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Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

430
Grafter
Posts: 125
Thanks: 1
Registered: 06-08-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Is there a way of escalating a support problem to someone who can actually read and write in coherent and non-technical English?

I've been trying for 6 weeks now to make progress with the sudden drop in speed since this rate adaptive thing was introduced. In a nutshell, I used to see a consistent 4.5MBPS (Modem) and now its 3.5MBPS (Modem), both peak times.

BT have confirmed my line will support 5MBPS. Plus Net support have effectively accused me of being a liar by saying BT dont talk to the public.

PN blame BT for restricting my line to 2MBPS.

One PN suport person says that if I revert to a fixed IP product (whatever that is) I will get back to my original speed of 4.5MPS.

Another PN supprt person says that is not possible.

I asked to be put in touch with someone senior because I wished to make a complaint about a member of support. That was some weeks ago and I've heard nothing.

Frankly, Support is not what they are doing.

So, any suggestions for a better ISP, and while I'm looking, any suggestions as to how I can get someone to really help me? :x
41 REPLIES
N/A

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

I'm looking at Zen Internet.

And I can fully sympathize with your predicament.

I just feel that the customer isn't believed and that the support team only ever take a narrow view of what their reports say to decide on the action to be taken.

In my current fault ticket I feel as if most of what I have written hasn't even been read.

Steve
N/A

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Quote
In my current fault ticket I feel as if most of what I have written hasn't even been read.


I get that feeling too with the tickets I've raised.

Also, the ticket gets 'answered' without the rep reading back through the ticket, or looking at case history.

I feel if reps took a bit of time over each ticket they'd avoid the inevitable ping pong that occurs, and probably resolve issues much more quickly. But I realise they are probably driven by the goal to turn tickets around to get the response times down.

Sorry to highjack your thread bigwedge. Shockedops: I needed to get that off of my chest.
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 12,169
Thanks: 18
Fixes: 1
Registered: 04-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Hi,

Looking at the line speed history for your line from BT it's fluctuating a lot between about 2.5Mbps and 3Mbps. This is the way that DSLMax works and has done since it rolled out just over a year ago. The line will sync at the fastest speed it will support based on a number of conditions.

Chances are that at some point the line has been unstable and the BT systems have picked up on this and decreased the speed in order to improve the stability.

When your line was first upgraded to Max in May last year the speed history shows that the sync speed fluctuated between about 4 and 5Mbps with the odd drop to 3Mbps.

I would guess that the instability was seen in May this year as that's when it started to fluctuate between 2.5Mbps and 3.5Mbps. Chances are that the line has been fairly unstable all the time because of the number of changes in the speed over the last year, particularly with the occassional drops to 3Mbps and the result is that to stop that instability the BT systems have decreased the speed.

Now we can raise it as a fault with BT to increase the speed again I would strongly advise against it because chances are it will just cause the line to be unstable.

On Max, unless it's a really short line, there's a trade off of stability versus speed. The faster the speed the more unstable the line. Plus things can change over time, a line can deteriorate or other factors can cause more "noise" which will cause a lower speed or just something like the weather can be a factor. In some cases wet weather may cause a lower sync speed or just a change in temperature.
430
Grafter
Posts: 125
Thanks: 1
Registered: 06-08-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

The WEATHER!!! HA HA HA.

I may not be a techie, but don't treat me like a Link:censored BT say my line will support 5MBPS - you seem to know better than your bosses. Perhaps you're in the wrong job.

Moderators note by John (johnessex) Full quote of preceding post removed as per the Link:rules

Attempt to bypass swear filter removed
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 12,169
Thanks: 18
Fixes: 1
Registered: 04-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

The 5Mbps figure you've been quoted is just an estimate based on a guess of how long your line is. These estimates aren't always accurate in the real world and in the real world things change and things cause interference.

When the line was first maxed it did support 5Mbps but from the speed history it looks like it wasn't stable at 5Mbps so the BT systems have reduced the speed to improve that stability.

As I say, that's how Max works, it adapts to the best speed but it it's unstable it will reduce the speed to stay stable.
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,983
Thanks: 8
Registered: 10-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Quote

As I say, that's how Max works, it adapts to the best speed but it it's unstable it will reduce the speed to stay stable.


I can verify that.
When I was first maxed my line used to try and run at 7616Bb but it was unstable and I used to suffer a lot of disconnects.
It has now been reduced by the system to the 6Mb mark and is now a lot more stable.
Neil_A
Grafter
Posts: 450
Registered: 04-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Quote
The WEATHER!!! HA HA HA.


It might be worth your while doing a search of this online as you'll find there are actually plenty of very valid reasons why the weather (temperature, water vapour and atmospheric pressure) can all have significant effects on radio signals over copper cable. Electrical storms and heavy summer rains cause broadband chaos every year. It sounds ridiculous but it's true - ask your local physicist.

Likewise every Christmas decorative lights play havoc with customers' broadband and customers thing we're fobbing them off when we say it might be their fairy lights...
damianoneill
Dabbler
Posts: 10
Registered: 04-08-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

I bet they feel even more fobbed off when you sign off as "Neil Armstrong" !!!
Plusnet Help Team
Plusnet Help Team
Posts: 17,626
Thanks: 611
Fixes: 158
Registered: 05-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Hi bigwedge,

I've taken control of your ticket and will give you a call this afternoon to try to help with this matter.
If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Chris Parr
 Plusnet Help Team
430
Grafter
Posts: 125
Thanks: 1
Registered: 06-08-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

If you care to let me have your number, I'll call you, but I'm not hanging on to the support line for 30 minutes, and I refuse to play support message ping pong any more. Suffice to say, you've just trotted out the same stuff as your colleagues, without bothering to read what I've written.

And you've completely ignored my point about wishing to make a complaint against one of your support staff. Are yiu hoping I will shut up and go away if you ignore me?





Moderators' Note by Rogerloxton: Full quote of preceeding post removed as it's against the link:rules
Community Veteran
Posts: 1,886
Registered: 05-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

I can see where this is going and I don't like it....

bigwedge, whilst you may have a grievance against one of PN's staff, there are other members of staff that are trying to assist you - however, at the moment, you are becoming more and more aggressive within the forum, which you must understand is not a official support method.

Please calm down, take a deep breath and let people help you.
If you continue to take this tone, people will not help you at all.
Even if you move to another ISP, chances are that the fault will move with you.

What's more, Chris has offered to call you, so you would not be put on hold listening to music etc etc, therefore you would not be incurring any phone charges.

Again, please calm down, or I shall be forced to lock threads..


Your call.....

Roger.
Plusnet Help Team
Plusnet Help Team
Posts: 17,626
Thanks: 611
Fixes: 158
Registered: 05-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Hi bigwedge,

Yes my answer contains similar details to those of my colleagues, this is because the answer we are providing is the correct answer. I put alot more detail in there to help you understand how MaxDSL works.
As Roger states these forums are not an official support means, we will always try to help customers as much as we can however as far as I can see you have been given the correct advise a number of times already and I can only reiterate this.

As advised on the answer phone message I left for you I will attempt to call you again, however there is a large amount of information on how MaxDSL works in the text I have provided below.
Hopefully this will help understand how MaxDSL works and why speeds cannot be guaranteed by any ISP.

The first and most fundamental point is that upto 8Mbps means just that. It is not guaranteed. Broadband is extremely dependant on your distance from your local telephone exchange. This is true for signal issues and in extreme cases may result in receiving a Broadband service impossible. Maximum obtainable speeds are dependant on this also. The further you are from the exchange, the poorer quality a Broadband signal you will be able to receive from said exchange.

One of the most useful tools available to our customers is the BT Speedtester, which gives a reasonable amount of information about the limitations applied to the Broadband connection from a speed perspective. It is still somewhat in its infancy so can be a little unreliable at busy times of the day.

After running the speedtest you are presented with four main pieces of information. Your upstream and downstream synchronisation speeds (this is the speed at which your modem or router is connecting with the BT Exchange), your IP Profile and your actual throughput speed as recorded by the test. For the majority of speed faults, the upstream synchronisation speed can practically be ignored, unless it reports speeds significantly below 448Kbps. The IP Profile is the speed at which BT Wholesale have restricted your connection to, as they believe that this is the fastest speed that you can receive whilst also receiving a stable connection. The IP Profile is the maximum speed that you will be able to get in a speed test.

The downstream synchronisation speed is extremely important. This is the speed at which BT Wholesale use to calculate your IP Profile. We have a table on our website which shows you’re the relevant synchronisation speeds versus the appropriate IP Profile speeds, which you can find here:-
http://www.plus.net/support/broadband/products/faqs_and_guides/dslmax_guide.shtml#Sync

Unfortunately the IP Profile is not updated on a real time basis. BT take your lowest downstream synchronisation speed (hence the importance of this as I mentioned earlier) over a three day period and then assign the appropriate IP Profile. Here’s where the problems can occur. Downstream line synchronisation can and does fluctuate.

If your modem or router does drop synchronisation and it regains synchronisation at a lower level, then BT will change your IP Profile speed to reflect this change in reported synchronisation speed within 75 minutes.

There are various factors that can cause line synchronisation to drop and fluctuate. Most commonly these factors can relate to faulty filtering, a suspect modem or router or poor internal wiring. The best setup for any Broadband connection is always to have your modem or router connected into a filter and then for your filter to be connected to your master socket, which is normally the first socket into your house from your road. It is also imperative that every used phone socket in your house has a filter attached, as failure to do this can cause interference between the analogue (normal voice phone) and digital (Broadband) signals. There are also additional factors that can come into play such as poor weather, exchange and line related problems and even things like street lights and central heating.

The speed quoted on the BT retail website advising on the speed you can receive is purely an estimate based on the distance you are from the exchange, this will vary depending on the physical condition of the line.

Taken from this blog by James.
If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Chris Parr
 Plusnet Help Team
430
Grafter
Posts: 125
Thanks: 1
Registered: 06-08-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Quote
lots of stuff


Still waiting for your phone number so that I can call you.....

In the meantime, you have neatly avoided answering several points which I raised: I wish to make a complaint against a PN support person; why have PN staff contradicted each other in their statements to me?; how, then, do I know that what you say is accurate?; Why do you insist on referring to BT as if they were some third party? As far as I'm aware PN is a sub., so stop trying to shift the blame for problems onto them - you are all the same group;

If I've understood correctly, even though I used to see 4.5MBPS, which is now down to 3.3MBPS, the speed would need to drop to below 0.5MBPS before anyone considers a problem exists?

At precisley what date did I go onto this rate adaptive product please?
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 12,169
Thanks: 18
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Registered: 04-04-2007

Lack of "Support" and making a complaint

Quote
Still waiting for your phone number so that I can call you.....


The numbers for the support team are at the bottom of the page.

Quote
In the meantime, you have neatly avoided answering several points which I raised: I wish to make a complaint against a PN support person;


Details of how to make a complainst are listed here:

http://www.plus.net/support/customer_service/contact_us/code_of_practice.shtml

Quote
why have PN staff contradicted each other in their statements to me?; how, then, do I know that what you say is accurate?;


I'm not sure what contradictions you're talking about but if you want to be specific I'm happy to look. The answers that Chris has given to you are completely correct.


Quote
Why do you insist on referring to BT as if they were some third party?


Because BT Wholesale is a third party, as is BT Openreach.

Quote
As far as I'm aware PN is a sub., so stop trying to shift the blame for problems onto them - you are all the same group;


PlusNet is owned by BT Retail which is completely seperate to BT Wholesale and Openreach. Whilst they are all part of the BT group they are all seperate entities. Our relationship with BT Wholesale is no different to that of any other ISP in the UK.

Quote
If I've understood correctly, even though I used to see 4.5MBPS, which is now down to 3.3MBPS, the speed would need to drop to below 0.5MBPS before anyone considers a problem exists?


This is correct. Speeds on Max will fluctuate all the time and there is a figure know as the fault threshold rate which determines when a speed change is within normal fluctuations and when it is a fault.

Quote
At precisley what date did I go onto this rate adaptive product please?


Give or take a day or so 12th May last year.