cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

fred5
Dabbler
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎14-08-2018

Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Hello

I just moved into a new flat. The Flat has one master socket at the door (the new sockets which include filter), and an extension socket in the living room. Can I somehow use the extension socket and attach another router or modem to it to extend wifi and make ethernet available in that room too? Otherwise I have to route a massive patch cable through the entire flat.

Thanks for your help.

 

Best regards

Fred

60 REPLIES 60
Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Welcome to the forum.

The answer is no you can't use the extension cable but there are other options. Running an Ethernet cable is best and they aren't massive. CAT5e cable is about 5mm diameter. Alternatively if you want an Ethernet cable at a distant location you could try Powerline units which transfer Ethernet over the mains. These are only reliable if the mains sockets at each end are on the same circuit, that is, one circuit breaker controls the supply to both plug in units. Also why not use wireless? USB wireless units can be used if a computer doesn't have the built in capability.

If you describe your problem in more detail additional advice will be forthcoming.

Mav
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 20,581
Thanks: 3,870
Fixes: 430
Registered: ‎06-04-2007

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Moderator's note:

Thread moved from Fibre Broadband to Everything Else.

Forum Moderator and Customer
Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain
He who feared he would not succeed sat still

fred5
Dabbler
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎14-08-2018

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Hi

Thank you for your reply. Yes they are massive its about the thickest cable you can find apart from power cables.. Powerline is not an option, too many variables the can mess up transmission. Do you mean USB wifi receiver? There is no need for that.

As I already described, this is a steel reinforced concrete building, all solid walls, not as in most other buildings here that are mostly paper inside. Each room is almost like a faraday cage, the only place the wifi can get through is the doors.

Ok, can I run a patch cable from the main router/modem through a wifi repeater in the hall way, and then into the living room into a router, so that that router can produce more ethernet connection and wifi?

Thanks for your help.

BW

Fred

Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

You only want one 'router', which should be installed next to the master socket. You can then daisy chain devices from the router from room to room or connect individual units to the router LAN ports.. You do not want any additional 'routers', in circuit, rather Access Points (AP). Some routers can be set up in access point mode. The main difference is only the router should be used to control IP addresses. If you use a couple of routers configured to AP mode in the hall and living room then that will solve your problem. 

Just be careful to select routers with an easily configurable AP mode.

fred5
Dabbler
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎14-08-2018

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Thank you for your reply. I think what you are trying to say is, I only want one "modem" which is not the same as a router. A router is just a switch, a modem does the internet, the router is just the distributor.

So you mentioned "Daisy chaining" which means there are APs that allow a cable to be run through it?

BW

Fred

Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

A router also does things like allocate IP addresses and if you use a modem in bridge mode allows you to set up your interface with the ISP, so no, I do mean router.

If you use routers in AP mode then with most you have four LAN ports, so you can use two for daisy chaining.

bmc
Aspiring Champion
Posts: 1,368
Thanks: 327
Fixes: 17
Registered: ‎28-02-2017

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

@fred5

While it's always advised to place the modem next to the master socket you should be able to use the extension instead. You might require a filter and you might loose a bit of performance.

 

Before I got FTTP I used an extension socket at the back of my house for my ADSL which was wired via an upstairs extension to the Master socket at the front.

 

Brian

Townman
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 16,946
Thanks: 7,032
Fixes: 67
Registered: ‎22-08-2007

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Hi Fred,

A warm welcome to the forums.  I feel a need to get a bit pedantic here...

  1. You can only have one modem - that might or might not be in the same unit which performs other services as well
  2. Ideal you should have only one DHCP server, but if you know what you are doing, you could have more - the DHCP server is usually co-located in the router
  3. You can have multiple routers, so long as you obey the rules above
  4. You can have switches, WiFi APs, hubs etc attached to any network point

For example, in one set up I manage, I have an Archer A3 D2 modem / router installed at the master socket, that acts as the modem, a router and the DHCP server.  Connected to that is an Ethernet over power network.

At the other end of that I have a Plusnet Hub One connected on port 4 with DHCP turned off.  The PN H1 simply acts as a router to devices connected to it via ethernet or WiFi.

 

Specifically in your situation, if the telephone extension is a quality twisted pair cable, you could place your modem / router there, so long as the extension is not connected to the filtered side of the master socket filter.  "standard" D profile phone extension cables are not suitable.

What is your concern with Ethernet over Power?  Yes there are some poor performing products out there, but there are quality ones as well, such as the Devolo range. I have a mixed network of dLan 200 and dLan 1200+ devices and they perform well - far faster than the external link.

Capture Devolo.JPG

 

fred5
Dabbler
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎14-08-2018

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Hi

Can I do the following: master socket -> router/modem (in my case plusnet hub one for fibre) -> ethernet cable -> AP for wifi -> ethernet cable -> Another router that can provide wifi and another 1-2 LAN ports for TV laptop etc.

 

BW

Fred

Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Yes but if you are going to use two routers then as Townman sats, you have to know what you are doing. That's why I recommended that you use the second router in AP mode when it becomes simply plug and play.

fred5
Dabbler
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎14-08-2018

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

Hi 

Thank you for your reply. I am aware, I never asked for another modem to be used, just another router, or switch/hub to be precise. I understand the premise of having one router in terms of providing networking rules and such. All I was wondering about was using the cable that leads to the extension somehow to avoid having to put a new cable in the floor, because i need access in that room. I will use the Master socket either way for the modem.

I did not find any Archer A3 modem, on that note, in terms of speed, does getting a different brand router/modem help at all? 

I work for an IT retailer, so I am aware of how many people bought powerline, and how many problems arise there, and how many people return them, and finally how few people still buy these. I understand if people use them if there is no other way. But you will never ever get a faster speed and reliability through powerline than through a proper dedicated ethernet cable.

BW

Fred

 

Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

@bmc

The OP's description is that there is a filtered master socket plus an extension. Logic suggests that the extension is hard wired to the filtered phone output. Hence it could not be used as a feed to the modem/router unless the master socket was rewired such that the extension was unfiltered, that is, connected to the dsl output.

Baldrick1
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 6,171
Thanks: 2,721
Fixes: 181
Registered: ‎30-06-2016

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat

You cannot use a telephone extension cable for either a WAN or LAN connection so if the modem is next to the master socket then the extension cable cannot be used. If you want to use it to move the modem then I believe that you will need to rewire the connections in the master socket.

bmc
Aspiring Champion
Posts: 1,368
Thanks: 327
Fixes: 17
Registered: ‎28-02-2017

Re: Can I use BOTH Master and Extension Socket in my Flat


@Baldrick1 wrote:

@bmc

The OP's description is that there is a filtered master socket plus an extension. Logic suggests that the extension is hard wired to the filtered phone output. Hence it could not be used as a feed to the modem/router unless the master socket was rewired such that the extension was unfiltered, that is, connected to the dsl output.


You may be right - I don't have the technical knowledge to dispute. I do know that when I changed my faceplates years ago I had to be careful how I rewired the master socket / extensions.

 

However, there's no harm in trying if the modem in the extension would save having to lay an ethernet cable. If it works fine. If not then it would be back to the drawing board.

 

Brian