fruit imports, Spanish strawberries has to be near the top.

I only ever bought them once (they still look the same) and if I closed my eyes while trying to eat one I'd swear I was eating a crunchy apple.

RobPN
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Re: New Prime Minister - Boris Johnson

Apparently Scotland is the best place to grow strawberries in the UK due to longer daylight hours during summer.  (I read that a year or three ago but won't be bothering to find a source for those who may jump in demanding such).