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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Plusnet, as we know, have a stupidly low bandwidth usage cap now on their products. It gets worse year on year basically.

If I am paying for "up to 15GB" usage per month (with throttling starting at 10GB) then I should be allowed to have it back if I don't use it all up one month.

If I go into a garage and buy 15 litres of fuel, if my car then sits on my drive for the next month...you don't see BP turning up and syphoning the unused fuel back out of my tank do youHuh No, that fuel will carry over for me.

Why then doesn't my bandwidth that I have purchased roll over for me into the next month if I choose not to use it all at once??

It's already stupid that throttling comes in at 10GB - does my car get capped at 30mph when the tank is on 1/4 full? NO !!
19 REPLIES
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

The thing is, the bandwidth is budgeted on a monthly basis. So if some people hadn't used much bandwith with the rest rolling over to the next month, then this would cause problems.
craign
Grafter
Posts: 122
Registered: 01-08-2007

Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

The way that PN sell bandwidth means that the analogy with fuel is incorrect. From their pov, bandwith is not a lump of something you buy and can keep in a cupboard. It is transient. If you do not use 30% of your bandwidth in a month, the 'Internet' capacity does not save that 30% for you to use later.

To keep the motoring theme, I'd suggest your monthly allowance is more like a toll to use a bridge. Each month you can cross the bridge up to 30 times. If you don't cross the bridge in a month then your 30 crossings don't carry over to the next because there is no spare capacity on that bridge.

Why isn't the bridge bigger? Unlike your mobile phone where unused minutes do carry over, the Internet is not owned by one company. Vodafone owns its own bridge. PN owns a toll booth on the Internet bridge.

Why only 15Gb not 30Gb? That's a PN marketing decision based on its technical investment and the number of customers it wants to attract/detract(?).

To answer your last point, if your petrol gauge is reading almost empty, I'd suggest you would restrict your driving style to a more economic speed to get to the next petrol station.
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Ok, it's a troll, but I'll bite.

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If I am paying for "up to 15GB" usage per month (with throttling starting at 10GB) then I should be allowed to have it back if I don't use it all up one month.


It's up to 15GB. Do you expect to get a refund on your tax and insurance if you're not out on the road 24/7?

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does my car get capped at 30mph when the tank is on 1/4 full?


No. It stops when it's empty. If PlusNet suppled your petrol they'd make you drive efficiently when you're running out and you'd still get you home even if you ran out completely.

And while we're at it: we all know by now PlusNet pay BT for the amount of data used. So for all those 15GB accounts PlusNet have worked out a likely monthly average (ie somewhat less than 15GB), added in their other costs and profit, and set a montly rate. If you start increasing the average by allowing allowances to roll-over then the rates will have go up.

If you don't like the idea that some months you won't beat the averages then PlusNet have thoughtfully provided PAYG as well, which may suit you better.
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,339
Thanks: 595
Fixes: 8
Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

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It's already stupid that throttling comes in at 10GB - does my car get capped at 30mph when the tank is on 1/4 full? NO !!


If I'm on the motorway and I've got two gallons of petrol left and the next services is 60 miles do I hammer along at 80+ or do I ease back to reduce my consumption to make sure I get to the services with fuel to spare?

Plusnet do the easing back for you once you pass 10GB.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Lots of silly remarks in here. lol Tongue

If Nildram can do it, I am sure PlusNet can but they obviously not caught on yet. Fact is, all these caps and so on were brought in with so much speed and such little thought they probably didnt think alot of things through heh.

Maybe its something we can see in the future, that would be a better question. "Will PlusNet allow bandwidth rollover in the future?" Wink

Mobile phones do it, thats a technology based on bandwidth. Not sure about Skype but I bet it has something similar.

Comparing to a car is completely different as cars dont use bandwidth lol. They use fuel and its not renewable whereas bandwidth is. The differences are huge and comparing across such a wide scale gets the above posts ^ probably the truth but really pointless posts lol
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

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Comparing to a car is completely different as cars dont use bandwidth lol. They use fuel and its not renewable whereas bandwidth is


Actually, the analogy is pretty good. The more petrol a garage sells the more they buy from their wholesaler and the bigger their bills. Similarly, the more data an ISP handles the more they pay BT. No matter that petrol is not renewable - as far as the petrol station is concerned they can buy as much or as little as they like from their supplier.

Where they differ, of course, is how they sell to you the customer. The garage charges per litre - very much the PAYG equivalent. Now imagine that the garage decided to offer another option: all the petrol you need, for a fixed monthly amount. It is still paying its supplier by the litre but the garage stays in business so long as it gets enough in the monthly payments to cover all the petrol it is giving to all its customers.

Suppose, then, that a few of the customers start getting monster trucks and more and more opportunities to use them and they demand more petrol. Suddenly the garage is losing money on these customers, but it stays in business because it's making enough money from the others. But as more and more people get monster trucks it will have to do something or go bust. So what should it do? It could set a maximum monthly amount, raise the monthly fee or revert to pay-per-litre only. (PlusNet is offering you the choice of all three for you to choose from.)
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 12,169
Thanks: 18
Fixes: 1
Registered: 04-04-2007

Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Hi,

The idea of rollover bandwidth is an interesting one, and I won't say it's never likely to happen, but it isn't something in the project stack.

The way our products are designed is ensure that everyone has a fair share of the bandwidth at peak times, off peak doesn't matter so much because by definition it's off peak, but peak times dictate the bandwidth requirements and thus how many centrals are required.

If in a month you don't use all the 10GB of bandwidth that bandwidth doesn't just magically appear the next month, it was budgeted for and paid for in the first month.

To create my own analogy here, it's more akin to a rail pass. You buy a monthly rail pass that allows you to make so many journeys in that month but for some reason choose to just make one trip, the next month you have to but a new pass because the journeys don't roll over to the next.
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

The rollover idea has a lot of merit, in that in any given month only say 70 % will use the full amount, then 30% won't. If you let them carry over for one month then most still won't use it and some of the 70% full users will conserve so that they can carry over to the next month. So on average total bandwidth usage will not alter very much at all, but quite a few people will be happier.

It won't affect me though as I'm PAYG :lol:
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Well, regardless of the analogy, I'd still like to see a rollover - especially as the caps are so tight these days.
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Enough with the analogies already.
Their getting sillier and sillier, cars that only do 30mph providing that they are being driven over a narrow bridge by a driver who has a rail pass that he doesn't use, except when the journey is more than 80 miles of motorway and his fuel tank has no more than 2 gallons or is less than 1/4 full (which ever is the least)., always assuming that (1) the fuel was sold to him by petrol station that gets a good deal from their supplier (2) the said driver has not claimed a refund on his road tax and insurance for the previous 30 days. (3) both Beethoven and the lottery have rolled over till the next month.
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

*applauds paul*

The first 4 letters of the word spells out exactly what it is for discussion. It just avoids the real subject matter.

I would really love to know why it cannot be done, or rather why it is not in the "project stack". As Big D T said above, " it was budgeted for and paid for in the first month". If this is the only way an ISP can do business with BT how do Nildram manage to do it?

They use a "only previous month" policy, so you cant stock up 1000s of GB over a matter of months. The last month on the books is what governs any additional bandwidth you receive. If PN did this, they could even cap it to a max carried-over to 10GB, surely the difference it makes wont be that detrimental.

I think it is more detrimental telling folk to make sure they use all their bandwidth before the next month arrives because they lose it all. Obviously you are not doing this directly but I know if I had a cap to work at, I would work at it and hit it every month so I know I am getting what I pay for.

If it is something the community thinks is a good idea I would like to know what in the "project stack" is more important than what the customers want. Wink
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Comparing with Nildram or others is pretty pointless these days - each firm has a different business plan, they're commercially sensitive as to how they feel the policies they adopt are workable, but they perhaps all count on the average use being well below the limits they set. If you cannot get what you want from PN, then consider a switch, but it looks like the allowances for Premier are well in excess of other ISP limits, overall, just that "peak hour" limits are giving some users some grief.

When comparing with Nildram, did you see that if you exceed the limit you get your traffic calmed down to 64 kbps... that's back to ISDN level, by heck!

Every time I read a comment that someone uses about 3 GB a month, I just assume they have lots more going on in their life, and internet use seems low, until I see stats from Plus.Net about 50% or more of BB plus are using under 1 GB a month, and on Premier, under 5 GB whereas I'm on th PAYG 10 GB/19.99 account and 15 days in, I've used 5.5 GB, so clearly I'm a comparatively heavy user (and traffic of 75 GB one month on BB Plus was quite a busy month, of course, given hardly any of it was Usenet and none was peer-to-peer!)

Why the rambling comment ? Because the business plan for PN doesn't, at the moment, include any "carry forward". It doesn't include lots of things, really, and does include other things which aren't always available from other ISPs. Fortunately, we have plenty of choices and can switch...
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

Well if the community dont want it then it doesnt matter does it. Although I thought residential customers would like this. Yes people could just switch to Nildram, alot have and still are.

Although I disagree that comparing ISPs is pointless, pretty much all of them have the same products as they are all based on BT backend. So anything to do with this side of things is possible.

I agree that if people want more usage they should upgrade, but you have to remember alot of users had higher usage allowances before changes were made to their contract. A rollover scheme may make them feel less sour about the whole thing.
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Why Doesn't Usage Rollover?

I am under the impression that PN buys the bandwidth up front for a given month?
If that is the case, then it shows why bandwidth isn't rolled over - PN would have to buy the bandwidth they project a need for in month one, but then in month two, they have to buy the same bandwidth, plus whatever has been rolled over.
For some of us who only use around 1GB per month, this would mean that PN would have to always buy almost twice the bandwidth they do now - and that would mean increased costs for us - the consumers.

eg.
10 people with 15GB allowance. Monthly usage 1GB per month.
Month one PN have to buy 150GB Bandwidth.
Each account rolls 14GB over - 140GB
Month two PN have to buy 290GB.
Who pays?

If we assume that the majority of users use less than their monthly allowance, you can see how the costs can escalate massively for PN.

But this only works out if PN do pay up front - if not then surely we would all be better off on PAYG style billing - then there is no need for rollover, those who don't use much get it cheaper, those who want more, get the opportunity to buy more.
If the pricing is currently based on 10-15GB use per month, then surely nobody could complain at the thought of paying more to go above that, especially since in previous months if they had used very little bandwidth, they wouldn't have paid for it - any "rollover" would be done in their own bank, and effectively can be stored and used at any time in the future.