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Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

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Community Veteran
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Registered: ‎29-10-2008

Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Link.
Gabe
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Community Veteran
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

A very interesting report and the interesting part for me is that Pension Credits have a lower rate of fraud the either Job Seekers Allowance or Income Support but less than Housing Benefit
I assume the Housing Benefit is lower because it is less easy to fiddle
However the overpayment of Pension Credits because of Official or Claimant error are significantly higher
This also applies for underpayments
The inference I draw from this is that the forms/procedures for claiming Pension Credit are too complicated
See Tables 4.1 and 4.2 in here https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/271654/fraud-and-error-in-...
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Grafter
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Given this story is from the Daily Fail, it's almost certainly either a flat out lie or has been distorted beyond recognition
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Grafter
Posts: 805
Registered: ‎14-09-2013

Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: WTF
Given this story is from the Daily Fail, it's almost certainly either a flat out lie or has been distorted beyond recognition

You can't call it the Daily Fail or 7up will get mad at you Cheesy
Between you and me though, I agree Wink
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Community Veteran
Posts: 767
Registered: ‎29-10-2008

Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Bit of an envelope calc, assumptions accepted, but from sample size and confidence intervals, no sig diff in fraud between IS, JA, and PC, but HB lower.
Gabe
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: Oldjim
However the overpayment of Pension Credits because of Official or Claimant error are significantly higher

Prior to my retirement I was receiving Pension Credit.
When I retired and started receiving my State Pension the Pension Credits continued.
When I contacted the appropriate department I was told an assessment form should have been sent and a replacement will be posted to me.
It was 6 months before I finally received a form, filled it in and posted it off.
Unsurprisingly I was assessed as being ineligible for Pension Credit since retiring and happily paid back the £402.39 I wasn't entitled to.
I also received an apology for the assessment error.  

Customer and Forum Moderator. Windows 10 Firefox 76.0.1 (64-bit)

Life is tough enough without adding Linux into the mix.
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Community Veteran
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: Gabe
Bit of an envelope calc, assumptions accepted, but from sample size and confidence intervals, no sig diff in fraud between IS, JA, and PC, but HB lower.
Gabe
Looking at the quoted 95% confidence levels I would disagree with you
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Community Veteran
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: RichAllen
Quote from: WTF
Given this story is from the Daily Fail, it's almost certainly either a flat out lie or has been distorted beyond recognition

You can't call it the Daily Fail or 7up will get mad at you Cheesy

Yes indeed. Thanks to RichAllen who continued to bash them with the same boring joke which was past it's sell by date at every opportunity, I must agree that people calling it the Daily Fail has become somewhat annoying. Not just for me but many others around here.
Once or twice is funny. Every other day is just sad.
I need a new signature... i'm bored of the old one!
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Grafter
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Registered: ‎14-09-2013

Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Thing is though, the DM has been demonising the unemployed and people on any form of benefits for years, so it's no wonder people like me bash them at every given opportunity.
If you don't like it, don't read my posts, simples.
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Grafter
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: RichAllen
Yhing is though, the DM has been demonising the unemployed and people on any form of benefits for decades

FTFY.
Actually, not their worst fault by a country mile. This is the paper that famously supported the Facism in the 30s and, like many people, has become more right wing with age  Grin
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Community Veteran
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: RichAllen
Yhing is though, the DM has been demonising the unemployed and people on any form of benefits for years, so it's no wonder people like me bash them at every given opportunity.
If you don't like it, don't read my posts, simples.

Thing is though RA every other paper does the same thing too. The only difference is that the DM are appealing to the upper classes. So is it really the DM or the middle / upper classes at fault here?
I need a new signature... i'm bored of the old one!
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Rising Star
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: thejudge
Benefit fraud amounts to about 0.7% of the total social security budget. Peanuts in the scheme of things.
It's a tactic as old as the oldest pogrom and it keeps on being deployed because - alas - it still works, as most of the comments on this thread have amply proved.

Well said
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Pro
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: thejudge
Benefit fraud amounts to about 0.7% of the total social security budget. Peanuts in the scheme of things.

if you call 1.6 billion pounds sterling penuts source http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-busting-real-figures-benefit-fraud
personally unless it was under 100 million (total cost) I wouldn't be so dismissive, its not the percentage of the benefits budget that's the issue its the scale of the fraud that is, £1.6billion could be spent on so many things not least of which would of been keeping firms like Remploy running, its closure has had a huge impact on a lot of lives making those who relied on it far worse off (I'm talking about the disabled people here) emotionally and in some cases causing suicides as feelings of worthlessness escalated beyond bearing (as happened in 3 reported cases)
it could pay for more schools more houses more all kinds of stuff really, and then you get to I.D. fraud again a minor % in terms of GDP or government budgets but again 1.4billion pounds sterling with an average cost to the individual hit by it of over 20 thousand pounds, things that could easily be prevented from happening by a few simple measures like having a national photo id card database and a national finger print database, so every time a person from cradle to grave wishes to conduct any form of claim or lending transaction they would have to present their card and have their finger scanned, schemes that would cost significantly less than the current cost of the fraud(s)
which despite your comment are most definitely not peanuts sums of money
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Grafter
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

In a system which is necessarily complex in order to cover as many eventualities and anomalies as possible, there will always be some level of fraud. 0.7% of the total budget in that context is peanuts, whichever way you slice it.
(Given that politicians, media types and others also try to lump in actual fraud and overpayments due to incompetence together, the percentage may not even be as high as that).
All in all, I accept it as a reasonable price to pay in order to ensure that as few of our fellow citizens  - or do I mean 'consumers'? - as possible starve to death in shop doorways.
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Community Veteran
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Re: Daily Mail story about benefit cheat!

Quote from: Oldjim
Looking at the quoted 95% confidence levels I would disagree with you

Huh?  Huh
Gabe