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FTTC engineer install failure

conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

FTTC engineer install failure

Hi,
Bt engineer came round today to install fttc, as I was at work I left my wife to deal with him. Got a call when he turned up to ask me if I'd received the home hub, or home starter kit. I said the netgear router sent by PN was there for him to configure but he should have the modem. He kept on going on about the bt home hub, I kept on saying it was plusnet, we went round in circles for a while before he said he'd need to go back to base to get the box. Thinking it was the modem he was talking about I thought we wouldn't see him till tomorrow.
A couple of hours later my wife calls to say he's back again with a box that he's found, and do I have a spare network cable (BT engineers don't carry spares??). I told him to take one that was plugged into my old router and thought that would do.
I get home to find that there IS an openreach modem plugged in to the dsl socket, with a solid dsl light, but not connected to anything else as apparently 'the box' he brought round didn't work. He's refused to use the PN supplied netgear router as 'its not as fast as the new ones' and 'doesn't match the service' so will come back tomorrow with another router, sourced from who knows where. In the meantime, no internet connection for me tonight!
What's the story here? Surely the netgear isn't incompatible? Why's he trying to plug in a bt home hub? Has anyone else had engy issues like this?

20 REPLIES
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,263
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Registered: 30-07-2007

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Just plug the Netgear router into the modem with a network cable, configure it for pppoe with your plusnet account details and it will work fine!.
conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Yep, that works.
I wonder what the engineer will turn up with tomorrow ...
Community Veteran
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Registered: 08-01-2008

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

If he does give you a home hub you could always keep it as a spare but DO make sure that you will not be billed for it!
Call me 'w23'
At any given moment in the universe many things happen. Coincidence is a matter of how close these events are in space, time and relationship.
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Community Veteran
Posts: 6,263
Thanks: 433
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Registered: 30-07-2007

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Some BT engineers seem to think that FTTC will only work with a BT Home Hub. I really don't see what OpenReach are doing installing the router at all, their responsibility ends with the modem AFAIK. That they are being 'trained' to install HomeHubs ( for BT Retail ? ) seems to be against the impartiality requirement of OpenReach's dealing with its customers. Unless, of course, BT Retail have contracted a different level of installation package, but I thought it all went via BTw anyway...  
@conroc00, Glad you got it working, at least you won't be without an internet connection tonight. 
conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Agreed. I thought the service demarkation was at the WAN port of the modem. He kept on telling me that Plusnet and BT are the same thing, and I couldn't be bothered to split hairs with him on that one.
More worrying was his statement about the95 Netgear not being fit for the service, and not being able to deliver the full service speed. While it wouldn't be my first choice if I was buying one, until the service and market has matured I'm sure it's the best choice for 95% of the market, who wouldn't think to challenge the engy.
Let's see what tomorrow brings ... a second hand homehub found lying round the office, no doubt ...
Community Veteran
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Registered: 08-01-2008

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

AFAIK all new BT Infinity installs include HH3, on the BT forums there are quite a few people being given these at install because someone in retail forgot to raise the oder to get one posted so you might be lucky enough to get a brand new HH3 for nowt if the engineer remais convinced that this is necessary part of the FTTC install.
Call me 'w23'
At any given moment in the universe many things happen. Coincidence is a matter of how close these events are in space, time and relationship.
Opinions expressed in forum posts are those of the poster, others may have different views.
lexusuk
Grafter
Posts: 567
Registered: 20-10-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Hi conroc00,
Just to clear a few things up. 
- Plusnet are not the same as BT Retail.  Both are part of the BT group but operate as completely separate companies.
- The Netgear N150 is more than sufficient for the FTTC product.
To be fair to the engineer it was not his responsibility to install and setup the Netgear N150 but the claims he made regarding the routers suitability are simply not correct.  Due to this we have reported this installation to our Provisioning team leaders and the details will be fed back via the relevant channels.
I suggest if the engineer returns that you request that your setup is left untouched.
Community Veteran
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Re: FTTC engineer install failure

The limitation of many routers for Fibre is the wireless speed, most wireless 'g' types would transfer slower over wi-fi than the potential line speed of the fibre connection, wireless 'n' is required for sufficient throughput to wi-fi connections BUT not all 'n' devices are equal.  As far as I can gather the HH3 has a maximum wi-fi 'n' speed of 144Mb/s compared with 150Mb/s for the Netgear, as the wireless speed is the main limitation (as long as the device has a fast ethernet WAN port), the Netgear would seem slightly better than the BT HH3 (that's not to sat the HH3 does not have some nice features but the Netgear is certaainly as good for what is required as the HH3).
Note, Wi-fi speeds do not compare directly with ADSL / VDSL line speeds for various reasons but for simplicity, wireless 'g' at 54Mb/s is fine for most ADSL, wireless 'n' rated at 144, 150 or above is recomended for fibre.
Call me 'w23'
At any given moment in the universe many things happen. Coincidence is a matter of how close these events are in space, time and relationship.
Opinions expressed in forum posts are those of the poster, others may have different views.
conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

@Alex,
I was aware of those points, so thanks for raising this through provisioning. No engineer today, so maybe it's been forgotten altogether ... let's just hope that the installation has been flagged as complete on the system ...
@walker23
Interesting analysis, and one that vindicates the wires running round the house! Using your simple model, does that mean that a gigabit LAN would be needed to drive full performance when linked to a fibre WAN?
Community Veteran
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Registered: 08-01-2008

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Unfortunately I don't know the 'overhead' for ethernet but I'd be surprised if 100base ethernet was not sufficient (wireless carries a lot of overhead for the necessary security ann degrades over distance, ethernet should not have nearly so much trouble, the only thing that makes me doubt myself is that things like HH3 appear to have Gigabit WAN connections but surely if we're talking 40Mb from the internet I'd have thought 100mbit would be plenty.  Gigabit LAN is nice for internal data transfer, I can only assume thet the Gigabit WAN is 'futureproofing'
Call me 'w23'
At any given moment in the universe many things happen. Coincidence is a matter of how close these events are in space, time and relationship.
Opinions expressed in forum posts are those of the poster, others may have different views.
Superuser
Superuser
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Registered: 06-04-2007

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

FTTP can do 100MBs, which is right on the max for 100base, so maybe they have the Gigabit WAN to future proof that.
Phil
conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

So it's two days after the engineer came, and still no call from them for this supposed revisit ...  Speed tests are showing a fairly consistent 9meg down and 1.6 up. BT wholesale adsl checker says the line should carry up to 32.7 and 6.8.
Can someone from PN take a look at this, please? Thanks.
conroc00
Dabbler
Posts: 24
Registered: 02-01-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

Just to clarify, those tests are done using a wired connection!
lexusuk
Grafter
Posts: 567
Registered: 20-10-2009

Re: FTTC engineer install failure

I checked your account and it was still configured for ADSL2+ with a 10Mbps speed profile.  This has been updated to FTTC and given a 40Mbps speed profile.  This will go live within the next 30 minutes.
Upon checking the order the status is "delayed" and the installation has been retained on the Openreach side with a new engineer date of 02/09/11 AM.  As the order is technically complete I will ask our provisioning team to have the order status changed manually to "complete".