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Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

Community Veteran
Posts: 18,543
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Registered: 12-08-2007

Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

The NHS is to train graduates to carry out some functions currently carried out by doctors. They will have a limited role but be able to take some of the strain presently taken by doctors.
Physician Associates
Physician Associates1
17 REPLIES
TORPC
Grafter
Posts: 5,163
Registered: 08-12-2013

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

I would not want an UNLicensed doctor to treat me yet alone my kids
& what new taxes will the bring in to fund such a project ?Huh
Community Veteran
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Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

You are treated now by staff that are not fully trained doctors. So long as they are trained in the procedures they undertake what is the problem?
Over the past decade or so many procedures that used to be undertaken by doctors are now carried out by specially trained nurses. This is simply a development of that.
Remember whoever carries out treatment you will have a consultant who is responsible for your care.
TORPC
Grafter
Posts: 5,163
Registered: 08-12-2013

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

There is no wonder, why there are so many incidences where people are not being treated properly or fairly in the worst case scenarios. resulting in death
Then others are suffering at the hands of so - called professionals that hide behind a complicated set of barriers to break down, by the legal system
Take my case, as the Trained GP's that haven't a clue what is wrong with me, then swapped me from medication that was working to other medication that did not do squat
Then there are others on the boards that have literally suffered & still suffering due to putting their lives in these so - called professionals hands
Therefore
What hope have we really got by putting our hands in these (NON Professionals) ?Huh
nanotm
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Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

my real concern about this though is a doctor is trained on everything before he specialises so is well placed to fix any problems that crop up unexpectedly but a physician wont be and similarly wont be able to do so, the starting salary of these people will be 40 k in 5-10 years they will also be on 60k the same as the junior doctors, but your paying to employ someone who isn't qualified or capable of performing the same task the same money as the ones who are, the doctors stating point will thus increase or the NHS will collapse as everyone leaves over pay.....
its shortsighted thinking like this that has caused the problem's were currently in with idiots like Gordon brown who got tunnel vision and screwed the pooch in the years since labour first won power, to here that the coalition is making the same unmitigated mistakes in an attempt to releve the pressure on doctors in the public sector instead of doing the better option of pinching them all back from the private sector with better pay packages (because they are actually needed) and getting rid of companies like ATOS/Centrica from government contracts so the money is available for the NHS without needing to increase debt....

PFI's were never a good idea they always save for between 1>5 years and then start costing significantly more than they did in the first place for a lesser service .......yet even after the disaster that was proven to be happening with HMP's they expanded the system to include most areas of public sector and created laws that prevented various works from being done by public sector workers as they transferred them all into the private sector (and then hired them back via some overly complex system that meant they no longer paid the wages so saved money in the first 3 years .......)
I read somewhere that the E.A. is the largest government department in the world and yet they don't undertake any works in house its all  external contractors ........who knew they could get away with employing so many paper shuffling idiots and not actually be capable of perforiming the job(s) for which the department is responsible ....
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Community Veteran
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Registered: 21-03-2011

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

Having had my business destroyed by a poor diagnostic decision from a trainee GP (they are called Registrars) I'm not exactly in favour of Associate Doctors being bought in to reduce costs, i.e. to preserve the income of overpaid private GP Partners.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
nadger
Rising Star
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Registered: 13-04-2007

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

Personally I see nothing against Physician Associates for limited procedures they'll be allowed to perform.
From what I saw on TV they'll have to already have a science or medical degree before 2 years training.
alanf
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Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

It was not that long ago medical schools were turning out more fully qualified, but inexperienced, doctors for which there were no jobs. It was said that after being trained at vast expense many would have to leave the country to find work.
I thought that it was more recent than 2005 by here's a Daily Telegraph article from then.
BMA claims 3,000 new junior doctors are out of work
TORPC
Grafter
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Registered: 08-12-2013

Re: Graduatesto Take Strain from Doctors

@Alanf
There is no linky Wink
Community Veteran
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Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

This is all a matter of training someone to do a job and seeing they do it and do not do anything outside their expertise.
Many patients would not know they are being treated by an associate unless they are told.
As I've said before the end responsibility rests with your consultant who has to satisfy himself as to the competency of those working for him/her.
nanotm
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Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

except your forgetting the golden rule " if you don't train for the contingencies your training to fail"
a physician has one narrow training set and is not competent to perform anything outside of that very narrow skill set, so when they are performing a cyst removal and nick an artery they cant deal with the problem and have to call in someone who is able to deal with it, the result is that instead of someone competent to perform surgery your dicing with death and unnecessary delays, if you show up with a muscle complaint and are diagnosed with a sprain or strain instead of seeing a consultant who would through training and experience know that was a symptom of an underlying complaint ......
adopting an American system that we got rid of at the turn of the last centaury is a giant leap backwards in healthcare not a good idea and one the Americans have been struggling to overcome against a been counter offensive exerting pressure to remain the same ........
our healthcare system has been second to none for decades because we only employed fully trained people at each juncture and now we are lowering our standards to that of foreign services on the grounds of price as everything moves ever closer to privatisation and unaffordability for the masses .........
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Community Veteran
Posts: 18,543
Thanks: 190
Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

You forget that all new patients are seen by a consultant who will then decide on treatment and this could be getting a physician associate to perform a procedure.
As for your example of a cyst removal these are often performed these days by a specialist nurse - someone who has a limited range of experience.
nanotm
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Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

so then the plan is to make you wait 4 x longer to get seen in the first place by someone who is in such a rush they wont do the job properly before passing you off to some under trained lacky to do the work required the same day .......
I realise the country is over populated but lets not return hospitals to the death centres of the mid Victorian era in an effort to drive down the overall numbers eh
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Community Veteran
Posts: 18,543
Thanks: 190
Registered: 12-08-2007

Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

Your description of hospital treatment is not one I recognise - fortunately Smiley
TORPC
Grafter
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Registered: 08-12-2013

Re: Graduates to Take Strain from Doctors

Quote from: alanf
<snip>
It was said that after being trained at vast expense many would have to leave the country to find work.
<snip>

Exactly
& why
Our trained medical staff has to seek work in alternate countries, because people from other countries are coming over & taking their jobs
There needs to be an even balance & that just haven't happened or is likely to ever happen tbh Smiley