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Netflix paying for connection

Community Veteran
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Registered: 21-03-2011

Netflix paying for connection

In the BBC website and The Register there's an article about Netflix having to pay ISPs for preferential bandwidth - to give a fast/smooth delivery of video service.
I can see both sides of the argument, but tend to support the view that consumers have a;ready paid for the bandwidth and the ISPs should provide capacity necessary to meet their advertised service.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
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Community Veteran
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

Sounds like the old days when I used a couple of free dial up services where call costs etc was paid for by ads.
Things like that just shouldn't happen today with a paid service. There should be no unreasonable artificial obstacles put in the users way.
It's more like smooth the way and grease the palms. Some businesses leave no stone unturned in the search for money that they don't earn or deserve.
Community Veteran
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

Since this is the USA I can understand it
As far as I can remember the big ISP's were throttling the Netflix data basically due to lack of capacity and the costs associated with it hence the big attempt to force the so called net neutrality which lost on appeal
One suspects that had the ruling not being disallowed on appeal the net effect would have been that all the customers would have had their costs increased to pay for those using Netflix
http://bgr.com/2013/11/11/netflix-youtube-bandwidth-consumption/ ; shows that Netflix used 31.62% of download bandwidth in the USA which somebody has to pay for
This discusses it http://bgr.com/2014/02/19/why-is-netflix-streaming-slow/
nanotm
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

the problem is that Netflix wasn't being charged for there connection by the pipeline companies in the USA but rather a cheaper offshore hosting site, there not the only ones either but they were named as the primary target, time warner hosts several of there content servers offshore for the same reason and there a mainland ISP, this is a bad thing for everyone though, as it allows pipeline providers to refuse to upgrade there old slow infrastructure and just charge twice for any content (provider and consumer) it also means that costs will rise for all providers forcing many out of business, which is undoubtedly the long term corporate goal for various services
amazon for instance owns and operates a huge amount of hosting services but they don't own an ISP so there going to need to pay for content delivery from there networks, that's going to push up hosting costs and suddenly things like xboxlive or playstation network will go from a reasonable £10 per game annual charge to a few hundred pounds completely shutting down platform gaming, similarly pc users will be hammered as well
I don't know which company paid off the judiciary on this one but clearly whoever made the decision was bought and did what the pipeline providers wanted rather than what was right for everyone, now the only hope is this gets limited to NA only and doesn't roll out across the globe or there will be no more steam /origin etc and sod all else to do but watch on air tv unless your rich and can afford the exorbitant fees that will come in because of this ......
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Community Veteran
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Registered: 21-03-2011

Re: Netflix paying for connection

All that is wrong is the end user charging. ISPs are currently selling capacity as though it is free. Video streaming would not present a problem if charges were correctly passed through in terms of bandwidth consumed. In effect the low usage customers are funding the people who consume a lot of bandwidth. Perhaps it would be better if the ISPs charged per GB. This is a different argument from the speed of delivery where there is a need for common funding of capability of the infra structure.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
TORPC
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

Do you honestly think ISP's will supply the extra free bandwith needed, to a company that makes just as much, if not more than them ?Huh
I seriously do not see the fuss
End user =========> End user ISP =========> Netflix ========> Netflix ISP ========> End user ISP ========> End user watching Netflix
We have to pay our ISP therefore Netflix has to pay theirs & if in the course of it extra bandwidth is needed them they should of course pay for it
Think of it like having to pay your ISP extra for a faster FTTC or FTTP connection as you aint going to get it for free
Community Veteran
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

It doesn't quite work like that though.
ISPs have to continually expand and invest in their networks to cope with our (end user) bandwidth demands and requirements. Over the last few years, there has been a huge growth in streaming services - but this is not just Netflix, it also includes other things like YouTube, Hulu, Amazon Instant, MLB.TV, NFL GamePass, Sony TV etc. Some large ISPs like Comcast have not invested in expanding their networks, which has led to congested routes. They have argued that large content providers (like Netflix) should have to contribute to expanding the ISP networks.
It's like Plusnet would stop buying extra bandwidth capacity from BT Wholesale until the BBC contributed towards Plusnet's bandwidth costs.

nanotm
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

Quote from: TORPC
We have to pay our ISP therefore Netflix has to pay theirs & if in the course of it extra bandwidth is needed them they should of course pay for it

nope the ruling means Netflix has to pay there ISP and our ISP and every other ISP the data travels through if they want it to be delivered in a watchable condition
Netflix already pays there own isp......
@AA
the sole problem is the data network hasn't been upgraded to provide the capacity to provide the bandwidth being sold so there isn't enough capacity within it to provide a stable service, take Florida as an example,
there you have 19 ISP's vying to offer a service the majority of customers opt for some form of T1 line with unlimited data supply (that's adsl2 speeds) what they receive is a 24meg connection with 2 meg capacity that will often drop at peak below 1meg, the amount of data there all using is irrelevant when the pipeline cant even provide a full service the majority during off peak times never mind at peak times (yes the figures are purely for demonstrative purposes, and a few years out of date),
this ruling now means that providers of the network infrastructure will no longer be pushed to upgrade their equipment in order to have swathes of satisfied customers but instead can keep the junk keep plugging more areas in and (just for kicks) keep the same dismally poor service, so instead of everyone being able to check emails or do some shopping online, now the few who stream movies or music will be getting a perfect service whilst the many who try to use the internet for other things will be left without any bandwidth, as the movie company has paid for a guaranteed amount of space on the network so its hogging all the traffic space, even worse it will be hogging all the traffic space even when nobody is streaming anything because its been reserved for there data ....
hopefully this ruling will get overturned within the next few years
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Netflix paying for connection

Quote from: AndyH
Some large ISPs like Comcast have not invested in expanding their networks, which has led to congested routes. They have argued that large content providers (like Netflix) should have to contribute to expanding the ISP networks.

Comcast are not alone in this, while the Retail ISP's charge for GB/Month and the Wholesale price is based on Mb/s being available, this creates a mismatch in the cost structures of the ecosystem.
So should ISP's now charge based on the actual speed a person is connected at? Or also, should the technology and usage patterns change? For example, Netflix could start to offer a lower rental cost if you download the movie or box set overnight for watching when you want, thus relieving the strain on the network at peak times. Ah Yes, Youview was supposed to offer that feature but it has never happened.
--
3Mb FTTC
https://portal.plus.net/my.html?action=data_transfer_speed