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Hackers

Community Veteran
Posts: 7,910
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Registered: 02-08-2007

Hackers

I guess there can be little sympathy for anyone who is a hacker but the case of Gary McKinnon who they are sending to the US should give us all cause for concern. If British citizens can be taken to America and put on trial in their courts ( We can't extradite Americans to the UK) It can only be a matter of time before some innocent person gets whisked off to America.
He is not the first person to go, I recall three bankers being sent to the USA not long ago, ok, I guess there is no sympathy for bankers either but it's the principle of the thing, in that we are potentiality all at risk.
24 REPLIES
geewizz
Grafter
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Registered: 01-08-2007

Re: Hackers

I see no diffrence between an innocent person being tried here and an innocent person being tried in another country.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: Hackers

I think the bankers were sentenced in the US and got less severe sentences for pleading guilty.
The agreement that allows extradition is supposed to be reciprocal. The US protect their citizens better than we do ours. 
techguy
Grafter
Posts: 2,540
Registered: 12-09-2008

Re: Hackers

And just remember the trigger happy cowboys of the USAF that fired on and killed British troops.
When the MOD asked for the personnel to come and assist with an inquiry Uncle Sam gave us the two fingered salute.
But still the UK government dances to the Americans' tune but of course they are now threatening us too.
Time we told them to get stuffed I think.
Sadly the attitude of their government reflects badly on the people.

Moderator
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Re: Hackers

Quote from: artmo
I think the bankers were sentenced in the US and got less severe sentences for pleading guilty.

But the odd thing about the bankers was that it happened here, between two British companies and they flagged it up themselves.
The alleged hacker allegedly attacked US systems so you can at least some kind of extradition.
Shame we are using terrorist laws to do it.
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techguy
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Registered: 12-09-2008

Re: Hackers

I think McKinnon should be tried and sentenced here as you can bet they wouldn't extradite if it was a US citizen that attacked UK systems.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 30-08-2007

Re: Hackers

@techguy, they wouldn't need to hack our systems, just travel around on trains and collect up all the lost laptops, files and disks.
Experience; is something you gain, just after you needed it most.

When faced with two choices, simply toss a coin. It works not because it settles the question for you. But because in that brief moment while the coin is in the air. You suddenly know what you are hoping for.
itsme
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Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Hackers

Why should the British Tax payer foot the bill for a crime committed in the USA?
techguy
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Registered: 12-09-2008

Re: Hackers

@Petlew yes, very true
You don't hear of lost disks etc in the US do you but then again, I'm sure anyone who was about to reveal such a thing would disappear under mysterious circumstances wouldn't they?
@itsme, he allegedly hack the systems while in the UK so the crime occurred on British soil, and besides I think he will get more chance of a fair trial here and he is a British citizen after all, and as gleneagles said, if the situation was reversed we'd not have a chance of getting an American to stand trial here.
As I mentioned above, they wouldn't even agree for personnel to come over and assist with a 'friendly fire' enquiry where people died, which is far worse than hacking in my book.
itsme
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Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Hackers

By that rule the extradition of the bankers was correct as that crime was carried out in the USA
itsme
Grafter
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Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Hackers

Also I believe he has admitted hacking into the systems looking for UFO's. Should have stuck looking up into the sky.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 30-07-2007

Re: Hackers

I really believe there's a principle here.  We have ratified a treaty that allows suspected criminals in the UK to be extradited to the US for trial.  There was an expectation that the US would ratify the treaty as well, but they didn't.  So now we have a situation where the treaty only works one way!  Surely if one side fails, then both should fail.  If we can't  insist that US citizens are tried in the UK for crimes affecting us, then the US shouldn't be able to force us to send our citizens over there.
Whether he's guilty or innocent is irrelevant.  Either he's tried in the UK under UK law, or the US waits for him to go on holiday to the US and picks him up then.  Good luck top them  Angry
John
techguy
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Registered: 12-09-2008

Re: Hackers

Until the US starts playing by the rules it expects everyone else to, we should not extradite anyone nor cooperate in any way.
The trouble with the US government is they are rather arrogant and the UK government do not have the bottle to stand up to them.
Moderator
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Registered: 11-01-2008

Re: Hackers

we do have extradition treaty's it's the burden of proof that is out of balance between the countries I believe.
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techguy
Grafter
Posts: 2,540
Registered: 12-09-2008

Re: Hackers

The other thing that worries me is that so much of our defence relies on American coporations.
The UK government even sold off our stake in the Atomic Weapons Establishment recently.