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Packet loss

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Packet loss

Hi, I have been on LLU for almost 7 weeks now. In that time ive had pretty constant 24/7 packet loss from 4% to 50%+. This is absolutely unacceptable. Yet even after 7 weeks still no answers are forthcoming from plusnet about the cause of this or timescale to fix the problem. It seems the guys who look after PN's network systems are totally ineffective at their jobs. I would have been sacked by now for such ineptitude.
I want to know if others are sufferring the same troubles as me with packet loss. If you are sufferring low speeds, lag spikes or general poor internet get over to www.l8nc.comand start a 1 second ping test on your connection, then in this thread post a link to your graphs. Lets make PN actually do something about this instead of brushing it under the carpet.
It doesnt matter if you are on ipstream, ipstream max or LLU. If you suspect packet loss start a test and find out just how well your connection is performing. Please if you know your connection type then also include that information.
Lets collate as much info on this packet loss issue as possible and make plusnet see its a real bad problem.
When I have no packet loss I get speeds approaching 4M but with packet loss evident im lucky to get above isdn type speeds.
Yesterday from about 8pm to 8am I had no packet loss virtually but from 8am this morning its as bad as ever. This is the first complete respite from packet loss in over 7 weeks yet PN say they have made no alterations to my connection and I havent either so it seems to me that one or more of the routers in PN or Tiscali circuits are underspecified for the job they are doing and are recieving far more pavckets than they can actually deal with and so some get dropped.
here ill start things off. This is my graph here....
http://www.l8nc.com/graph.php?jid=33ce8c29e5eedfed6de238ec9ef245e0
I am at present on LLU but will be moving back to IPStream sometime in next day or three. Trouble was on speaking with support they tell me that back to ipstream for me means i get maxxed when i asked for 1M fixed as I had before LLU. For some reason yesterday morning my minimum latencies halved leading me to believe that I have already been maxxed yet PN insist im still on LLU but can offer no explanation whatsoever for the sudden halving of latency and extra 1.5M sync speed.Seems to me yet more ineptitude. Interleaving has clearly been turned off on my line and sync speeds have clearly risen yet PN says no changes have happened. Are they clueless or lieing? Also snr now hovers around 6db instead of 12db. All this points to max. So it seems I have packet loss on both llu and max.
Come on PN give us some answers. Tell us what you have found to be the cause of the extreme packet loss. Packet loss over 2% is a problem, im gettoing 4-50%+. For gods sake look into it properly and stop just thinking I am on an impaired line.
I know Im not the only one affected by this, so if you are speak up. We must get PN to deal with this issue as a matter of utmost importance. 7 Weeks of an unusable connection is too much.
When i complained of this and kept posting graphs in my ticket it got mysteriously closed and I cant find it in the closed tickets section or anywhere. I need a printout of that ticket so I can write to PN and OFCOM and if no joy from PN start small claims court proceedings to get at the very least my last two months subscriptions back + costs of more than several 90 minute + phonecalls to their support line.
Stop screwing your customers PN and actually listen. Ive told you since day 1 that the packet loss was causing the low speeds and my line was fine but you didnt listen. Tweaking LLU settings did nothing. Didnt that tell you anything? I asked about 10 times to go back to 1M ipstream so you max me? What is wrong with your ears and are you all illiterate?
17 REPLIES
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Packet loss

 
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Packet loss

you have to turn on public access and post your public link.
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Packet loss

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Packet loss

Strange. Had nearly a full weekend of a good connection. Virtually 0 % packet loss and 3.5M speeds. This morning from about 8am bad packet loss returns. I read a note that said PN are sorry for causing the poor speeds on LLU, it was caused by a configuration issue at one of their core routers. Oh my what have I been telling you for weeks, and your reply is weve checked and alls well. Well alls not well and for me the speed issue not resolved. Im still getting packet loss. Sure you tease me for a whole weekend with a good conn, but today back to usual rubbish. When will my ipstream move go thru. Im sick of this.
look....
Link1

Link2

Link3
Link 4

Link 5
Link 6
And so on....
Until.....
Link
Link
Link
and finally....
So far today....
Link

Isnt it about time this was fixedHuh This is really dragging on now!

[Moderator's note by Mark (pcsni): Large images changed to offsite links as they were way to big and stretched the page]
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Packet loss

Hmmm, I don't know which I'd prefer. Constant packet loss, or no connection whatsoever at times:

Link1
Link2
Link3

At least PN have said they are looking into it.

[Moderator's note by Mark (pcsni): Large images changed to offsite urls as they were stretching the page badly.]
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Packet loss

Well as a gamer, constant packet loss for me might as well mean I dont have any connection. The connection that I do have is totally unusable. Takes many refreshes just to see a webpage in its entirety, you can imagine how playing online MMORPG's must be.
Community Gaffer
Community Gaffer
Posts: 12,807
Thanks: 636
Fixes: 62
Registered: 04-04-2007

Packet loss

haydon449,

You are back on IPStream. I can see no reference to the agent advising that you weren't but you definately are.

Are you still wanting to be moved to a fixed rate product? I've updated your account details so support don't make the same mistake again (thinking you were still on LLU).

Drop me a PM if I can be of any help.

Regards,

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Products Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

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Packet loss

If you cant fix the packet loss issues then yes put me back to 1M fixed but over the weekend I had what can only be called glorious internet. Look at the graphs for the weekend, they still show a little bit of packet loss but this is within what I would consider normal retransmissions, but look at todays graph. That is unacceptable packet loss. So please tell me whats causing that? You find the root cause and fix it we will all be very happy.
I noticed the other day as you will see in my ticket, that I was maxxed, well I thought I had been, as sync speed went up by a whole 1M, snr averaged 6db not 12db at first connection and my latency halved obviously due to interleaving no longer being on but I rang up the support team to be told that no I hadnt been maxxed as was definately still on LLU. So really not sure whats been going on. I know over weekend net was acceptable to good. Played games all day, had very little lag in general, no lagouts at all, good stable pings and blazingly fast net compatred to what I am used to. First impressions of max seem good, but today at 8am packet loss started again and has been constant throughout the day. What is causing this packet loss? Whay have I had close to zero packet loss for whole weekend and now from 8am monday morning back to the usual rubbish? Why wasnt my ticket updated to tell me for sure my connection had been moved back?
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packet loss for so far today....
Link
So this is on max? Whats causing this? This is definately abnormal packet loss. I want/need a connection I can trust and have confidence in. This dont seem to be it at the moment. Please try track down the cause of the packet loss because when no packet loss the connection is the stuff of dreams.

[Moderator's note by Mark (pcsni): Large image changed to offsite url as it was stretching the page and making it difficult to read]
carrot63
Grafter
Posts: 599
Registered: 12-07-2007

Packet loss

Apologies if I'm talking total rubbish here (I know close to zero about packet loss etc), but looking through your graphs the obvious thing that sticks out is the timing. The packet loss starts at 8 each morning, finishes at 5.30 and has the weekend off. Could this be a line quality issue caused by a local business running close to you, using heavy machinery or a dodgy neon strip or something that is kicking out dirty static? Some faulty bit of gear in the exchange that is switched on when they start work?

I mention it because I used to live at the end of a long and very bodged phone line (not in the UK), and all of a sudden we used to more or less lose the connection at the same time every evening from dusk till midnight or so. It turned out to be a new (and dodgy) neon sign on a local shop sitting 6 feet from the phone line. The line was later moved and the problem went away.

I suppose with ADSL you might expect a lower SNR or higher attenuation.
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That would explain the later graphs, but not the earlier ones which are pretty much 24/7. It is strange how it didn't happen at all over the weekend though.

Maybe it would be a good idea to see if it clears up again for this weekend, and if it does, start tracing the telephone cable, or tell BT to do so.
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I did consider that it could be something like that but there really isnt any set pattern to it. Today had in excess of 50% packet loss from 3.30am - 7.20am then from 7.20am to 5.30pm packet loss has been pretty constant 5-20%.From 5.30 pm til now, almost 6pm theres been 0% packet loss. As I have been off work today I sat while all this packet loss was going on watching the snr figure reported by my router. At no time did it drop below 4db and most of the time hovered at 6-7db. It seems the packet loss is not caused by noise on the line else im pretty sure the snr will drop or even go negative. With snr of 4 I can happily get a stable 3.5M connection. This was proved last night and over the weekend. So it seems something else is causing this. Im now on max supposedly so I will let the training period run its course then see how things are. If this packet loss doesnt clear up then im gonna be mighty unhappy.
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Also my stablerate is still showing 8k. When will this be changed to show im on max and reflect the BRAS profile Ive been set to correctly?
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icmp pings are a really bad way to test for a bad connection. Many routers will start to purposely dispose of low priority data at busy times. ICMP os classed a low priority. Hence all you pings and traceroutes could be showing you all kinds of horribleness whilst the normal tcp or udp based connections work fine. Also your overlooking the fact that PN ellcoyas could be doing this deliberately as well.

With regards to tiscalis network, They provide no ip transport to PN so its impossble for their network to cause you any packet loss. The traffic that passes over their interconnect between the two is l2tp