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BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

pawhe955
Grafter
Posts: 106
Registered: 31-07-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

Just read this on the contention explanation page:
Quote
PlusNet network contention and the BT contention ratio are different, but both apply to your connection. PlusNet network contention is the maximum contention you will experience on our broadband network, which helps you choose the most appropriate product. The BT contention ratio describes how many other broadband users you share with at your local telephone exchange.

Being on BB PAYG, I'm therefore on 30:1 contention. That's 30:1 PlusNet contention - and there is another statement above the PlusNet table graphic that states:
Quote
The table below shows the maximum level of network contention for all PlusNet broadband products.

So a couple of questions spring to mind:

1/ Can I/how do I find out what the BT contention ratio is, for my exchange?

2/ Given the 2nd quote above, do PlusNet therefore guarantee (somehow backed off via BT), that the BT contention ration will not exceed the 30:1, as it is stated that the quoted ratio for the product is a maximum....??

Thanks,

--
pawhe
16 REPLIES
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

The BT contention on our home products is 50:1. 30:1 is across our network and the BT centrals.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

Forget what PlusNet say about contention, its just spin.

The products that BT offer to all ISP's at present are 20:1 and 50:1.

BT are well within their rights at some point in the future to enforce this contention. This will mean that your connection is contended with 50 other users "depending on your product" before it even gets onto the PlusNet network.
So as you see Plusnet offering 30:1 means sweet FA. They could offer 1:1 on their network but the 50:1 that BT can impose is the limiting factor.
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

That would be true if BT didn't overprovide on their network. We have had several users who have used their connection as a 1:1 connection by downloading well in excess of 500GB in a month on a 2MB connection.

If the BT contention was really provided at 50:1 this level of usage would not be possible.

With the introduction of Capacity Based Charging BT have shifted the emphasis away from the exchanges and more to the ISPs.

Also, the 30:1 we quote as our contention is across both our network and the Central Ppes we get from BT. Many other providers don't include these when talking about network contention.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

If you are going to give more spin at the very least I think you should read what I said

"BT are well within their rights at some point in the future to enforce this contention"

You are talking about the present whereas I clearly wrote about what could happen in the future if more and more people sign up to broadband.

As neither of us are telepathic then neither of us can say what will happen in the future with any authority, hence my above statement inferring that BT could do this so making your 30:1 meaningless.
Metalguru
Grafter
Posts: 791
Registered: 04-08-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

They have great difficulty creating clear policy and T&C's . So it is perhaps understandable that they sometimes misunderstand postings on here.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

Quote
That would be true if BT didn't overprovide on their network.

With the introduction of Capacity Based Charging BT have shifted the emphasis away from the exchanges and more to the ISPs.




Then why the hell when I rang up support did they tell me I would see a better service staying on 20:1?
Because of what they told me I stayed on 20:1 and pay an extra £10 for it.
Are you now saying that it is pointless me paying this?

If you are telling the truth then I was misinformed by support when they described the 20:1 product. They told me that my speeds would not be affected as much at busy times and my service would be much faster than the 50:1 product because I would be in contention with 20 less users. Is this not true?

If Support were telling the truth then what YOU have posted in this thread is misleading at the very least!

So what is the answer Ben?

If BT's contention plays no part at all any more “as you imply” then I was miss sold the product that I am on and Plusnet legally have to place me on a suitable product and refund any money that they have taken from me.

If BT’s contention does play a part in peoples download speeds then PlusNet legally owe me nothing as I am on the correct product that was sold to me with the correct description. The trouble with this scenario is the fact that your posts in this thread are untrue and support were correct.

Bit of a pickle here Ben, don’t you think?

If you are telling the truth and support acted wrongly and it will effect PlusNet "your employer" financially.

If support are telling the truth then you acted wrongly by misleading people with more spin but it will not effect PlusNet "your employer" financially.
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

It's not pointless being on 20:1, If your exchange ever does get too busy then you will be better off than people on 50:1.

It won't be much faster than 50:1 unless the exchange is busy however, but it is true that the contention is lower.

This does not mean however that the Plusnet contention is meaningless, being on different contentions across our network and the centrals will influence the performance of your connection.

I didn't say that BT doesn't play any part at all in contention, however ISPs now have a much greater role in this since Capacity Based Charging was introduced.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

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It's not pointless being on 20:1, If your exchange ever does get too busy then you will be better off than people on 50:1.



Thank you for clearing that up by agreeing with what I said at the start.
Quote

"Forget what PlusNet say about contention, its just spin.

The products that BT offer to all ISP's at present are 20:1 and 50:1.

BT are well within their rights at some point in the future to enforce this contention. This will mean that your connection is contended with 50 other users "depending on your product" before it even gets onto the PlusNet network.
So as you see Plusnet offering 30:1 means sweet FA. They could offer 1:1 on their network but the 50:1 that BT can impose is the limiting factor.


I think the OP would have been less confused if you had agreed with me in your fist post instead of posting the usual spin.
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

To an extent, however the 30:1 contention we state does not mean "sweet FA", it does influence the performance of the connection.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

Here we go again, spin, spin, spin.
Quote

It's not pointless being on 20:1, If your exchange ever does get too busy then you will be better off than people on 50:1.

But if YOUR above statement happens then your last statement "below" is meaningless as the deciding factor of your speed is going to be the slowest link ie. the 50:1 BT contention and not the 30:1 PlusNet contention!
Quote
To an extent, however the 30:1 contention we state does not mean "sweet FA", it does influence the performance of the connection.


So now to the OP's questions

Quote

1/ Can I/how do I find out what the BT contention ratio is, for my exchange?

You cannot get an exact figure from BT but you can go here and get an idea on how your exchange is performing http://usertools.plus.net/exchanges/

Quote
2/ Given the 2nd quote above, do PlusNet therefore guarantee (somehow backed off via BT), that the BT contention ration will not exceed the 30:1, as it is stated that the quoted ratio for the product is a maximum....??

PlusNet CANNOT guarantee that your connection will never be contended at 50:1.
If you go to the link I gave above just take a look at any exchange that is showing as red or amber in the list on the right. Most of these state either

"BT are reporting that port capacity for Office IPStream (20:1 contention) products is currently low.
BT have provided no ETA for the installation of additional capacity."

or

BT are reporting that port capacity for Home IPStream (50:1 contention) products is currently low.
BT have provided no ETA for the installation of additional capacity."

Do you think that the people on these exchanges would see a benefit of PlusNets 30:1 contention?
I think not.
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

They would see a benefit of 30:1 Plusnet contention over 50:1 Plusnet contention however.
N/A

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

And the spin goes on.
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They would see a benefit of 30:1 Plusnet contention over 50:1 Plusnet contention however.


I could counter the above stupid statement with

"They would see more of a benefit of 1:1 PlusNet contention over PlusNet 30:1 contention however. But sadly PlusNet do not offer this"

See how stupid your spin is now getting Ben?
Ben_Brown
Grafter
Posts: 2,839
Registered: 13-06-2007

BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

This isn't spin, I'm just saying what happens.
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BT contention vs PlusNet contention..??

The "best thing since sliced bread" FUP is announced with a fanfare and then quickly withdrawn with a whimper before its rollout

P2P is throttled on premier products and is not admitted to till two weeks after it started.

Customers are wrongly promised emails that will inform the customer base of changes to the pricing of the products they are on.

Customers are placed on the wrong profile meaning they are over throttled.

Premier products are changed with the introduction of the SUP

Customers are throttled before even getting an email "as stated in the SUP" informing them that they must change their download habits.

PlusNet sell a product that is not yet available to customers that may not be able to get it.

Support and you said there is no difference at present between the 2meg, 4meg and 8meg products. Then when you realised that these customers paying more may not be able to get the product you are at present charging them for you come up with a better allowance for them under the SUP.

etc.....etc......

This isn't spin either Ben, I'm just saying what happens.