cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Children's biometrics

Midnight_Caller
Rising Star
Posts: 4,143
Thanks: 7
Fixes: 1
Registered: 15-04-2007

Children's biometrics

Hi All
Just seen this:
[quote="Biometrics in schools"]
What happens if UK schools do not comply with written parental consent for children's biometrics?
This new school term in the UK presents parents with a new transparency regarding the data a school holds and processes on their children.  A transparency that parents in the UK have not had before.  Since 2001 schools have been taking, storing and processing children's biometric data and have been able to do with without consent or consultation with the parent/s. This nearly happened to my children in 2005 when they were six and seven years old, hence this blog.
After campaigning, lobbying parliament and working with other committed parents and privacy organisations The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 was passed in May 2012 and as of September 1st 2013 schools by law need to gain written parental permission before taking a child's biometric data.
This is what the Department of Education stated in reply to a recent Freedom of Information Act request when asked:
[Snp]
Read More Here

30 REPLIES
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

I had a discussion a few years ago about the idea of bio chipping people instead of giving them passports or driving licences, something with a simple set of numbers on (which seems to horrify a lot of people) that only generate data base results when the wand handler has access to the relevant database for which there searching, it would solve a lot of problems If something like that were inserted into the child at birth,
I actually support the schools ability to collect and store such data, it allows for various nationwide statistics to be generated, I also support them collecting and storing such things in a way that personally identifies such information (it allows for time based tracking of there progress) limits the requirement to employ thousands of healthcare workers around the country in pointless gathering of information, and limits the requirement for a lot of pointless (often poorly trained if not downright stupid) health visitors who would otherwise need to see each child and record such data.
lets not be under the illusion that updating of charts happens by some magic that's unseen, all those health progress charts that have been compiled for generations are a necessary evil by which to judge the progress of a child as it develops for people who don't have regular contact with the children concerned, staff in schools are uniquely placed to be able to monitor such things for each and every child, make statistical reports based on the children in each class group and of course spot instantly any that are falling into the abnormal categories (to advanced/retarded in where they should fall in conjunction with there peers both locally and nationally) and initiate external agencies (like child services) so they take action where required.
personally I would like to see a national DNA database that every child was entered into at birth or school, every adult when they applied for anything official (passport/marriage/driving), when a person was arrested, sought medical aid or access/egress (legally) to the UK. this would certainly lower crime rates across the country, it would also speed up identifying expired individuals regardless of there state at time of discovery (not to mention stop misidentification)
I actually don't understand anyone who claims it as an invasion of privacy, unless your doing something criminal there is no reason not to be identifiable, nor is there any reason to try and hide from official data collection and monitoring systems.
the tinfoil hat brigade talk a lot about big brother tactics and the criminally swayed often chime in on the same yet nobody is able to explain why any such data is personally harmful unless there admitting to some form of criminality, which just goes to show that rather than acting for the greater good they are instead acting out of selfishness despite the propositions being for the good and benefit of the majority....
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Midnight_Caller
Rising Star
Posts: 4,143
Thanks: 7
Fixes: 1
Registered: 15-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

Shocked  Shocked
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

I rather doubt to many people would agree with my rational but when you have to formally id your deceased progeny it does rather sharpen the focus on these matters, even more so when you were forced into a delay because of uncertainty.
the only reason the remainder don't have GPS trackers fitted is they need to be surgically detached from there track able smartphones so I can "big brother" them 24/7/365 complete with mapping (should it ever be needed) although I'm starting to seriously consider the implant's now that there realistically affordable!
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Midnight_Caller
Rising Star
Posts: 4,143
Thanks: 7
Fixes: 1
Registered: 15-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

I aren't saying anything to that I am so stunned.
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

when we suffer from tragedy we often are able to see a lesson in it and then move forwards, one thing I have learnt over the years is that whilst being passionate about a subject that is close to your heart you are best off using impassionate or impersonal language to lessen the resurgence of emotion the topic causes to resurface, more so when its something that is often only given negative press without anyone ever giving fair consideration to the positive benefits could have.
we wouldn't need CCTV covering every inch of the country if every person was fitted with a micro GPS unit, now I do believe that being visually recorded is a massive invasion of privacy (location tracking not so much) yet nobody so much as complains about street cams, no matter what they see....
when they were limited to commercial premises or shopping precincts (not high streets) only they were not so much of an invasion but now you travel more than a few inches from your front door in town without being seen on at least one camera.......anyone who was serious about privacy would insist that those things were removed and tracking implants were put into everyone in the country !
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
Midnight_Caller
Rising Star
Posts: 4,143
Thanks: 7
Fixes: 1
Registered: 15-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

I am so stunned with you!
RichAllen
Grafter
Posts: 805
Registered: 14-09-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

Chipping people? Are you having a laugh? We're humans, not dogs.
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

and yet if the pet goes missing it can be found and brought home, if it gets run over it can be scanned and the owner(s) informed, why is a child any different?
is it not more important ot be able ot tell instantly where your child is when something goes wrong?
would you prefer to go look at a body everytime a blond haird blue eyed kid aged 8 shows up because yours went missing 3 years ago and still hasn't been found or have them wanded like the dog you despise and the correct family informed?
when the likes of april jones and the thousands of others like her every year go missing would you like the plod ot take weeks finding them or would you prefer to click a few buttons and know exactly where in the world they are located ?
when someone accuses you of rape in a back alley would you prefer to be dragged through 3 weeks of hostility and degradation or be proved innocent by virtue of your gps locator showing you on the other side of town in bed ?

I bloddy well know what my answers are to all of those but it would need everyone to realise why such things are important, what protection they afford and how they help if/when things go awry

the reason people push for things like this are because its important to minimise distress and heartache, the reason people believe them to be draconian is because they believe such measures would hamper there ability to pull a fast one should the opportunity arise .....that's why safeguards would nee3d to be in place to secure who can access the data stream(s) that relate to the entry(s) on the biochip, I'm not going ot argue about what /who those are but I can certainly state the cases for why we would need them and how they would be far better than some cctv footage that may or maynot have been doctored (if its been enhanced it means changed from original and thus can actually be anything the person in charge wants it to show) to fit you up with...
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
itsme
Grafter
Posts: 5,924
Thanks: 1
Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

GPS is a line of sight system and as such can be easily defeated and does not work in buildings.
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

the oldest forms of gps maybe, but the current generation of chips utilise multiple technologies and are not so easily defeated, some even have life sign indicator digits to show if they were tampered with.
I'd rather see them used worldwide than all the current versions of surveillance which are far more intrusive and destructive of privacy to individuals who whilst doing nothing wrong are still tracked and recorded constantly 
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
itsme
Grafter
Posts: 5,924
Thanks: 1
Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

Quote from: nanotm
the oldest forms of gps maybe, but the current generation of chips utilise multiple technologies and are not so easily defeated, some even have life sign indicator digits to show if they were tampered with.

Where are you getting the power source from?
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

personally I would advocate some form of bioelectric primary energiser with a secondary emergency source would be best (it could even auto flag the primary source being interrupted or unavailable), the units could be similar to passports in that you would have them maintained on a 5 or 10 year cycle which is probably as often as the majority actually see a doctor.....
but that's all rather academic when less people understand that such things would provide better less intrusive surveillance options than those currently in use and see such methods as being a control mechanism of a heavy handed state yet are perfectly happy to have every facet of there daily life captured on camera, to the point that they see nothing wrong with having cameras all over there own living space in devices like laptops or TV's available for state snooping at the click of a few buttons without any outward sign ever being given......
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you
itsme
Grafter
Posts: 5,924
Thanks: 1
Registered: 07-04-2007

Re: Children's biometrics

Quote from: nanotm
personally I would advocate some form of bioelectric primary energiser with a secondary emergency source would be best (it could even auto flag the primary source being interrupted or unavailable), the units could be similar to passports in that you would have them maintained on a 5 or 10 year cycle which is probably as often as the majority actually see a doctor.....

Do you know how the units work in passports? They are RFIDs and well work for decades as the power is supplied by the reader by an inductive loop.
nanotm
Pro
Posts: 5,670
Thanks: 108
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-02-2013

Re: Children's biometrics

passports are maintained every 5 years for under 16's, every 10 years for adults as are the photo card driving licences  (you can get a driving licence from age 12 in certain circumstances)  and there's no power sources attached to them at all.
are you also aware the RFID units come in both passive and active forms for a variety of different uses
none of which detracts from my proposition that it could be done and in my view should be done at the earliest opportunity (including mass DNA registration) certainly it would be of far greater benefit to the majority than current privacy shredding inadequate systems 
just because your paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you