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Electric cars cause pollution

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Electric cars cause pollution

I see the latest city tax scheme is being planned. According to the BBC  five English cities will have Clean Air Zones by 2020 and electric cars will get preference in traffic schemes.  When will they learn that Electric Cars merely shift the point of pollution production to the power stations. Energy losses in transmission over the National Grid, inefficiency in battery charging all add to the pollution load.

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VileReynard
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

Those power stations may be wind-powered etc.

rongtw
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

Renewable energy  power stations are at the moment have a minimal input to the national grid , and are likely to stay that way for several years to come .

the most power comes from Gas / oil / biomass or wood pellets made from felled trees .

Green is a good idea but impractical 

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution


AlaricAdair wrote:

I see the latest city tax scheme is being planned. According to the BBC  five English cities will have Clean Air Zones by 2020 and electric cars will get preference in traffic schemes.  When will they learn that Electric Cars merely shift the point of pollution production to the power stations. Energy losses in transmission over the National Grid, inefficiency in battery charging all add to the pollution load.


By far the biggest source of pollution from electric cars is the stuff that is emitted in mining, transporting and refining lithium for the batteries. If you take the whole of the pollutants given out in manufacturing the car in total, those coming from lithium battery production mean that a typical electric car doing an average mileage will take around 13 years to start to save on total emissions.

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution


rongtw wrote:

Green is a good idea but impractical 


It only works and is only ever going to work in countries like Sweden or Norway where they have plenty of hydro and thermal power.

It's about time our government realised that and made a choice between available options that can provide the necessary power. Preferably without involving the Chinese.

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution


nozzer wrote:

By far the biggest source of pollution from electric cars is the stuff that is emitted in mining, transporting and refining lithium for the batteries. If you take the whole of the pollutants given out in manufacturing the car in total, those coming from lithium battery production mean that a typical electric car doing an average mileage will take around 13 years to start to save on total emissions.

and the battery in the car will have long needed replaced after 13 years, most likely needing replaced at least twice in that time.

VileReynard
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

I had to replace the battery in my petrol car. Funny

Minivanman
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

It all depends where on how we get the energy to drive these things and even if as you so they 'shift pollution' then surely it's a move in the right direction. Why anybody other than corporate multinationals and those with a vested interest would oppose and argue against the drive towards clean renewable energy and pollution free transport is totally beyond me, it really is.

 

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

i think the argument is that the current method of pollution free transport is not actually pollution free.
electric cars are not the answer IMO.
the electricity has to come from somewhere, and in the UK that's mostly going to be non-renewable sources.
the creation of the batteries is a very dirty process and can't be classed as pollution free.

now, hydrogen powered cars may be the answer, but that simply isn't economical at the moment.
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

Current technology and current generation capacity mean that electric cars are, at the moment, not viable as a mass replacement for internal combustion, until a technology that can create mass amounts of cheap energy and a storage medium that doesn't require mining big holes in the planet to create it, then it may start to be a viable alternative, but, right now, electric cars are still just a pipedream as they are not sustainable...

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

But that somewhere could be anywhere on the planet - the UK is wired up to mainland europe for electrical supply sharing.. so whats to stop solar panels in africa being used to recharge cars in the UK? Granted it would be a hell of a journey for those electrons down all that resistive wiring... but if those panels power the country next door and that one reduces it's reliance on nuclear a bit - while sending the rest further into europe ... and so on... then potentially it could have an effect.

But like most of you, I do take the skeptical view that the pollution is coming from the manufacturing of the batteries, plastics, metals etc... and it does seem that the whole thing is a bit of a farse at times. But with that said, we can't continue running petrol and diesel forever - something must change.

I personally don't really understand what the problem would be in having more renewal energy sources. Yes we do have a small number of them now.. but here in the UK we have a bit of an advantage... we're surrounded by all sorts of weather that can be used - wind, rain, sunshine....  the only thing we can't really use is the snow.

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

@twocvbloke your spot on the figures I have seen is that we need a grid three times the capacity for a mass market take up of battery cars. Also the supergrid goes from Yorkshire to the south east (for the coal powered stations we have taken out of service) and doesn't go anywhere near Scotland and the Southwest where most of the renewable wind and wave energy is. There's a lot of enabling work required to allow the serious take up of battery cars! Crazy2

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VileReynard
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

I blame Thatcher for closing the pits.

And destroying British industry.

And many other things.

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Re: Electric cars cause pollution


7up wrote:

so whats to stop solar panels in africa being used to recharge cars in the UK?

The politics, both the past effects we've had on colonising africa, along with their current not-very-confidence-inspiring politics in their countries, and of course, the endless stream of terrorism that plagues the world, doesn't take much for some group to cut the cables for some self-righteous cause that nobody but themselves cares about...

 

Until we can achieve global unity, there's not a hope in hell that we could ever have a global power grid, so until we can stop arguing with one another, we have to, and this is a very popular phrase at the moment, "keep it local!" and have our power generated in our country, for our people, for our needs, that is to say, to keep the lights on and our country fed & flowing, anything extra (like electric cars) is just a selfish want...

rongtw
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Re: Electric cars cause pollution

The way forward is NOT electric cars , we need more investment into Hydrogen fuel cells Thumbs Up once its cracked all we need is water Cool

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