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Xbox Live Laggy

dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Xbox Live Laggy

Hi there, sorry to dig up an old thread but I am having a similar problem with lag.
I mainly play cod 5 against those nasty zombies.  Sunday night I was warping all over the place and last night wasn't much better.  My connection seems to be ok initially but then degrade as time goes by and also as the levels go up.  The higher the level the more action but even when we all die and reset to level 1 the lag doesn't clear.
I have a PN supplied DSL-2640B router (uPnP) and am on the old your way option 2 product.  Therefore my gaming traffic should be Titanium?  I have been with Plusnet for 5 years and my connection has been very good.  I ran a speedtest this morning and got 5.98/0.38 from http://www.speedtest.net/ ; I have engineer installed ADSL with a master socket so no filters.
I started off with a bridged connection from my Xbox->PC->Router, then tried the MS wireless device before switching to 200 meg av homeplugs.  One of the plugs died at the weekend so last night I ran a 25m CAT5 down the stairs straight into my router.  Performance was no better than the bridge connection I was using on Sunday so something else must be up.
My xbox currently has a static dhcp lan address reserved based on the mac address.  I'm considering moving my Xbox onto the DMZ side of router to see if this improves performance.
ASBO DOG you mentioned the COD5 lag meter.  I assume thats the thing you get when you put the scores up, anyway last night I had 4 bars at best on a uk hosted game and on later levels dropped to 1 bar.  Even the two americans had 2 bars and they were connecting across the pond!
The reason i replied to the topic is the mention of fast path.  Can you explain what that is please? 
I'm at work at the moment but will post a trace later if that will help.  I have also opened a ticket with PN support to see if they can come up with anything.
Any help much appreciated Smiley
Cheers,
Duncan
15 REPLIES
scootie
Grafter
Posts: 4,799
Registered: 03-11-2007

Xbox Live Laggy

o.k so all the packages even the new unlimited( which am now on) and value have xbox gaming all titanium the only diffrence on unlimited is there is 2mb speed cap which never gets hit with gaming traffic this i belive was put in place to stop any downloads mis clasfied swamping the network.
interleaving is a form error checking. what it does is at the exchange the equpiment will chop a packet of data up and mix it up before sending it on to your router doing this means if the is burst noise on the phone line and croupts some of the packet data your router is still able to re assamble the packet data. the down side of this is it takes say 30 ms to chop and mix and then reassamble at your router.
now fastpath just sends the data on to your router in its raw form meaning if there is a burst of noise it's more likely to get totaly croupt and need to be resent again.
and on that bombshell this site explains it in more detail http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/interleaving.htm worth adding this site to your fav's for all things broadband
yes the lag meter is just that.
Are you running windows if so open command prompt up and type    ping bbc.co.uk or ping -t bbc.co.uk   this command keeps the ping going for more than 3 packets and you need to use ctrl+c to stop it.   make sure no other pc is swaping your thoughput esp the upload this will cause lag for certain
also can you do a traceroute in command prompt to type     tracert bbc.co.uk and paste the results of the tracert here
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 17,213
Thanks: 888
Fixes: 101
Registered: 11-01-2008

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

[Moderator's note by Adie (Adiewoo) Split from other topic mode:end
Will Moderate For Thanks
dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Thanks for the interleaving info ASBODOG.  Sounds like this is something I would need Plusnet to turn off.  I guess that decision would depend on how noisy my line is?  Do most gamers on here run with it off and has it improved peoples perceived gaming experience?
I am running Windows and had a ping going whilst gaming last night.  It wasn't to bbc but to google.co.uk.  During a two hour gaming session I didn't drop any packets and my ping average was 40.  I did have the occasional spike, the highest being of 1400ms.  I will perform a trace and ping to bbc when I get home as that seems to be the benchmark site Smiley
scootie
Grafter
Posts: 4,799
Registered: 03-11-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

is the pc wireless if so them high spikes could be caused by windows auto searching for routers every 30 seconds. i will wait for your reply before adviseing how to disable that
yes you raise a ticket to get interleaving turned on or off. 
if you was to request it right now and the ticket is picked up before 5ish BTw would most likely have you on fast path at 2am and if you had problems running fastpath the same time frame again to turn interleaving back on
i run fastpath on a long damp pieace of string and have no  stabilty issues runing at 2.5mb at at the mo
<a href="https://portal.plus.net/wizard/index.html?Ea82ChdSAqqwtYJcjZV%2Fjl8BeHfnW7ogQYILXVCBFsnFyRVJeEpVZrrGHDFWsmvQCsvo6bTYqNo%3D">Interleaving ticket you need to sign into member centre</a> ask for interleaving to be turned off
does it make diffrence all i can say to that is it puts you on level playing field with others that use fastpath and gives you a 10-30ish ms advantage over those on interleaved. if you have mighty quick trigger finger could make a huge diffrence that 30ms
dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Right, here's the traceroute to the beeb:
Quote
Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.254.252]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
  1    1 ms    1 ms    1 ms  192.168.1.1
  2    26 ms    42 ms    34 ms  lo0-plusnet.pcl-ag03.plus.net [195.166.128.109]
  3    27 ms    40 ms    24 ms  gi1-6-703.pcl-gw01.plus.net [84.92.0.181]
  4    24 ms    27 ms    44 ms  te2-1.pcl-gw02.plus.net [212.159.1.114]
  5    71 ms    41 ms    29 ms  te2-2.thn-gw2.plus.net [212.159.0.190]
  6    25 ms    25 ms    24 ms  rt0.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.239.25]
  7  125 ms  199 ms  202 ms  212.58.238.133
  8    27 ms    30 ms    26 ms  rdirslb0.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.136]
  9    34 ms    31 ms    26 ms  virtual3.rbsov.bbc.co.uk [212.58.254.252]

Trace complete.
and the ping
Quote

[left]Ping statistics for 212.58.254.252:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 25ms, Maximum = 65ms, Average = 38ms

[/left]

My PC is indeed running on wireless.  It usually goes via the homeplug network the same as the xbox but due to aformentioned failure of one of the homeplugs the pc is wireless and the xbox is on cat5.
scootie
Grafter
Posts: 4,799
Registered: 03-11-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Use this prog if your runing vista http://www.martin-majowski.de/wlanoptimizer/ or do this if runing xp http://paininthetech.com/2005/10/25/disable-wireless-zero-configuration-in-windows-xp that will stop windows ping spikes tainting the ping results from you pc.
Looking at thos pings you've got a 26 an 25ms there which if thats still on intrealeved then i would put u as living pretty close to london.
They dont look as stable as i would like tho( but then am picky little so so about latency). give interleaving off ago an see how they are then
this are mine on the adsl2 trial so not the best compare but this are what i get on faspath from sheffield to london
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=249
Reply from 212.58.254.252: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=249
Ping statistics for 212.58.254.252:
    Packets: Sent = 45, Received = 45, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 16ms, Maximum = 33ms, Average = 17ms
Euge
Grafter
Posts: 502
Registered: 11-10-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Ping statistics for 212.58.254.252:
   Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 15ms, Maximum = 17ms, Average = 15ms
Thats my stats, I can't remember how to do trace route  Embarrassed
I live 1 and half hours from London and thats with interleaving off.
EDIT: Thanks to Asbo and James, I can show you this
Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.254.252]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
  1     2 ms     1 ms     1 ms  voyager.home [192.168.1.1]
  2    24 ms    31 ms    18 ms  lo0-plusnet.ptn-ag2.plus.net [195.166.128.53]
  3    18 ms    20 ms    19 ms  gi2-2-204.ptn-gw02.plus.net [84.92.3.93]
  4    17 ms    23 ms    22 ms  te2-2.pte-gw2.plus.net [212.159.1.106]
  5    23 ms    19 ms    24 ms  vl23.thn-gw2.plus.net [212.159.4.20]
  6    39 ms    25 ms    28 ms  rt0.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.239.25]
  7    17 ms    27 ms    35 ms  212.58.238.133
  8    24 ms    18 ms    16 ms  rdirslb0.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.136]
  9    16 ms    19 ms    29 ms  bbc.co.uk [212.58.254.252]
James
Grafter
Posts: 21,036
Registered: 04-04-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Hi Euge,
It's "tracert" in an MSDOS command window.
Grff
Grafter
Posts: 351
Registered: 02-08-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Quote from: ASBO

does it make diffrence all i can say to that is it puts you on level playing field with others that use fastpath and gives you a 10-30ish ms advantage over those on interleaved. if you have mighty quick trigger finger could make a huge diffrence that 30ms

It can be the difference betweeen being at the bottom of the score board and the top.
Naturally a bit of skill comes into it, but if two players of similar skill have differing latency, then the one with less latency is generally higher up the table.  Something that frustrates me all the time. Unless i'm hosting the game of course. Smiley
This is something i've come to live with, but if your line is stable enough i'd go with interleaving off.
scootie
Grafter
Posts: 4,799
Registered: 03-11-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

griff i tend be host on cod waw 95% of the time that was on 20cn with max prem and also now on 21cn at 830ish upload
dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

The wlanoptimizer program makes a big difference in vista.  The big spikes have gone from my pings on the wireless PC.
Everything was looking quite rosy last night, I had moved my Xbox onto the DMZ of my router and was enjoying an hour long game which for a change I was hosting.  Unfortunately my adsl connection dropped and everyone got kicked.  As I hadn't heard anything on my open ticket (36 hours), I decided to call up PN support.
They recommended not to turn off interleaving and said that if I did then BT may well switch it back on later without informing them.
They also said my line was rock solid which is good news but they attribute blame to either my router or the xbox network.  My router (Dlink DSL-2640B) was new from PN in march 2008 and was apparently only a stop gap router as were in between models.  They suggest trying a new router which they will supply free if I sign up for another year and pay the postage.
I'm a bit annoyed about the router as if they had said it was a stop gap model then I wouldn't have taken it.  The whole point in getting a router from PN was so that they would be able to support it if need be.
They also said me leaving a constant ping going on my pc might be affecting my connection but how else am I suppose to measure the latency?
Thanks for your suggestions so far.  I plan to do some more gaming over the weekend (wife's away etc..)  so is there anything else I should try?
Cheers,
Duncan
scootie
Grafter
Posts: 4,799
Registered: 03-11-2007

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

wouldnt worrie about the constant ping effecting your connection.
Quote
They also said my line was rock solid which is good news but they attribute blame to either my router or the xbox network

so would apper its not your line losing sync then, i wonder why they said not to switch interleaving off if your sync is fine an dandy, have you got fault open with BTw or somthing and the cs agent is saying BTw will just switch interleaving back on at some point if you have an open fault with them..
if you havent got an open fault i would switch intrealving off and sort through the router set up.
do u dissconect from xbox live completly or just the game your playing
dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Quote
so would apper its not your line losing sync then, i wonder why they said not to switch interleaving off if your sync is fine an dandy, have you got fault open with BTw or somthing and the cs agent is saying BTw will just switch interleaving back on at some point if you have an open fault with them..

I have no open BT faults.    BT last checked my line in march but didn't change the speed.  There have been no speed changes on my line since the initial stabilisation period according to PN.
Quote
do u dissconect from xbox live completly or just the game your playing

Last night my internet connection dropped completely from the router.  This doesn't normally happen, before yesterday I believe my connection had been up several weeks.  My usual problem is lag.
Looking at D-links website there appears to be a new firmware out 16/06/2009 for my router but the version number is the same as the one I have installed.  I haven't updated the firmware manually so don't see how I can be on the latest version so I will investigate updating this and ask PN to switch off interleaving.
Ill keep you posted Smiley
dmaidmen
Newbie
Posts: 9
Registered: 08-07-2009

Re: Xbox Live Laggy

Hi All,
I have been running with interleaving off now for a couple of weeks and I have noticed an improvement in the ping times from my PC (see below).
Moving my Xbox to the DMZ of my old dlink router appeared to make my connection more stable.  Plusnet also sent me a Thomson 585v7 which I'm using at the moment and I have managed several long sessions on that without issue.  The wireless signal also appears to be stronger so I'm sticking with the Thomson for the time being.
During my troubleshooting I have noticed that when I connect the Xbox via the Solwise AV homeplugs I do start to lag after a while.  I called their support and they mentioned that noise on the line (internal AC mains) can cause lag and that I should move any noisy transformers away from homeplugs.  I have moved the router to allow its homeplug a dedicated wall socket and have seen a jump in the connection rate (although you can't measure the noise on the line itself). Again, I need to test this with a substantial gaming session to see if this has made a difference or not.
In summary my connection is much better, running a cable down the stairs isn't practical so I'm back to the homeplugs. If I can't eliminate the lag I might just have to reroute my adsl master socket extension so my router is next to my Xbox.
Thanks for the suggestions.

Pinging bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.138] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=122
Reply from 212.58.224.138: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=122
Ping statistics for 212.58.224.138:
    Packets: Sent = 49, Received = 49, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 15ms, Maximum = 18ms, Average = 16ms