E-cigs..... a SERIOUS warning, from Australia

[#1]

OK... don`t rubbish this, just cos it`s a Daily Mail link...

The subject matter is more important than your press prejudices...

Read it.... if you VAPE....

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7492515/Flavoured-e-cigarettes-KILL-cells-line-airways-stud...

Fumes from e-cigarettes are toxic and can kill cells lining airways, a bombshell new study has found. 

Popularity for e-cigarettes has skyrocketed in recent years and are seen as a much healthier alternative to tobacco.

However, scientists at University of Adelaide and the Royal Adelaide Hospital have now found that vapour produced by e-cigarettes is harmful and have called for government regulation.

( this is a new thread, cos the other one I started got waylaid, a bit.. ! ) .

[#2]

I can think of two things that this current generation are lab rats for.

One is the long term effects of mobile phone radiation.

The other is the long term effects of vaping.

[#3]

They'll be telling us next that cigarettes are a better alternative....

[#4]

Surprise, surprise!

"Breathing in stuff that you're not supposed to is bad for you."

As I think I implied in another thread. Stop doing something that has known health consequences. Smoking.

And start doing something new with no time to have built up any statistical evidence for the health consequences. . .

[#5]

---

@shutter wrote:

OK... don`t rubbish this, just cos it`s a Daily Mail link...

The subject matter is more important than your press prejudices...

---

I read through it, and, er, it reaffirms my prejudice against the DM...

They've plucked a story out of the problems from UNREGULATED electronic cig liquids, I.E. stuff made god knows where by whoever in their bedroom, basement or garage, using flavourings that contain stuff that can be harmful, such as solvents (which are used to extract flavours or things like THCs from cannabis) that should not be in any electronic cigarette liquid at all...

Regulated liquids on the other hand, they don't contain the harmful additives, they aren't causing the problems that the gutter press has been jumping on to make it look bad, and they are not the source of any deaths or illnesses...

If inhaling vapours was bad, then smoke machines would have been banned years ago, as they do exactly the same thing, take a glycerol based liquid, rapidly heat it and vaporise it into a cloudy "smoke", any scent or flavour additives are regulated in that sector too, as of course if you used an unregulated stuff at a party and killed 50 people, you'd be in a lot of doodoo!!! The same goes for inhalers for people with asthma and COPD, as they use a glycerol base to carry the medication into the lungs...

I'm re-posting this video from Clive, where he talks about the media hype against it and the facts about what goes into electronic cigarette liquids, watch it, absorb the facts, THEN re-read the daily mail article and see what the difference between facts and article are:

[#6]

But why do it at all in the first place?

And I'd say there's a big difference between inhaling stuff that's been diluted with air many times it's volume, as in smoke machines, and deliberately breathing in the stuff directly.

[#7]

---

@Minesapint wrote:

And start doing something new with no time to have built up any statistical evidence for the health consequences. . .

---

I often wondered what my Dad was putting in his pipe, whatever, it didn’t do him any harm....

[#8]

---

@Minesapint wrote:

But why do it at all in the first place?

---

Enjoyment, entertainment, using it as an escape route from tobacco products (not everyone has the will to go cold-turkey), reducing snacking, and to annoy people who don't "get it"...

As for the difference between smoke machines and eCigs, if the DM were to be believed, then both acts are exactly the same, as they're both a vapour that gets inhaled, which apparently causes deaths and serious illness, if the DM were to be believed...

[#9]

@twocvbloke   You have pretty much rubbished the Daily Mail, for what it has published....and, by the same token, have tried to rubbish what the whole point of the thread is about,  inferring that the Australian report, is as fabricated as the Daily Mail ....

So ....have a go at the WHO.........

https://www.euronews.com/2019/07/31/vaping-not-as-safe-as-people-think-warns-who

WHO ?  =  World Health Organisation...

Also.... here is a report from The Guardian....

ttps://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/sep/15/how-safe-is-vaping-e-cigarettes-deaths-bans

Part of which I reproduce here for you to "rubbish" in your normal style

Sven-Eric Jordt, one of the authors of the 2018 flavours study, told the Observer that their work had confirmed that “the liquids vaporised by e-cigarettes are chemically unstable and form new chemicals that irritate the airways and may have other toxic effects”.

E-cigarette liquids supposedly contain far fewer chemicals – as little as a handful – than traditional cigarettes and are therefore deemed safer. But the flavours study raises as many questions as it answers – not least how many chemicals are in e-cigarettes.

[#10]

@Champnet  Maybe, maybe not. It certainly didn't actually do him any good though.

@twocvbloke All of which are the usual reasons given for smoking, vaping or anything else. None of which means you need to do it.

Do what you like, but don't say it doesn't do any harm.

As I said there's no real statistical evidence yet, but it's starting to look as if it's not good for you.

[#11]

---

@shutter wrote:

So ....have a go at the WHO.........

---

Okeydokes...

The WHO have also been taking a rather strange stance towards vaping, in the past claiming that "Burning" e-liquids is carcinogenic, yet no burning takes place within an eCig, they have claimed that it is toxic, without actually showing where they got the liquids from, and they seem to oddly have had a nice funding boost form certain multinational pharmaceutical companies that have vested interests in selling nicotine replacement methods like pills, patches and inhalers (oh, that too involves inhaling bad stuff, yet it's perfectly safe, apparently!!!)...

To date, the majority of people who have switched from tobacco to electronic cigarettes have seen their health improve, mostly pulmonary, but also circulatory and cognitive health, so there's plenty evidence to support vaping as doing good, it's just chosen to be ignored because something doing good doesn't sell newspapers...

[#12]

@twocvbloke 

Of course,..... YOU would say that..... wouldn`t you....

. but...

I don`t see you backing what you say with any PLAUSIBLE references to anything PUBLISHED either on-line, or  by the press or medical bodies, to support your postings...

[#13]

I should point out I neither vape nor smoke, but, I do have a modicum of intelligence to research things properly, rather than just believe what the papers say...

The people getting ill or being killed by vaping have been using unregulated liquids, I.E. stuff bought off dodgy dave down the market, goodness knows what is put into them, and I personally wouldn't trust them, and frankly, more fool them for doing so...

Regulated stuff which is made by people who actually care about their customers, they list their ingredients, they provide sources to what their flavourings contain, and they have the licensing to add the nicotine, should the end user choose to have nicotine in their liquids, and MILLIONS of people not dying as a result, well, that pretty much poopoos the DM and WHO's claims, where they only set out to find the worst effects that only affect less than a hundred people, out of several billion on the planet...

I see those headlines as utter trash, they can publish anything they like, heck it wouldn't surprise me if tomorrow they had a headline of "Sex causes deformations and autism in children!!!", because sex usually results in children, and due to genetic abnormalities, a few here and there could indeed end up with deformations and autism, but it doesn't mean sex should be banned though!!!

[#14]

@twocvbloke   BUT..... You still have not "qualified" anything you have posted, with plausible references as I suggested in my previous post.

[#15]

Well, the reason I'm not bothering is because trying to "qualify" against the Daily Mail is like proving to someone that the sun shines, or that poo smells, because if you believe otherwise, you're pretty much an idiot, simple as that...

The DM are only there to profit, they pick little snippets out of published statements to create sensationalist headlines to sell their rags to idiots, thw WHO are known to have taken money from organisations looking for negatives against an opponents' products in order to bolster the sales of their own, and therefore profit, after all, money talks, and it isn't always the truth...

The chemistry of vaping, the ingredients of e-liquids, the business of vaporising, seriously, you can hop onto any search engine you like and research it yourself, and if you can't be bothered and choose to believe the rags, then, you do that, but, I'll stick to my own investigations, because being autistic, I do such things, I like to find out the whys and whats and hows of things, I don't document or bookmark specifics, I just learn, because learning leads to intelligence, and intelligence leads to laughing at the daily mail's antics...

Granted, there are people who do sub-ohming which can lead to e-liquids being burned, more fool them, people buy dodgy liquids from unknown sources and get ill, more fool them, some have e-cigs blow up in their faces because they bought a cheap kit from china, more fool them, kids have ended up in hospital from drinking e-liquids, more fool them, if you're going to be dumb, expect evolution to take place and cleanse you from the genepool...