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Better than a poke in the eye?

Minivanman
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Better than a poke in the eye?

Nurses pay.

With and average salary of somewhere between £33,000 and £35,000, should they still get a pay rise?

Higher, lower, or is that 1% better than a poke in the eye?

Nurses' union anger over 'pitiful' 1% NHS pay rise - BBC News

Personally I'm torn on this as it's all starting to sound just a bit too politically motivated for my liking. 🙁


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29 REPLIES 29
Marksfish
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

I was watching BBC Breakfast yesterday and one of the nurses union leaders stated they had asked for a 12% increase across the board!

I don't doubt nurses have been working hard and seen things no- one else would want to, but as my colleague's daughter said (nurse in Sheffield), "it's what we signed up for, to look after sick people". I agree, nurses don't expect to see a pandemic in their service, but look at some of the other horrible scenes they see in casualty or the theatre on a daily basis. Not every nurse has been impacted by the extra stresses either, so across the board? To make a comparison, when a soldier signs up in peace time he accepts that in the future he may have to go to war, no pay rise or extra equipment there either, they don't demand 12% extra. The Police have to go to work every day not knowing what they may encounter, suicide, murder, being stabbed, but they don't demand 12% extra. I too have worked every day since the first lockdown as a mobile service engineer keeping industries that keep essential businesses open working, having to enter sites where there have been previous outbreaks, but it is a part of my job. 12%? That is cloud cuckoo land at the moment.

The public sector is having a 0% pay rise this year, that should also include all MP's and Lords and all the fat cats in public industries. That though is not going to happen and that is the publics fault for not holding our political representatives accountable.

Life is going to be very different for the next few years while we have to pay off this extraordinary amount of debt that has been allowed to build up supporting people to be sat at home on 80% of their salary. I expect a lot of these people will also be the ones complaining in the future about tax increase, but I start to digress.

Champnet
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

A one-off reasonable payment should help to show our appreciation.....

Baldrick1
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

The problem is that not all health workers are on the front line. There are hoards of back office staff many of who have been 'working' from home. No doubt they also want an extra 12%?

Front line nurses have had to work extraordarily hard and been transferred between hospitals. The question that comes to mind is how they have been compensated, especially for all the extra hours that many have put in over the past year? Hopefully this has been properly addressed, if not then there should be a lump sum bonus restricted to those affected.

Alex
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

Yes, I can see the problem here.

Working in IT, which can sometimes get good pay. I can see why.

If a computer crashes, or my software doesn't work, has bugs and I get moaned at by my boss. My brain can deal with it.

If someone passes away, then no way. Sadly I have been through that and I will say no more on that note.

I don't really follow football, but if I did - I would say that is a completely different league.

So the people who work in the hospitals get my upmost respect. Sorry all, I am cheerful today 😀

Jonpe
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

As with any negotiations, no-one expects to get what they ask for as a starting point.  There are, however, a few points to remember:

Nurses have had below-inflation pay rises since the financial crisis in 2008 (which was not caused by nurses).

Today's nurses are graduates who are expected to carry out tasks that until a decade or two ago were only carried out by doctors, and to work independently diagnosing and treating many 'minor' conditions.

Soldiers and policeman can retire on a full pension at an earlier age than nurses (who need 40 years service in order to retire on a full pension).

 

TeeGee
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

The anomaly here is that the NHS is run by multiple levels of management with minimal accountability.

At comparatively local level there is a NHS Trust with CEOs being paid £200k salaries and below them equally highly paid hospital chief execs. There are also the salaries of their respective teams. The salaries you see quoted will be enhanced by Other Financial Benefits and a non contributory pension benefit of around 15%.

It takes a fair bit of time to dig out this information on the internet but if the NHS is free at the point of delivery the cost to the taxpayer is probably double what it would be if run by the private sector.

I also know that lawyers are analysing the death statistics to make class action compensation claims for families whose relatives died as a result of Covid caught in hospitals and passed into care homes by the NHS. These statistics are truly frightening.

At the sharp end the lesser paid staff to a great job and are let down not by the government of the day but by the system and its managers.

Minivanman
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

Well let's see if they do go on strike lets see how opinions change if they do, because being told how caring and dedicated as many of the surely are then walking out if the job is going to be some sort of contradiction of care.

Emotion versus economics seems to be at play here and if anything is going to cost them the public sympathy vote it's going to be the unions if they don't pipe down a bit as now is not the time to be making demands on either the government or the taxpayer.

 


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billnotben
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

I go with the "we are all in this together". We are all essential in one way or another. And as said people do the job they signed up for. So when people talk of amazing medical stuff I think.........if a road sweeper / taxi driver etc gave someone life saving medical aid that would be amazing. If a nurse / doctor did it it would just be their job.

The one thing that does give me pause for thought though is when someone starts using a crisis as a basis for financial gain.

gleneagles
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

What often gets quoted is nurses average pay but many trained nurses work at staff nurse level on a salary of around £ 24,000, true they will be subject to the same bills as the rest of us but add a payment of £60 a year to remain on the nursing register, not to be confused with the amount they pay to the RCN or other union.

So I would argue that those at the lower grades in nursing should be given a better offer than 1%.

Nursing assistants and others who are not registered will get even less than the figure shown above.

It seems to me governments pick on those who it is fairly certain will not strike but what has happened in nursing and medicine over the years is that attitudes have changed and it’s seen more of a job than a profession.

A study of the subject will show that in the early history of nursing many women who joined were from more wealthy families and status rather than money was a prime factor, this may be the reason why nurses have trailed behind pay of so many other professional groups in the past and have no wish to slip behind in pay.

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gleneagles
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?


@billnotben wrote:

I go with the "we are all in this together". We are all essential in one way or another. And as said people do the job they signed up for. So when people talk of amazing medical stuff I think.........if a road sweeper / taxi driver etc gave someone life saving medical aid that would be amazing. If a nurse / doctor did it it would just be their job.

The one thing that does give me pause for thought though is when someone starts using a crisis as a basis for financial gain.


Everyone in it together......?
Utter rubbish.

The ones who are in it ‘together’ are the poorest in society along with the thousands who have lost their jobs and homes, they are the ones really in it.

Sure we may all lose something but it’s the scale of loss that matters so if you are well off a freeze on your personal allowance for a few years is hardly going to keep you awake at night with worry.

 

We are born into history and history is born into us.
Jonpe
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

Nurses will not go on strike as such; the most 'militant' action they usually take is to work to rule and mount demonstrations (marches, or standing outside hospitals with banners/placards as junior doctors did a few years ago).  Even working to rule won't be strictly applied; do you really think a nurse (who is first and foremost a human being) will go home leaving the patients to look after themselves if the next shift are late arriving for work, or cover has been impossible to provide for whatever reason?

If nurses should accept whatever pay rise they are offered and be grateful for having a job while so many have lost theirs, then logically those who lost their jobs should stop moaning and go and work in care homes where there is no shortage of vacancies.

billnotben
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?


@gleneagles wrote:


Everyone in it together......?
Utter rubbish.


Yes I would agree that while we are all at sea in our lifeboats we are not all in the same boat. But I was talking about that mythical "essential" where I believe we are all essential to one degree or another.

Minivanman
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

Some bandwagon marketing on the back of this weeks TV Choice magazine.

One seven inch high teddy bear dressed as a nurse...and all yours for only £199. 

Err, I don't think. 😆

 

 

 


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gleneagles
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Re: Better than a poke in the eye?

I wonder who buys this carp......

I would not want it if it was free....

 

We are born into history and history is born into us.