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Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

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Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

Report just released by the AAIB. Looks like the fuel pumps were switched off and the pilot ignored low fuel warnings. See attached.
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Re: Clathra Vaults helicopter crash last November

Clutha Vaults, not Clathra Vaults !
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Re: Cluthra Vaults helicopter crash last November

Thanks! Corrected.  Smiley
nanotm
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Re: Clathra Vaults helicopter crash last November

not to belittle the investigation or anything but without the pumps switched on the heli would have crashed before it got 100ft from the helipad, the fuel lines don't hold that much fuel, and its common practice to switch them off when you realise your about to pile in, something about the investigation report doesn't seem right, maybe they are deliberately omitting something but given in the intervening period that type of helicopter was grounded  due to a design fault in the fuel system its far more likely mechanical failure occurred and the pilot took steps to mitigate the problem and the likelihood of going woomph shortly after stoving in to the deck when he realised it was going to happen regardless of what he did, seeing yet another AAIB report that trots out the favourite "pilot error" line yet again smacks of another whitewash to protect yet another corporation from gigantic lawsuits /
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Cluthra Vaults helicopter crash last November

Quote from: nozzer
Thanks! Corrected.  Smiley

still wrong  Roll eyes
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Re: Clathra Vaults helicopter crash last November

Quote from: nanotm
not to belittle the investigation or anything but without the pumps switched on the heli would have crashed before it got 100ft from the helipad, the fuel lines don't hold that much fuel, and its common practice to switch them off when you realise your about to pile in, something about the investigation report doesn't seem right, maybe they are deliberately omitting something but given in the intervening period that type of helicopter was grounded  due to a design fault in the fuel system its far more likely mechanical failure occurred and the pilot took steps to mitigate the problem and the likelihood of going woomph shortly after stoving in to the deck when he realised it was going to happen regardless of what he did, seeing yet another AAIB report that trots out the favourite "pilot error" line yet again smacks of another whitewash to protect yet another corporation from gigantic lawsuits /

You say "maybe I'm omitting something....". You certainly are! What you are omitting is reading the report! Always a wise move instead of jumping to conclusions.
Quote...
Fuel in the helicopter’s main fuel tank is pumped by two transfer pumps into a supply tank, which is divided into two cells. Each cell of the supply tank feeds its respective engine. During subsequent examination of the helicopter, 76 kg of fuel was recovered from the main fuel tank. However, the supply tank was found to have been empty at the time of impact. It was deduced from wreckage examination and testing that both fuel transfer pumps in the main tank had been selected off for a sustained period before the accident, leaving the fuel in the main tank, unusable.
The intermediate tank obviously had enough fuel in it to last until it crashed.
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Re: Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

nozzer you can't tell nanotm... he will swear until he's blue in the face that he is the expert Wink
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nanotm
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Re: Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

my point was that they have a known flaw with that airframe type that caused fuel to leak and when the supply tank was below a certain weight in fuel you couldn't pump more fuel into it so the fuel would flow into the passenger area, several other airframes had crashes because of this and it was down to a substandard valve, so the reason for the pumps being shut off at the time of the crash could be down to trying not to die rather than something caused by pilot error.
that's not to say the report is wrong it could just as easily be down to pilot error, but failing to take that into account when they already declared that part of the system was badly damaged (which they attributed to the crash) and couldn't be confirmed as not being the cause seems like an attempt to side step seeing a round of large lawsuits against the manufacturer who could just as easily be to blame, and its not like this hasn't been done in the past, westland were protected in the same way when the helicopters they built crashed killing several people due to a suspected mechanical failure.
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
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Re: Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

nanotm - the air accident investigation expert. just another feather in his, already full, cap.
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Re: Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

Are you serious nanotm? Police helicopters with fuel tanks that spill over into the very airframes that carry them?
I've heard it all now  Roll eyes
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nanotm
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Re: Clutha Vaults helicopter crash last November

that particular airframe type had a design flaw and some of them had dodgy parts that instead of doing the job failed and allowed the fuel to pump instead of into the reservoir tank for the engines into the main compartment (the passenger area) its a problem that saw a couple of other airframes suffer engine off heavy landings and a couple of crashes, it lead to the fleet being grounded and then allowed to fly with limitations, they were no longer supposed to fly with less than 49kg of fuel in the reservoir at take off and new parts were fitted before they were allowed to fly anyway, that was part of a series of serious incident reports into near misses with the airframe type  that crashed here, not having been present in the aircraft prior immediately prior to or during the crash its impossible to say exactly what happened for anyone but to automatically assume pilot error given those known limitations that were uncovered in the 3 months following the crash it seems extremely short sighted to lay all the blame on the pilot.
and fyi the tanks on those heli's have a design flaw as well as faulty parts yet they are still flying them because the until it gets fixed it would be too expensive to retrain on a new heli of a  different make & model not to mention the replacement costs  new maint crew costs and theres no guarantee it would be any better in longer term than sticking with the current one and getting it fixed, something the MOD has done many times just look and the chinook (one of the upgrades to fix one problem left them unable to fly in cloud or wet weather .....)
feel free to look it up plenty of reports about incidents available on the interwebz
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you