PS3 downloads so slow again.

[#1]

You consider downloading stuff on psn as gaming?? 

[#2]

Just to add my 2p's worth,
I always check the terms and conditions of anything I sign up for and I quickly and easily found the page stating all the speeds I could expect for each service as per time of day.(Something that a hell of a lot of Isp's dont give out may I add)
Gaming is given line speed , downloads such as demo's are just that "downloads" so are classed differently.
It was clear as day to me , so perhaps you should have looked into it a little more , it took me all of 2 mins.
Cheers
Paul.

[#3]

Quote from: HaydnExport

You consider downloading stuff on psn as gaming??

Nope didn't say that I did.

[#4]

Soz adie that was not directed at you more for beefqueen

[#5]

Hi Paul, 
If you read the thread, you'll see that I did check the terms of the account before taking it out.  If you read the thread, you'll also see that some people consider PSN to be gaming and some don't.  There shouldn't be any scope for such ambiguity in something that affects so much the operation of the broadband and Plusnet have accepted they need to review their site to try to get rid of this. 
And as for whether PSN downloads are gaming: they're downloads of games console firmware and game software updates, performed on a games console for the purpose of playing games.  That sounds a lot like gaming to me. 
Anyway, my account's being upgraded to Pro.  Well done to Plusnet for doing it and let's hope they address this problem for other customers. 
Beef

[#6]

Hey Beef,
I just PM'd you about this but in the interest of seeing also if anyone else has had any luck you mention on the previous post that you've been upgraded, would you mind letting me know if they increased the 20GB allowance like you were asking for etc?
I had several very gaming specific conversations with plusnet before I signed up and I don't expect an 11MB game update (ie wont let you PLAY the game without updating) to take over 30 minutes when it should take 30 seconds!

[#7]

Interesting thread this, I recently had to dissuade a friend from joining Plusnet for this very reason. I too, like many others here, saw 'gaming' classified as line speed and decided it was the right package for me as 20gb on Premium isn't enough. I incorrectly assumed the gaming would cover all aspects of gaming, including the occasional need to download updates for games, especially when those updates are necessary to actually play the game! However on the day I bought the PS3 it took over 4 hours before I could play any game because everything needed numerous updates.
Pretty unclear IMO, very disappointing.

[#8]

Yeah, I was really hoping beef would come back and respond to what he/she actually got from plusnet but I guess he/she has unsubscribed from the thread

[#9]

Very annoyed that I called CS to discuss this and the chap told me that it was 'common sense' that it didn't count (despite 1. this thread proving it isn't and 2.a mention prior in the thread saying that they could do with adding further detail to the traffic management page) and that I can write in to make a complaint but "not being funny but you're wasting your time".
Fair to say my opinion of Plusnet has just dramatically shifted.

[#10]

I agree, it's not clear.
Demos - yes they're clearly downloads, fair enough
Game updates - maybe, at a stretch...
System updates - not in a million years when it prevents you from logging into the PSN and STOPS YOU GAMING!!!!

In addition, I was looking for clarification on the movie rentals... somebody touched on this but it's not really defacto... are they affected? Renting streamable movies shouldn't be counted as a download. We still haven't tried it (too many rental dvds to watch) but to be honest I'm loath to if it isn't actually going to STREAM. I'm not interested in watching it later. I have an 80GB allowance, therefore I'd like to stream it. Like I do with iplayer.
re your last comment - that's why I was hoping beef would reply as he implies he got *something* out of plusnet and therefore they are admitting *something* lol

[#11]

@ munkimatt
Did you ask to speak to some one more senior?

[#12]

Quote from: munkimatt

Very annoyed that I called CS to discuss this and the chap told me that it was 'common sense' that it didn't count (despite 1. this thread proving it isn't and 2.a mention prior in the thread saying that they could do with adding further detail to the traffic management page) and that I can write in to make a complaint but "not being funny but you're wasting your time". Fair to say my opinion of Plusnet has just dramatically shifted.

If you don't mind me asking, what kind of response were you hoping for? Managing PSN downloads as we do was a conscious decision that was made when the products in question were designed. It isn't likely to change any time soon if indeed at all. The only thing I think we could perhaps do better is add some clarification on some of the support pages as alluded to in one of my earlier responses in this thread.

Quote from: henryjenkins

In addition, I was looking for clarification on the movie rentals... somebody touched on this but it's not really defacto... are they affected? Renting streamable movies shouldn't be counted as a download. We still haven't tried it (too many rental dvds to watch) but to be honest I'm loath to if it isn't actually going to STREAM. I'm not interested in watching it later. I have an 80GB allowance, therefore I'd like to stream it. Like I do with iplayer.

Any streaming services available on PSN should do exactly that - stream. If they don't then something's wrong and it will need to be fixed.

[#13]

Quote from: Bob

Quote from: munkimatt Very annoyed that I called CS to discuss this and the chap told me that it was 'common sense' that it didn't count (despite 1. this thread proving it isn't and 2.a mention prior in the thread saying that they could do with adding further detail to the traffic management page) and that I can write in to make a complaint but "not being funny but you're wasting your time". Fair to say my opinion of Plusnet has just dramatically shifted. If you don't mind me asking, what kind of response were you hoping for? Managing PSN downloads as we do was a conscious decision that was made when the products in question were designed. It isn't likely to change any time soon if indeed at all. The only thing I think we could perhaps do better is add some clarification on some of the support pages as alluded to in one of my earlier responses in this thread.

Well for a starter I wasn't expecting to be insulted by a staff member informing me I have no common sense.
Secondly, in answer to your question, a response I would have hoped for would be some form of negotiation regarding limits on a Pro account. I had already alluded to that fact I was comfortable paying more in order to get the service I actually expected in the first place. Crazy I know, but that's how a negotiation works. You give a little, I give a little.
Long and short of the matter is that the information available on the website clearly isn't sufficient. This thread and several others on this board testify to that.

[#14]

Quote from: Bob

Any streaming services available on PSN should do exactly that - stream. If they don't then something's wrong and it will need to be fixed.

Hi Bob,
Thanks for your response. However I would respectfully point out that you've only addressed part of my point.
Let me put this another way. Let's assume the movies DO stream no problem. I get in from work and we decide we'll watch a film from the PSN video store... oh but hang on... it turns out there's a MANDATORY system update which downloads at a snails pace... in fact the system update would take around 2hours give or take.... well, by the time it's done that there's no point watching the film is there?
So, please can you clarify why you can't somehow separate system updates from everything else - this would seem to me to be the major sticking point. If my mac needs a system update (generally much bigger than a ps3 update) that doesn't get limited, there must be a way to solve this.
Even better game updates should be separate also, being that they're mandatory even if you want to play single player offline. This is affectively limiting GAMING. Your service limits my free choice of which game to play should it need an update.
System updates shouldn't come under the heading of 'downloads' - when they're mandatory (which 90% of the time they are) they prevent you from logging in and using the console online, whether to watch a film, play a game online or use iplayer.

Quote from: munkimatt

Well for a starter I wasn't expecting to be insulted by a staff member informing me I have no common sense. Secondly, in answer to your question, a response I would have hoped for would be some form of negotiation regarding limits on a Pro account. I had already alluded to that fact I was comfortable paying more in order to get the service I actually expected in the first place. Crazy I know, but that's how a negotiation works. You give a little, I give a little. Long and short of the matter is that the information available on the website clearly isn't sufficient. This thread and several others on this board testify to that.

I agree with matt.  We are your customers, so irrespective of who's right and who's wrong as long as nobody's being abusive then there's no excuse for being rude.
I firmly believe we have been mis-sold. The information we need to make an informed decision about a purchase is NOT easily or readily accessible.
I just got out of a 24 month contract with Orange (less than 3 months in) because the info on their website was misleading. This is not dissimilar at all.
I had several conversations with your sales guys (yes plural) before i came on board. I discussed EXPLICITLY what and why I needed the 80GB for and why 20GB on a pro package was not going to be enough. At NO time did anyone tell me that the other reason I needed the pro package was because download speeds were limited on the 80GB package, nevermind that system updates count as downloads!!!! THIS was what was being discussed... ie ALL we use the internet for is GAMING and iplayer (tv reception isn't great) and a limited amount of surfing/email type stuff.
It SHOULD have been explained because I was specifically asking for advice on which package. The information was either deliberately withheld OR your sales staff are not adequately trained on the package details (this I find hard to believe).
Finally your Pro package is nonsense anyway. Any half serious gamer would easily get through 20gb in a month without even breaking a sweat.
Why not improve the pro package and at least offer a compromise on a deal to switch.
It's that or lose us as customers the second our contracts are up, if not before with any luck.

[#15]

Quote from: munkimatt

Well for a starter I wasn't expecting to be insulted by a staff member informing me I have no common sense.

I'll happily have a quiet word in the lug hole of said person.

Quote from: munkimatt

Secondly, in answer to your question, a response I would have hoped for would be some form of negotiation regarding limits on a Pro account. I had already alluded to that fact I was comfortable paying more in order to get the service I actually expected in the first place. Crazy I know, but that's how a negotiation works. You give a little, I give a little.

And IIRC you've been advised on more than one occasion that this simply isn't possible due to system limitations. In fact I think I myself may have advised you of this in the past.

Quote from: munkimatt

Long and short of the matter is that the information available on the website clearly isn't sufficient. This thread and several others on this board testify to that.

And I've already said we will look at adding some clarification to the support pages. In fact I was discussing this with our web content guys earlier today.

Quote from: henryjenkins

Thanks for your response. However I would respectfully point out that you've only addressed part of my point. Let me put this another way. Let's assume the movies DO stream no problem. I get in from work and we decide we'll watch a film from the PSN video store... oh but hang on... it turns out there's a MANDATORY system update which downloads at a snails pace... in fact the system update would take around 2hours give or take.... well, by the time it's done that there's no point watching the film is there?

Not if it's too late I guess, no. The fact remains that this is how the product has been designed though at the price point we're offering it at. FWIW Microsoft/Apple updates are treated in a similar fashion although admittedly they aren't as intrusive as a PSN software update. How frequent are these things anyway? I've an XBox as opposed to a PS3 and software updates are pretty few and far between to be fair. Perhaps that isn't the case with a PS3?

Quote from: henryjenkins

So, please can you clarify why you can't somehow separate system updates from everything else - this would seem to me to be the major sticking point. If my mac needs a system update (generally much bigger than a ps3 update) that doesn't get limited, there must be a way to solve this.

Even if there is a way (the building of Ellacoya signatures goes way over my head), I'm not sure we'd take steps to implement it anyway. Like I keep on saying, it's a conscious decision to treat this traffic the way we do.
I find it odd that your Apple updates come down at line speed though because AFAIK they're delivered via Limelight networks and that's in the list here.

Quote from: henryjenkins

System updates shouldn't come under the heading of 'downloads' - when they're mandatory (which 90% of the time they are) they prevent you from logging in and using the console online, whether to watch a film, play a game online or use iplayer.

You could argue a similar point with updates delivered over steam. AFAIK they're treated in a similar fashion too.

Quote from: henryjenkins

I agree with matt.  We are your customers, so irrespective of who's right and who's wrong as long as nobody's being abusive then there's no excuse for being rude.

Agreed, as long as that ethos is being being reciprocated of course

Quote from: henryjenkins

I firmly believe we have been mis-sold. The information we need to make an informed decision about a purchase is NOT easily or readily accessible. I just got out of a 24 month contract with Orange (less than 3 months in) because the info on their website was misleading. This is not dissimilar at all.

If you believe you've been missold the product and are looking to terminate your contract prematurely then I'd suggest you raise this via the official support channels (if you haven't done already). I'd be happy to intervne if you found you weren't getting anywhere. Having said that, it would be a shame to see you go

Quote from: henryjenkins

I had several conversations with your sales guys (yes plural) before i came on board. I discussed EXPLICITLY what and why I needed the 80GB for and why 20GB on a pro package was not going to be enough. At NO time did anyone tell me that the other reason I needed the pro package was because download speeds were limited on the 80GB package, nevermind that system updates count as downloads!!!! THIS was what was being discussed... ie ALL we use the internet for is GAMING and iplayer (tv reception isn't great) and a limited amount of surfing/email type stuff. It SHOULD have been explained because I was specifically asking for advice on which package. The information was either deliberately withheld OR your sales staff are not adequately trained on the package details (this I find hard to believe).

Did you sign up online or over the phone? THe only reason I ask is because this page used to be linked to from the signup journey and on the pre-sales pages.

Quote from: henryjenkins

Finally your Pro package is nonsense anyway. Any half serious gamer would easily get through 20gb in a month without even breaking a sweat.

Gaming isn't that bandwidth intensive TBH, you're a quarter of the way through your current usage period and only a fraction of your traffic is gaming?

Quote from: henryjenkins

Why not improve the pro package and at least offer a compromise on a deal to switch.

Something we can consider for the next product refresh.