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Genetic Engineering

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Re: Genetic Engineering

But nature has been making unintended errors since the beginning of mankind, we now have the chance to change those errors
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

Which raises the question,
Can you prove that they were mistakes?
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

Some peoples mistakes are other peoples evolution.
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

and some are throwbacks to a previous iteration of the human condition  Cheesy
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

Quote from: nanotm
Which raises the question,
Can you prove that they were mistakes?

Well you have to make a judgement call on what you would describe as a normal physical human being, note the word physical not mental.
Sadly a number of people suffer from conditions which are no fault of their own and in most cases would want  to be near this norm as possible.
So sure you could argue that  nature intended someone to have a particular disease or physical problem but I doubt such a person would agree with you that it was not a mistake of nature ?
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

well use this hypothetical example
crack addict has deformed baby, leading geneticist figures out which switches to flick in there dna code and does so, a couple of days later and the baby is "normal" where is the incentive to get rid of the self indulgence ?
we know from medical science that waiting till your past your prime carries greater risk of abnormalities in the child's genetics but because we now have some clever computer programs its possible to let something pop out a mutant freak into a tank of goo, again have some switches flicked and presto its "normal" where is the incentive to think of your families needs rather than being selfish about what "you want ?
climate change phase change occurs and geneticists have been so hell bent on keeping every baby "normal" the human race has lost its ability to evolve to meet the conditions ....
one persons abnormality is another persons beauty, and without beauty there is no procreation no procreation = end of the race ...
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

So why should the baby suffer because of it's parents, everyone should get a good health start in life but not all do.
Nature does a very good job of altering a species so it can exist in it's environment but other elements of nature can work against that hence the reason that many species have become extinct.
It's no secret that millions of births are not planned  and in a number of those cases the child suffers so the point (I Think) you are making about people being selfish applies now.
We have to be able to say what constitutes a normal physical human being so we can identify what is normal otherwise a Doctor would not know what to treat.
It's important to stress we are talking about a normal physical human being and not behaviour as some things that were once classed as a illness are no longer regarded as so.
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

ok so you fix the crack addicts baby and its healthy and mummy takes it home, she neglects and abuses the child over the next few years before selling it as child prostitute to fund her crack habit, or you can save all the heartache abuse and anguish and just let nature take its course (baby dies) selfish crack addict goes on her merry way until she expires
if you "fix" and then put a child into care as a baby it has a 1 in 3 chance of being the victim of serious and psychological abuse during the formative years as an adult as a result of that upbringing you have another crack addict..... continuing the cycle

it might sound harsh but we all come with an expiry date, for some that unfortunately is a lot earlier than others, I will not likely live to be the same age as some that post on here are now, its just a fact of life, if you cant die you cant truly be alive, the constant drive to fix everything will end with a logans run style lottery to determine who's time is up as ever newer ways are found to keep everyone alive .... a situation will occur within the next 150 years without a huge population reduction where there is enough food produced to feed only half the population (if the predictions are correct), at that point billions will starve to death and all because well meaning people who value every life and want to fix everything cannot see the big picture.
now don't get me wrong, I don't wish any situation on anyone but I don't see the point in saving everyone indefinitely just so they can starve to death especially when if left alone they can be allowed ot pass with dignity and not forced ot live through horrors any rational person wouldn't wish on their worst enemy, I wouldn't want some sort of picking system that choses who's turn to become food /fuel it is for the good of all....
as a side note I would ask those with a vested interst to step back and look at the bigger picture before venting, as a parent who had a child die from an infectious disease that a cure has been created for I am fully aware of the pain and suffering those left go through, but even so I look not to my personal gains or how my child could have been saved but at the wider world, and I consider that if every person who had died of a curable illness in the last 10 years had been given the magic cureall and was still alive then in 18 months we would be killing each other for scraps of food and descend into chaos as the population size surpassed the ability of the growers to produce food/
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

But genetic modification of food will lead to an increase in the food available.
As for population growth that will peak at some stage, in a previous post some time ago I gave a link to a program on tv recently that clearly demonstrated that poverty was linked to large famalies, as you lift people out of poverty, ie make sure they have basic things such as food and water, shelter, electricity the number of children they have will decrease, whilst there are exceptions the average number of children most famalies have in this country is 2.2
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

that average went up fast, last time I saw it on the ONS website it was about 0.8.....
you realise that more than 50% of the problems people sufer with things like obesity etc are caused entirely by GM crops and their cheap production and inclusion in our everyday food stuffs ?
you promote the use of GM to fix what ails the human race and I would point you to the likes of the film idiocrasy (which pretty acuratly describes what would happen if we leave the madmen in charge abusing barely understood concepts to "fix" things that are not broken)
I was utterly horrified when I saw that news article about the girl getting fixed with genetic mutation, what happens when she hits puberty and that mutation mutates does she become the new plague that kill all mankind spread through touch ?
that's not fear speaking either its known science that everything that gets mutated can mutate again and will do whenever something triggers it ...
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

There were no major increases in the world's population until around 1840 then it started to climb as we made various discoveries over the years such as the improvement in Hygiene and increases in our knowledge of disease, following your argument perhaps we should have left things alone and let nature take it's course so the population would be similar to what it was then and most likely the majority of us would not be here now having died from pneumonia, TB or similar ailment.
You are either for progress or against it and I know which camp I am in.
Wink
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Re: Genetic Engineering

It depends what you call progress.
Now Zen, but a +Net residue.
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Re: Genetic Engineering

I mean the same as the dictionary defines progress......improvement. Development. movement forward. Happening gradually.
If we listened to the Luddites we would all still be working in the mills !
Many people are resistant to change as they fear the unknown and their current situation is comfortable.
If you fail to make progress, rest assured someone else will be doing it and that could well change your comfortable position.
nanotm
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Re: Genetic Engineering

when the mills were operating there was a lot more employment in industrial processes, when the factories act was introduced that made them safer places to work and banned children from being used, when the closed thousands were made unemployed with no opportunity available for other employment.
there is progress for good and there Is unqualified or bad progress, when plant machinery was introduced to farming crops could be harvested in hours rather than weeks and that machinery made sense to use for weat or corn havesting but as soon as it got introduced for spud or fruit collecting thousnads were made unemployed and had no other optortunity for employment,
when car building became automated the end product didn't become any safer but thousands lost their jobs.
thos are unqualified examples of progress for the sake of progress, it was unessary and caused more harm than good, both to the companies that made the improvements and to wider society. when dolly the sheep was cloned the dangers of what it meant were immediately obvious to world at large and such research became illegal just as genetics was banned in the wake of revelations about the Nazis and their experiments.
this apparent progress in the medical field will lead to more harm than good because it cant be controlled so rregardless of the noble intentions it will be seen in decades to come as a bad thing, already some people are proclaiming genetics as the new thalidomide
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Genetic Engineering

Thousands have lost their jobs as new systems create less manpower but business is run on profit, any business not making a profit soon goes bust.
Balanced against that new jobs are created in areas such as technology and I suspect most people in work would rather a job in say IT than work down a mine or in a mill.
As to the future no one can say with any certainty what will happen but most who try to predict the future are usually wrong, according to my parents by the time I got to the age I am now there would be no coal left and we would all freeze to death, it was also said we would only be working one or two days a week (which for some has come true) but the idea was the rest of our time would be spent on lesure activities as our pay would be so good (which is not true for most)