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Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

SlyOne
Hooked
Posts: 5
Thanks: 2
Registered: ‎18-08-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Maybe a comment from the Plusnet staff to confirm this is the actual problem, as they claim above to have identified the issue, but have given no details.  While @Townman presents a plausible hypothesis the logs would be required to validate that google are actually rejecting messages, and for what reason.  If Plusnet staff can actually provide details, that would give more evidence to present to Google, if they need to modify their policies.

SlyOne
Hooked
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Registered: ‎18-08-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

I changed it

Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 13,047
Thanks: 4,337
Fixes: 26
Registered: ‎22-08-2007

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

“Can the admins please give some detail on what the actual problem is. There are lots of theories and claims from non support staff, but I see little evidence to support their claims. The responses from the staff give no detail at all.

1. The “theory” is based on observance of multiple tests. Sending using @Username.plus.com and @mydomain.com to both free and paid for Google email accounts.

Plusnet systems do not ‘behave’ differently for any of the above variations, therefore the differing behaviour MUST be with Google. That is not something one commercial organisation is going to state publicly against another. Google have a Q&A on this which largely talks about measures ‘bulk’ senders might do to improve delivery. Whilst such measures are laudable, they are not mandatory and therefore acting as though they are is, shall we say, unhelpful on the part of Google.

Further given that @mydomain.com used as the from email address with the PlusNET service works without issue, whereas @Username.plus.com does not, somewhat looks like Google is treating *.plus.com as a single sending domain ... which is entirely wrong.

A fix for this needs to come from Google, rather than mitigation measures implemented by all inbound mail services - not just Plusnet’s.
SlyOne
Hooked
Posts: 5
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Registered: ‎18-08-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

I agree with everything you said, the hypothesis seems reasonable, and your tests are extensive. I would still like to have some confirmation from Plusnet Admins to validate your tests, as they will be in possession of significantly more evidence that can be presented to Google.  Their log messages that should state the specific reasons for any connection failures, rather than having to infer them from user tests.  Google is a massive company, they will not lift a finger without robust evidence. The best way to remedy the situation if it is as you describe is for Plusnet to raise the issue on behalf of the many people suffering from the problem. 

Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 2,370
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Registered: ‎29-09-2011

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

There is work that we can do to help this issue and we're looking at that now. The problem is is that we won't know if it works, until its deployed as its not our equipment we cant just test it.

 

 

 

I never like to give timescales for these things because a lot depends on testing but I wouldn't expect this until at least October.

 Jono H
 Plusnet Community Manager
VH
Newbie
Posts: 2
Thanks: 1
Registered: ‎18-08-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

 

 

October? That is quite shocking but thank you for being honest as requested.  It is clear from other comments on this topic that many people rely on their Plusnet email for famlily communication. I use and recommend Plusnet because of its good customer service and you need to put yourselves across the puddle on this one.

You need to publicise the issue more widely - many of your less confident users will think that the problem is of their making. It should be on the Service Status page with suggested work arounds, such as setting up a different email account, in the simplest possible language

Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 13,047
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Registered: ‎22-08-2007

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Or get on the back of Google - the evidence is very clear that this is an issue of their making.

Note that the Plusnet comment is “work which might help” - that is mitigation of the issue created by Google - but until implemented there’s no certainty.
Wombat77
Dabbler
Posts: 13
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Registered: ‎12-07-2017

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

No, you are not the only one. Same problem with me too.

Just to add to the information piling up against Google, I ran a test on Sunday last (19th). An email from my Plus net email to my Gmail account took 8hours 32mins to arrive. Sent at 10.07 and arrived at 18.39

Consequently I am not using my Plus net email address until I read that the problem is sorted. Hardly a service you would recommend to a friend is it.

SlyOne
Hooked
Posts: 5
Thanks: 2
Registered: ‎18-08-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Specifically what is the actual technical cause of the issue?  You only ever refer to it in the woolliest of terms.  We can see the symptoms, but specifically what is the cause?  Assume I am a highly trained IT professional.  I need specific details if I am to raise the issue with Google.

Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 13,047
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Registered: ‎22-08-2007

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Specifically Google do not say what the problem is.  They do though point to specific OPTIONAL spam mitigation configuration items which they suggest might help address such delays … HOWEVER there are more than a few reports on the Gmail help forum of domains having those OPTIONAL items configured and they STILL experience delays.

I have raised an update on one such help item, pointing to this forum post.

 

 

 

Superuser
Superuser
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Registered: ‎22-08-2007

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

The feedback from on the Google support forum (not from a Google rep) states...

Google require SPF, DMARC, DKIM, and PTR.

I have responded that Google has no remit to require anything which is not mandatory, besides which the evidence does not stack up to this being a clearly enforced constraint.

sirjestalot
Grafter
Posts: 25
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Registered: ‎08-09-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

I too have been experiencing delays in email getting to Gmail addresses.  A friend on Gmail sent me the full headers from one of my delayed messages, and analysis of these headers strongly implies that Gmail are blacklisting one or more of Plusnet's SMTP servers. I've attached a sample screenshot from a recent such incident.  Having worked as an email tech support person (now retired), I know from experience that blacklisting usually occurs when an organisations' servers get used as spam relays or when an account is compromised and used to send bulk spam.

Superuser
Superuser
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Registered: ‎06-04-2007

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Welcome to the forums and thanks for that analysis. Smiley

It seems to be sender email addresses that gmail is greylisting rather than the servers. Gmail doesn't delay messages sent through the same servers using a personal domain address, nor if sent to a business (paid for) gmail account.

Plusnet work on a fix for this has been on hold for the new billing system roll out - hopefully should be getting under way again now.

David
sirjestalot
Grafter
Posts: 25
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Registered: ‎08-09-2018

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

Hi,

Thanks for the welcome.   I'm not entirely convinced about the greylisting theory though.  To the best of my knowledge, greylisting only happens with new sender addresses, and I've been sending email from my Plusnet account to my friend's Gmail address regularly for many years, so I'm hardly a new user :-)

I wrote an article about greylisting at my former place of work, here:

http://www.sussex.ac.uk/its/help/faq?faqid=2428

Glad that the folks at Plusnet are on the case though.  I'm still experiencing delays (two sent today not yet delivered), so it'll be very welcome news when this issue is resolved.

barcud
Dabbler
Posts: 20
Thanks: 2
Registered: ‎05-11-2014

Re: Mail delivery to recipients taking 5hrs plus

So,

If I have read your Sussex faq correctly, sirjestalot, I have been sending email from my same plusnet address to the same gmail address from the same IP address for several years at least. My emails are being held up for up to 2 days in one case recently.

Therefore, not greylisting then.