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Peer to Peer argument

AndyR
Grafter
Posts: 51
Registered: 07-08-2007

Peer to Peer argument

Please try to read all of this article

http://www.rawflow.com/pdfs/sector_report_p2p_july_2006.pdf

It states that the future of downloading large video files is, at present, best utilised by P2P.

This gives a headache to some ISPs, from the forum PlusNet.

If you have paid for your torrent on a legal site then it should be allowed to be downloaded via P2P as expected, should it not.

I am also annoyed at the P2P throttling going on - even at off peak times. The usage graphs are not detailed enough to see how much spare capacity is available - off peak.

Working shifts I am able to a lot of P2P off peak, in the morning 0800 to 1300 ish. Nights is very difficult to time anything due to my wife insisting that the router is switched off, but during the morning when I would like to download, I now find that the fast ISP recommended is altering the Plus points that I used when selecting PlusNet.

Turn off the Ellacoya software for one week and see how the forum reacts.

regards

Andy
43 REPLIES
N/A

Peer to Peer argument

I imagine its done because it would be difficult to differentiate between a legal torrent, and an illegal one, its not just that though, its because so much bandwidth is used by the torrents, general everyday browsing etc etc, gets sucked down by it.
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Peer to Peer argument

I've never had a single problem browsing or downloading or streaming when there were no restrictions...well apart from the usual crappy Plusnet inability to operate as an good ISP.
Firejack
Grafter
Posts: 921
Registered: 26-06-2007

Peer to Peer argument

While I understand why there has to be a need for traffic management. I have always found it bizarre Plus.net doesn't let the customer decide how they use their bandwidth allowance.

I find it unforgivable that Plus.net punish everyone for the Internet habits of a few taking more then their fair share.

Common sense is called for here. Remove all but the most necessary traffic management systems from the network and introduce firm caps that clearly explain why your connection is being throttled. 100Kb/sec is still more then suitable for general usage.
Alecto
Grafter
Posts: 2,886
Registered: 30-07-2007

Peer to Peer argument

jack, you refer to some taking more than their "fair share". This is inaccurate. The limits on how much we can use are set by plusnet, and they take firm action against anyone who tries to exceed them. But even within those limits, traffic is so heavily managed as to make the connection very poor indeed. Anyone who wants to do more than a bit of email and browsing is being "punished" as you call it.

Sadly, they now have so many customers for their relatively small capacity that the "management" they are now applying IS the bare minimum. Your suggestion therefore is unworkable.
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Peer to Peer argument

not saying this relates to you, but in my experience of the net going back to 1996 the majority of transmission of big files between users is of illegal copyrighted matearial, to my mind peer to peer should be blocked totally, it's in effect theft and should be controlled as such.
Alecto
Grafter
Posts: 2,886
Registered: 30-07-2007

Peer to Peer argument

pause for tirade by downloaders of Linux distros and other legitimate users of P2P (which I think is actually quite an efficient way of distributing a lot of data to a lot of people).

I think your argument is a bit like saying that anything that can be used for illegal purposes should be banned. And that is just about everything.

And anyway, the villains will always stay one step ahead of the law.

But then you're entitled to your view.
Firejack
Grafter
Posts: 921
Registered: 26-06-2007

Peer to Peer argument

gpattison -- Its not unworkable at all. Plus.net simply need to lower the bandwidth cap to something they can support on the network. Be it 50GB, 100GB or whatever.
Plus.net are caught in psychology of the situation. They know from a marketing point of view if they start advertising 50GB/month bandwidth allowance for £21.99 people will go elsewhere. Other ISP's are offering something they can't deliver so Plus.net does the same and has these huge limits that are totally unrealistic.
I'd settle to pay £21.99 a month for 50GB transfer without restrictions. Not happy about that fact but there is no option until the UK infrastructure is updated to meet the demands now placed on it.

gentesla -- That is such a ridiculous statement. Many of us use Bittorrent for legal purposes. It is the best way of distributing large files to multiple people. This is the only option many people have as its so expensive to have large files hosted on the Internet for you.
Alecto
Grafter
Posts: 2,886
Registered: 30-07-2007

Peer to Peer argument

but jack, my man, the limit is already well below the figures you mention.
Between 8am and midnight, you can use 13GB on premier before getting managed even more, and less than that before getting the threatening letter. And with current speeds, it would be hard to do that.

I'll say it again, they simply do not have the capacity for everyone to do more than browse and email a bit. Perhaps there is a bit of slack at 4a.m. but that's it.

If they took off the restrictions, and everybody tried to get even 10GB, the whole thing would grind to a halt. They have too many customers and not enough capacity. Lots of money coming in, not too much going out. Wonderful.
Firejack
Grafter
Posts: 921
Registered: 26-06-2007

Peer to Peer argument

The limit of 13GB is for Peak times between 4pm to midnight, not 8am to midnight. And I'm talking in total. Not on peak only. So 50GB/month on and off peak.

http://www.plus.net/support/broadband/network/traffic_management.shtml
Alecto
Grafter
Posts: 2,886
Registered: 30-07-2007

Peer to Peer argument

Sorry, got my times wrong.
But the problem is that people won't space out their usage evenly throughout the day. They all want to go on at the same time, so to give everyone xGB, you've got to allow for them all to be downloading flat out at up to 8Mb at the same time.
And because Pn has so very little capacity, it gets clogged up that much quicker.
If it were feasible, they'd do it. And 50GB in peak time costs them more than £22 if they have to provide it all al the same time.

Oh well. G'night all.
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Peer to Peer argument

Quote
not saying this relates to you, but in my experience of the net going back to 1996 the majority of transmission of big files between users is of illegal copyrighted matearial, to my mind peer to peer should be blocked totally, it's in effect theft and should be controlled as such.


I am a genuine (yes really!) Linux user and play with distros for work and play. The software is made freely available and would be more freely available if the publishers who have put in the hard work didn't have to consider supporting hundreds or thousands of http or ftp downloads. I don't condone the illegal use of p2p, but it is a fantastic distibuted delivery mechanism.

p2p will become the future of legal distribution as its the only way a movie, show or a piece of software can be offered to a large number of users who WANT IT NOW!
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Peer to Peer argument

Quote
to my mind peer to peer should be blocked totally, it's in effect theft and should be controlled as such.


There are one HELL of a lot of programs out there that are ONLY distributed by P2P, skybybroadband is one off the top of my head. Which is perfectly legal, therefore not theft. Just because you do not use it personally, does not mean it should not be allowed Wink Wink
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Peer to Peer argument

Quote
to my mind peer to peer should be blocked totally, it's in effect theft and should be controlled as such.


...oh yeah, because downloading via http is so much more legal. There is someone at work who sells copied dvd's.. lets go and cut his hands off!
manero
Grafter
Posts: 67
Registered: 21-08-2007

Peer to Peer argument

Quote
the majority of transmission of big files between users is of illegal copyrighted matearial, to my mind peer to peer should be blocked totally, it's in effect theft and should be controlled as such.


congratulations - even though you are a fool - PN loves you...