Target Downstream SNR

[#1]

If the line is banded, adjusting the SNRM with a modem that can do that will have no effect, it'll still be limited by the banding.

[#2]

Agreed but my post was in answer to the statement that VDSL modems don't offer this option.

[#3]

---

@jafreer wrote:

I read a lot of forum articles where people are stuck with banded profiles and DLM simply won't remove them (even after faults were fixed). DLM will act (often slowly) to change line conditions where errors are removed etc, but it seems with banded profiles it just gets stuck (which is crazy).

If you can get your copper fault fixed first, then you will probably have to try and convince someone to do a DLM reset. Shameful state of affairs really, and it is all because of DLMs inability to remove banding once whatever was causing it is removed.

---

This comment about banded profiles makes perfect sense. There used to be a REIN problem.....banding was applied....REIN dissapeared....DLM got stuck & won't remove the banding. Simples!

The problem with the "copper fault" is that to call an engineer out to find it could cost me £130 (the BT quote) or £65 (the amount mentioned by Plusnet) for the honour of them not finding a fault, and I can't afford that!

(Who is the abovementioned "someone"?, Plusnet?)

---

@brookheather wrote:

Many third-party routers have settings to allow you to change the SNRM - my ASUS DSL-AC68U allows you to go down to 2db with the latest firmware.

---

 I know that there are some units out there that will allow the SNRM to be changed but I've just bought my Netgear X4S D7800 which is excellent & I can't afford to waste the £180 that is cost. If I had a spare £200 I would have already called out an engineer.

---

@Chris wrote:

I'm just getting the line tested and seeing what needs doing on the fault.

Voice Line Test Result

Voice fault suspected - contact Voice CP to progress copper issue

---

The remotely instigated BT error checks found nothing. At the risk of sounding pig headed over a lack of believing that a current copper fault is the most likely cause of the 9dB SNRM (but I have been mentally scared by my earlier 11 year battle with BT over a copper fault that although they never found it did actually exist, and caused SNRM drops resulting in lower sync rates) I feel that since I have a very stable SNRM of 9.1dB min to 9.4dB max, surely asking for a DLM reset (thus avoiding the risk of a call out fee and avoiding the need to time off work to be at home) is the best way forward.

So the simple no cost no risk question is:- "Can a DLM reset be requested without an engineer visit?"

[#4]

The simple answer to your question is no, it can only be done by a visiting engineer.

For example, see https://community.plus.net/t5/Fibre-Broadband/DLM-reset/td-p/1412954

In addition, I think an engineer visiting for a voice fault wouldn't do a DLM reset, you'd need an engineer visiting on a broadband job.

[#5]

Might be a daft idea, but if you disconnect everything from the master socket, just to leave the test socket (so disconnecting any extension wiring and the router), and have PN run that line check again, it would be interesting to see if it still shows a copper fault. If it does, then that would mean it is definitely not on your property (or at least not your responsibility).

If it doesn't show a copper fault, then you can at least focus on what is causing it in your property.

[#6]

I disconnected my Truecall & telephones from the master socket & while this is only an indicative test of whether there is an equipment fault or not, the SNRM was not affected and remained at 9.1dB.
As suggested above I will see if it is possible to repeat the test that Chris from +net did at a time everything is disconnected from the master socket.

Edit 27/02/17

Why is it that the test done by Chris from +net with the timestamp 2017-02-01T15:45:00 included the result "Voice fault suspected - contact Voice CP to progress copper issue", but the tests done by +net as part of Question #143895092 on 11:42am, Friday 17 Feb 2017 and 10:54am, Monday 20 Feb 2017 did not indicate an error? One test even concluded "Speed is within estimates however Mr Ackroyd has been told this is banded - unable to see a logical reason as to why
*Needs SFI to remove banding".

What actually triggered the "Voice fault suspected" message? Is it just a default result when banding is present but no actual fault can be found?

[#7]

+net did some more testing as part of the currently open ticket and I have been told that they do not now believe that their is a copper fault.

I acknowledge that +net are in the middle regarding VDSL connection because unlike ADSL connections, they are unable to initiate a DLM reset without raising a problem with BTW. Until then, every time the DLM decides to keep the banding even after a copper fault is removed, +net cannot sort it without referring it ti BTW.

I have an engineer coming round tomorrow and I predict that (1) he will test the line and find no problems, (2) he will make a phone call to someone who will remotely initiate a DLM reset + line training period, & (3) the line will retrain itself based on a 6dB SNRM and I will get a marginally higher (estimated at 10 to 20%) sync speed once the banding is removed.

[#8]

So how did you manage to get Plusnet to arrange the presumably chargeable (to them) engineer visit, as there's no line fault?

[#9]

I was able to get a further visit, a week or so after a phone engineer had repaired a line fault but declined to DLM reset, as the resulting speed was so far below the estimate - because of a line fault it had fallen to 38M at 9dB from 50M at 6dB with a 49-65 estimate. It was also performing a daily resync in this condition.

The broadband engineer confirmed the line was clean before performing the DLM reset (by phone) and the line returned to only 43M at 6dB but with a higher ping.

A while later the line resynched to 50M at 6dB with normal ping (so it's interesting that different synchs are possible at the same SNR margin).

[#10]

I am aware it's fairly easy to get a engineer if the speed is below the low end of the estimate, regardless of any banding, however, in this case

Greenbandit wrote:

I accept that the line is within expected speeds

[#11 · Accepted solution]

---

@Greenbandit wrote:

+net did some more testing as part of the currently open ticket and I have been told that they do not now believe that their is a copper fault.

I acknowledge that +net are in the middle regarding VDSL connection because unlike ADSL connections, they are unable to initiate a DLM reset without raising a problem with BTW. Until then, every time the DLM decides to keep the banding even after a copper fault is removed, +net cannot sort it without referring it ti BTW.

I have an engineer coming round tomorrow and I predict that (1) he will test the line and find no problems, (2) he will make a phone call to someone who will remotely initiate a DLM reset + line training period, & (3) the line will retrain itself based on a 6dB SNRM and I will get a marginally higher (estimated at 10 to 20%) sync speed once the banding is removed.

---

I was correct except that the DLM reset was done just before the engineer arrived. By the time he arrived on Saturday I had a sync speed of 21.96Mbps & an SNRM of 6.1dB. Exactly what I expected.

@ejs wrote:

So how did you manage to get Plusnet to arrange the presumably chargeable (to them) engineer visit, as there's no line fault?

By being persistent, polite, logical, 6 months of logging sync rates & SNRM, and pointing out that with 3 growing up boys I needed the last I could get out of my 1.3km of copper line, and by pointing out that it is stupid that even with a 6 month history of no problems on the line +net are unable to initiate a DLM reset without arranging an Openreach engineer visit (which ended up especially stupid because the DLM reset was not done by the engineer so technically could have been initiated at any time!!!).

+net were stuck in the middle with Openreach needed an (unecessary) engineer visit before doing a DLM reset, and a customer who knew it was possible to get a faster line rate.

I have been with +net since September 1997 and I continue to be a happy customer. Let's hope that they can make it possible to do a DLM reset in the future without the need for umpteen forum posts, and a ticket that has gone on for several weeks, and 3 phone calls, and the involvement of several +net staff, and an Openreach call out fee.

[#12]

Can some kind Plusnet person do whatever test is needed to tell me what the ""profile name" of my connection now is? Pretty please.

Plusnet Chris did this on 01/02/17 but I would like to know what I have now after the DLM reset.

[#13]

---

@Greenbandit wrote:

Can some kind Plusnet person do whatever test is needed to tell me what the ""profile name" of my connection now is? Pretty please.

Plusnet Chris did this on 01/02/17 but I would like to know what I have now after the DLM reset.

---

I now have a 40/10 profile with sync speeds of 22.0/3.0 which I think is pretty good for a 1370m copper line length.

Sorted.