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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

With all the problems we have had since its introduction did no one think to talk to the customers about a choice ?

Im not interested in the fact I can download 100gb overall, I am not happy about the 20gb restriction between 8am -Midnight . I become worried about exceeding this and being put on a management system. I am not happy about the number of nights ruined by un-acceptable pings thanks to a management system that couldnt distinguish WoW game packets from P2P packets (hell only 5.6 million ppl play it). Even now many months on gamers are still posting and PN are still acknowledging problems.

So why not introduce capped schemes as well that are un-managed, seems everytime a new game comes online we have to wait for PN to find out that the system isnt distinguishing the packets and wait for them to fix it.

Give me a 30gig flat scheme at a reasonable price and Ill take it,
37 REPLIES
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

Isn't the challenge for PN to control peak time usage?
Someone using 100GB but only overnight is probably less of a problem than someone downloading 20GB in peak time.
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

A capped scheme would still control peak time usage, especially if they didnt offer anything bigger than 30gb.
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,345
Thanks: 600
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

A flat scheme for 30GB would be around £40 - is that the amount you'd be prepared to pay?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

Why £40 ? The others arent.

Zen £34.99... 50GB limit
http://www.zenbroadband.com/athome.aspx
Nildram £25.99.. 50GB+unlimited off peak
http://broadband.nildram.net/view_products.php?group=broadband2
F2S £24.99 "unlimited"
http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/homeuser.php?pcat=m
Hi Velocity £25.20 .. 50GB limit
http://www.hi-velocity.net/xhtml/order.html

None of these have traffic management that I know of either, so why cant PN offer something in that line ?
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

Simply put, thats not Plus nets business model and its not where they want to be.

Plus Net have and are building the network around sustainable products which suit the vast majority of their customers, based on the information which is available to them and married with the usage of the vast majority of customers.

Plus net are not the same as these other isp's, simple as that and thats why their products are different.

BTW, gary, check your PM's Smiley
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,345
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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None of these have traffic management that I know of either, so why cant PN offer something in that line ?

Nobody will be able to offer clean connections and 8MB speeds for those sort of prices.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
N/A

Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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None of these have traffic management that I know of either, so why cant PN offer something in that line ?

Nobody will be able to offer clean connections and 8MB speeds for those sort of prices.


They are since they are capped (apart from Nildram) and since the first 8 meg exhanges go live very shortly with the rest like mine soon to follow the packages stand. HV and Zen have just introduced their packages too.

As pcsni has stated its obviously not in PNs model, well they obviously dont want gamers or those other ppl where their TM systems are clearly a problem for time sensitive applications.
Well with ppl leaving it will at least stave off the need to purchase that extra pipe that started all this in the first place last year.
I want a clean service during the day with low pings, not the ability to download gb's overnight. I agreed with PN when they wanted to remove those ppl downloading at full max 24/7, I didnt realise that it would affect the service the way it did and the sad thing is it was apparent neither did they. Ben Brown telling us that we were basically talking out of our butts because he could clearly see there was nothing wrong with their service even though the WoW threads were repeatedly reaching limits and needing to be locked and re-started.
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

PAYG should be a pretty clean service and may be worth investigating.
If the Traffic Management was working properly then users shouldn't have any problems with time-critical traffic such as gaming, they just haven't got it working properly yet IMHO.
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
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Registered: 04-04-2007

Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

The big problem with setting just a hard cap on data is what happens when your central pipes max out from people using their allowance at the same time?

The answer is ping spikes and packet loss across all protocols. You don't just see a bit of slow down on P2P and Usenet, all traffic grinds to a halt. With up to 8Mbps speeds it only takes 7 or 8 customers on quiet exchanges using Usenet at the same time to max out an LTS that should be carrying 2,000 connections.

A cap does nothing either to encourage off peak downloading. The way we are designing the network and products is to encourage the use of large downloads to the off peak hours to give the performance at peak time to the applications that need real time performance.
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

A hard cap would have been very shortsighted and not helped create a sustainable platform and would, as Dave has covered, give rise to a variety of problems.
Unfortunatley something isn't right yet with the system PlusNet have implemented as at peak times many people are still experiencing the ping spikes and lagginess on http and gaming traffic (amongst others) that are are often signs of an overloaded (or otherwise broken) network.
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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A cap does nothing either to encourage off peak downloading. The way we are designing the network and products is to encourage the use of large downloads to the off peak hours to give the performance at peak time to the applications that need real time performance.


gaming needs real time performance and im not getting it. to make matters worse if you raise a support ticket you receive responses that are little more than insults to your intelligence.. 'i play counterstrike and my pings are fine....' unbelievable.. i just cant be bothered anymore
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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None of these have traffic management that I know of either, so why cant PN offer something in that line ?

Nobody will be able to offer clean connections and 8MB speeds for those sort of prices.


That's simply not true. Bulldog offer 8mb uncapped for £20/month... No packet shaping...that's why I have switched to them Smiley
Community Veteran
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Registered: 10-04-2007

Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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That's simply not true. Bulldog offer 8mb uncapped for £20/month... No packet shaping...that's why I have switched to them Smiley


I presume you are talking about LLU.

LLU operators have far more control of their costs as they are not bound by the prices forced on BT by OFCOM. From what I've seen, anyone on an exchange with LLU should seriously consider switching - but for everyone else what I said I think is true.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
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Why didnt PN introduce a cap rather than traffic shaping ?

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The big problem with setting just a hard cap on data is what happens when your central pipes max out from people using their allowance at the same time?


Two obvious responses to this one. Firstly as people's billing dates are spread throughout the month then you shouldn't get a surge like that. Secondly in the situation where you DO get a surge then you simply point out that it's a contended service so you'll only see the full 8Mbits (or whatever your line can handle) when there's capacity to spare. You might want to put QoS hardware in place for gaming/VoIP but the result is much less obtrusive than the current overly complex AUP/SUP/Clean-to combinations.