cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Community Veteran
Posts: 38,244
Thanks: 933
Fixes: 54
Registered: 15-06-2007

I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/theroyalfamily/9351571/The-Queen-tells-the-Duchess-of-Cambrid...
Quote
The Duchess of Cambridge may be the future queen, but she has discovered that there are several women in the Royal family to whom she must show reverence. Mandrake hears that the Queen has updated the Order of Precedence in the Royal Household to take into account the Duke of Cambridge’s wife.
The new rules of Court make it clear that the former Kate Middleton, when she is not accompanied by Prince William, must curtsy to the “blood princesses”, the Princess Royal, Princess Alexandra, and the daughters of the Duke of York, Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie.
When William is with her, Kate does not need to bend the knee to either of them, but she must curtsy to the Prince of Wales, the Duchess of Cornwall, the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh.
Despite being married to the Queen’s son, the Countess of Wessex will, however, have to curtsy to Kate, even when William is not present.
“Updating the Order of Precedence has been a simple matter of following the precedent set when the Prince of Wales married Camilla Parker Bowles,” a courtier tells me.
A document is said to have been circulated privately in the Royal Household, clarifying Kate’s status. When the Order was last updated, after Prince Charles’s second marriage, in 2005, the Countess of Wessex was reported to be upset that she now had to curtsy to Camilla. “She didn’t like it one bit,” a senior courtier was quoted as saying.
The Earl of Wessex’s wife had previously been the second-highest ranking woman in the Royal family because neither of the Queen’s other sons, Charles and Prince Andrew, were married.
However, after Charles remarried, the Queen changed the Order of Precedence “on blood principles” so that neither Princess Anne nor Princess Alexandra, the granddaughter of George V, would have to curtsy to Camilla when her husband was not present.
Although the etiquette may seem arcane, it is taken very seriously by the Royal family, whose members bow and curtsy to each other in public and in private. A vivid illustration came after the Trooping the Colour ceremony last weekend, when Kate could be seen curtsying to Prince Philip on the balcony of Buckingham Palace.
The Order of Precedence affects other aspects of royal protocol, such as who arrives first at an event. For example, Camilla was forced to wait in the drizzle outside the Guards Chapel, Windsor, for the arrival of Princess Anne at a memorial service in 2006, because Charles had not accompanied her. A Buckingham Palace spokesman declines to comment.

20 REPLIES
Community Veteran
Posts: 7,149
Thanks: 51
Fixes: 2
Registered: 30-08-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

I think this was in the Mail yesterday...
But it does make you wonder which of their many worlds they live in. Like you I'm not anti-royalists and quite living in a monarchy, but some of these archaic practices should be reviewed very quickly. Bowing and curtseying should be scrapped forthwith, a nod of the head in acknowledgement should be quite sufficient.
Take a cue from the last few lines of film The King and I.
Experience; is something you gain, just after you needed it most.

When faced with two choices, simply toss a coin. It works not because it settles the question for you. But because in that brief moment while the coin is in the air. You suddenly know what you are hoping for.
Community Veteran
Posts: 7,149
Thanks: 51
Fixes: 2
Registered: 30-08-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Er! Jim, we seem to have duplicated threads.
Experience; is something you gain, just after you needed it most.

When faced with two choices, simply toss a coin. It works not because it settles the question for you. But because in that brief moment while the coin is in the air. You suddenly know what you are hoping for.
Community Veteran
Posts: 38,244
Thanks: 933
Fixes: 54
Registered: 15-06-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Fixed - it was caused by the Forum grinding to a halt while posting and needing to do a refresh to fix it  Sad
Community Veteran
Posts: 18,544
Thanks: 190
Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Like you guys I am a Royalist but had to laugh when I read this in the Mail yesterday.  Kate has done so much to give the monarchy a fresh modern approach in the short time she has been married to William and all credit to her.  To think that she is expected to curtsy to the freeloading Beatrice and Eugenie is a laugh. 
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,373
Thanks: 630
Fixes: 8
Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

If the blood line takes precedence, surely the Duke of Edinburgh should bow to Beatrice and Eugenie.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Community Veteran
Posts: 7,910
Thanks: 591
Fixes: 8
Registered: 02-08-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

No one should be required to bow to anyone and this needs to be stopped along with the many awards made to individuals, the only people who should get any sort of awards are those in the military risking their lives or some genuine person who has done some good for the community rather than for their own financial gain.
Community Veteran
Posts: 13,920
Thanks: 514
Fixes: 7
Registered: 01-08-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Bonkers... absolutely bonkers.
I'm surprised they don't still wear hats with feathers in them..
I need a new signature... i'm bored of the old one!
alanf
Aspiring Pro
Posts: 1,931
Thanks: 77
Fixes: 1
Registered: 17-10-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

I'm confused. The blood royals rank higher so Anne outranks Camilla. Yet Camilla waits in the rain for the arrival of Anne. Doesn't that mean Camilla outranks Anne as the higher ranks arrive later? If the higher rank arrived first the Queen would have to arrive early and wait for all the minor royals to turn up at an event.
James
Grafter
Posts: 21,036
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Quote from: Sprite
I'm surprised they don't still wear hats with feathers in them..

They do at Ascot Tongue
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,307
Thanks: 86
Fixes: 3
Registered: 08-01-2008

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

And at 'family weddings'
Call me 'w23'
At any given moment in the universe many things happen. Coincidence is a matter of how close these events are in space, time and relationship.
Opinions expressed in forum posts are those of the poster, others may have different views.
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,316
Thanks: 465
Fixes: 1
Registered: 21-03-2011

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

I wonder what the rules for Sarah Ferguson might be?  Fall prostrate before Granny Windsor?
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
198kHz
Seasoned Pro
Posts: 3,217
Thanks: 253
Fixes: 7
Registered: 30-07-2008

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

Quote from: Petlew
But it does make you wonder which of their many worlds they live in. Like you I'm not anti-royalists and quite living in a monarchy, but some of these archaic practices should be reviewed very quickly. Bowing and curtseying should be scrapped forthwith, a nod of the head in acknowledgement should be quite sufficient.

Amen to that.
And once that's sorted, time to start on the archaic, arcane practices of the House of Commons/Lords.
Not young enough to know everything
David_W
Rising Star
Posts: 2,293
Thanks: 29
Registered: 19-07-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

It'll all change when Kate has a baby.  An earlier question was about Philip and why bow to him.  By bloodline he is the father of the future king so he should rank 2nd or 3rd (below the future king or above I don't know) so when Kate has a baby, by bloodline she'll outrank pretty much everyone except Queen/Philip/Charles/William/Baby which means that everyone (except them) will then have to bow to Kate, she'll be part of the royal bloodline forever the way that Philip is bloodline related to William.  Though it'd be pretty funny if Camilla got pregnant and had a baby, wonder where the rankings would go then!
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 16,527
Thanks: 1,780
Fixes: 124
Registered: 06-04-2007

Re: I am not anti monarchist but this really makes me wonder

I don't think they should do away with the Order of Precedence or the courtsying/bowing that comes with it. For me it's all part and parcel of our royal heritage and is a formal way of showing respect, especially where lineage is concerned.
Respect is something increasingly lacking in our society and I think it would be it's nail in the coffin if the royals are no longer seen to show it. Just my take.

Forum Moderator and Customer
Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain
He who feared he would not succeed sat still