Install question: Run CSP-ONT fibre under my floor?

[#1]

@TimSmall  Brilliant suggestion(s) - TVVM. Have ordered 10m single-ended Dexgreen.
Undecided if I'll run in 'bare' under the floor (it looks tough as old boots), or inside flexible conduit.

Have found that Fibre Developer Handbook and will read and digest the appropriate sections (and have prominently to hand when the OR engineer visits 😉

Would there be any advantage/disadvantage (except cost) of getting an ONT off eBay too, and pre-installing that. So OR just need to install the CSP and splice in my Dexgreen fibre.

Nokia and Adtran seem to be the choices.

Pehaps the engineer would see that as a step too far...?

[#2]

I think I'd leave it to the engineer to supply and install the ONT.

[#3]

The ONT is 'keyed' to the connection. On installation the engineer has to register the serial no against the connection. I'd be pretty sure that registering a non-Openreach supplied ONT wouldnt be possible.

[#4]

Very useful to know, thanks. Makes sense. In the copper world, i guess a line was idenified by the phone number. You plug in you ISP-supplied FTTP rouuter and it Just Works (no credentials required) because they know it is YOU.

So the OTN serial no does the same job in the fibre world.

There must be a lot of dissapointed eBay buyers!

[#5]

@markv 

The ONT's belong to OpenReach and should be left in situ if you leave the property. Any second hand ones on sale are technically illegal as the seller does not own the ONT.

Brian

[#6]

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@markv wrote:

.. Have ordered 10m single-ended Dexgreen.

Undecided if I'll run in 'bare' under the floor (it looks tough as old boots), or inside flexible conduit.

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@markv 

I'd install the flexible conduit, then if the installer doesn't want to use your fibre, you can use it or a pre-installed draw rope to pull the OR fibre through.

[#7]

Exit the fibre through existing air vent/brick - brilliant idea or non-starter?

I have a plan to get the Dexgreen fibre down through the floor in mt 'network' cupboard (where I want the ONT to go), run in flexible couduit ~ 5 metres across to the bay window.

Would need to find a way of neatly ending the flexible conduit such that I can feed the fibre up through a new hole drilled in the floorboards. Perhaps a saddle clip screwed to a joist immediately below the newly-drilled hole?

Then the OR engineer will drill through our exterior wall in the window bay to exit the fibre.

NEW THOUGHT. Below floor, just at that place is a ventilation grill. I could simply feed the fibre through one of the holes, remembering a drip-loop and the job is nearly done. The fibre exits without any faff or new drilling.

Would the OR engineer likely to be delighted, or throw his hands up in horror? (I realise you can only give a opinion or guess)

Mark

[#8]

My neighbour has a suspended floor, and the duct emerges in that space - no external presentation at all.

After sorting the duct the CSP is under the floor by the trapdoor access, with the ONT above it in the living space.

[#9]

@markv 

If you can run a duct from the ventiliation grill and bring it up in the cupboard then leave a draw rope (string) in place the engineer might by more than happy with that. Cable in through the ventiliation grill with no need for drilling.

Might even be able to get an internal CSP if you ask nicely (and they have one in their van). Something like this

https://community.plus.net/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/62134i68567DDA298F3522/image-size/large?v=v2...

As for securing the duct - can you make the hole in the floor big engough just to squeeze the duct through so no fixing required.

Brian

Edit : How do you receive the copper at the moment - overhead or underground? Can the fibre cable easlly get to the ventilation grill?

[#10]

That photo is a CBT for the top of poles.

[#11]

@bmc 

Current Plan A is flexible conduit from the network cupboard to the ventilation grill. Install a draw-string. Pull through my 10m of Dexgreen fibre, leaving 3-4 metres coiled up outside the ventilation grill, but under the protective window ledge, in a plastic bag to keep it clean and dry.
Refinement: I could pull my Dexgreen through the day of the OR visit (hope for no snags!).

Re: existing copper.  Underground. BT manhole in the footpath just outside. From there an ancient buried conduit runs under the front garden to the front wall of the house (off-photo but just right of the downpipe), where it feeds copper twisted pairs to us, and the house to our right. That cable enters the house through the right-hand bay wall (as you look at the photo).
Wonder if that's the route the new BT fibre would take...

The ventilation grill is approx 2-2.5 metres from the BT conduit exit (allowing for hugging the walls).

My 10 metres of Dexgreen fibre, would easilly run all the way to the ancient BT conduit.

Re: securing the conduit (if I take the up through the floorboards option). The nominal 20mm flexible conduit is actually ID 16.5, OD 21.5.
I tried stuffing it into a 20mm coupler, but surprisingly, no way, not even after dipping in boiling water to soften (sometimes works). So I'd need to drill a 21 - 21.5 mm hole (right!).
I could perhaps use a Spacer bar saddle to fix the end of the conduit, pointing upwards, to a joist, below a neat <10 mm hole drilled in the floorboard.

My snag is I have to do this in advance of the OR visit (the underfloor work is absolutely filthy and extremely awkward), so I need to decide if I'm going to exit through the ventilation grill (*much* preferred by me!), up up through the floorboards.

Hence my question about whether grill-exit is likely to be acceptable.

[#12]

@markv 

Pardon my ignorance if I misunderstand you. I understand that 'Dexgreen’ is fibre? Are you proposing to supply your own fibre connection between the CSP and ONT? Have you any indication whether Openreach will even consider splicing your fibre to theirs in the CSP?

Seeing that the connection up to the ONT is the responsibility of Openreach, who are responsible for any faults in this area, I am extremely sceptical that this will fly.

Or have I got it all wrong?

[#13]

@markv  I would tend to agree with @Baldrick1 that it is very unlikely that Openreach or their contractors would agree to  providing a connection employing customer supplied fibre. As @TimSmall warned you in msg#13 ....."Obviously there isn't a 100% guarantee that the engineer will agree to use it"

More likely odds are 100% they won't use it, but I could be wrong.🙄

[#14]

@markv 

You just don't know until the day what the engineer is happy with. You just have to do the work and hope for the best.

Have you not got something like this to drill a hole large enough. I have a 22mm and a 32mm one is an old drill set in the garage.

Drill a 25mm hole, the duct comes through easily and perhaps gaffer taped in place.

Seeing the previous posts I've been talking about duct only. If you have your own fibre cable you can more or less guarantee that OR will not use it - it's more than there jobs work. Besides it would mean and extra fibre splice if I understand correctly.

Brian

[#15]

@Baldrick1 

The idea of pre-installing fibre from my desired ONT location to an exit point from the house, ready to be spliced in the CSP, emerged from this thread.

@TimSmall  said, "Obviously there isn't a 100% guarantee that the engineer will agree to use it, but most will - particularly if you make it clear that you've followed the requirements in the Openreach document."

That sounded very encouraging (but no onus on him; my call), so I ordered 10m of Dexgreen Inside/Outside, apparently exactly what BT would use.

Recent posts here suggest than rather than Most Likely, it is Most Unlikely they would use my pre-installed fibre 😞 

Seems I'm the one who got it all wrong.